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Thread: "Exec" Duties

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    Default "Exec" Duties

    Pulling an Airman (officer or enlisted) out of the CAFSC to perform duties as an sq, gp, wg, & command chief exec flies directly against AFI 36-2101 (Classifying Military Personnel (Officer and Enlisted)) para 3.34. The MPS may authorize this for up to 130 days in a 12 month period.

    We all see it happen all the time.."career broadening"...for up to a year. A member taken out of hide (still reported against the unit UPMR), taken out of their AFSC (what they were recruited, trained and paid to do). Career broadening defined as DTS travel agent, note taker, phone & email answerer, protocol arranger ("Col X likes Diet Dr Pepper with 2 ice cubes in a glass (not plastic!) tumbler), dog walker, etc.

    If it is truly a position (according to AF manpower agency), then make a Special Duty Identifier, fund a billet and make it right. Kind of hard to fight manpower battles when blatant disregard to AFIs is accepted as the "norm" by commanders at so many levels.
    "Never force a fart in Djibouti"..."Always marry your second wife first"..."If anyone says that you're not a team player, maybe they're on the wrong team"..."You can gold plate a turd and it's still a turd"

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    Default Re: "Exec" Duties

    Quote Originally Posted by Chief_KO View Post
    Pulling an Airman (officer or enlisted) out of the CAFSC to perform duties as an sq, gp, wg, & command chief exec flies directly against AFI 36-2101 (Classifying Military Personnel (Officer and Enlisted)) para 3.34. The MPS may authorize this for up to 130 days in a 12 month period.

    We all see it happen all the time.."career broadening"...for up to a year. A member taken out of hide (still reported against the unit UPMR), taken out of their AFSC (what they were recruited, trained and paid to do). Career broadening defined as DTS travel agent, note taker, phone & email answerer, protocol arranger ("Col X likes Diet Dr Pepper with 2 ice cubes in a glass (not plastic!) tumbler), dog walker, etc.

    If it is truly a position (according to AF manpower agency), then make a Special Duty Identifier, fund a billet and make it right. Kind of hard to fight manpower battles when blatant disregard to AFIs is accepted as the "norm" by commanders at so many levels.
    I wonder how many unfunded "out of hide" civil servant or contractor positions there are. I'm guessing zero.

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    Default Re: "Exec" Duties

    Quote Originally Posted by Chief_KO View Post
    Pulling an Airman (officer or enlisted) out of the CAFSC to perform duties as an sq, gp, wg, & command chief exec flies directly against AFI 36-2101 (Classifying Military Personnel (Officer and Enlisted)) para 3.34. The MPS may authorize this for up to 130 days in a 12 month period.

    We all see it happen all the time.."career broadening"...for up to a year. A member taken out of hide (still reported against the unit UPMR), taken out of their AFSC (what they were recruited, trained and paid to do). Career broadening defined as DTS travel agent, note taker, phone & email answerer, protocol arranger ("Col X likes Diet Dr Pepper with 2 ice cubes in a glass (not plastic!) tumbler), dog walker, etc.

    If it is truly a position (according to AF manpower agency), then make a Special Duty Identifier, fund a billet and make it right. Kind of hard to fight manpower battles when blatant disregard to AFIs is accepted as the "norm" by commanders at so many levels.
    I wonder how many unfunded "out of hide" civil servant or contractor positions there are. I'm guessing zero.

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    Default Re: "Exec" Duties

    Quote Originally Posted by Chief_KO View Post
    Pulling an Airman (officer or enlisted) out of the CAFSC to perform duties as an sq, gp, wg, & command chief exec flies directly against AFI 36-2101 (Classifying Military Personnel (Officer and Enlisted)) para 3.34. The MPS may authorize this for up to 130 days in a 12 month period.

    We all see it happen all the time.."career broadening"...for up to a year. A member taken out of hide (still reported against the unit UPMR), taken out of their AFSC (what they were recruited, trained and paid to do). Career broadening defined as DTS travel agent, note taker, phone & email answerer, protocol arranger ("Col X likes Diet Dr Pepper with 2 ice cubes in a glass (not plastic!) tumbler), dog walker, etc.

    If it is truly a position (according to AF manpower agency), then make a Special Duty Identifier, fund a billet and make it right. Kind of hard to fight manpower battles when blatant disregard to AFIs is accepted as the "norm" by commanders at so many levels.
    I understand what you are saying here but this post misses one important point. How will the "additional duty" be handled if someone is not pulled from their AFSC to handle it? Let us look at the DTS Travel agent role. How did the role come about? Is the position really needed or is it a question of someone creating a job? If the person goes away who does the responsibility fall to?

    1. How did the role come about?-DTS people within the unit came about when Finance began pushing their responsibility back to the unit level.
    2. Is the position needed?-Yes and no. DTS was intended to be a user friendly system where the traveler computes the voucher and then the commander or resource advisor approves it. The DTS people within the unit came about because people started adding unnecessary authorizations into the routing chain. To fix this problem just edit the routing list where they go from traveler, to resource advisor, to commander. No one else should be involved and under no circumstances should commanders have other people creating their vouchers and doing their job for them.
    3. If the job goes away where does the responsibility go?- It goes back to the proper AFSC responsible for that function. As in the person who was trained on how to do the job properly.

    Basically, I just used the DTS example to make one key point. Along with eliminating "exec positions" we need to force the AFSCs to take back their duties. If you are the unit finance guy (resource advisor) you should be approving the vouchers. If your AFSC is safety you should be handling those duties instead someone tasked as an additional duty. If unit deployment manager is a legit job make it an AFSC. The biggest offenders in this have always been people from customer service organizations. I know this because I worked in finance and it really frustrated me how much we were asking of our customers. The same can cleary be said of Personnel as well. In order to correct the problem we need to give back duties to the AFSC they belong to.

    In exchange for accepting my primary duties back I would also ask that you take yours back. During my career I was an ammo account custodian, security forces augmentee, self aid and buddy care instructor, and equipment custodian. I do not expect to be doing any of those things as they are not finance related. I will be busy computing your travel voucher while you teach the self aid and buddy care class. I am much faster at working the voucher and you are probably a better instructor than me. Let us all agree to quit passing the buck just because everyone else is doing it.

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    Default Re: "Exec" Duties

    Quote Originally Posted by Chief_KO View Post
    Pulling an Airman (officer or enlisted) out of the CAFSC to perform duties as an sq, gp, wg, & command chief exec flies directly against AFI 36-2101 (Classifying Military Personnel (Officer and Enlisted)) para 3.34. The MPS may authorize this for up to 130 days in a 12 month period.

    We all see it happen all the time.."career broadening"...for up to a year. A member taken out of hide (still reported against the unit UPMR), taken out of their AFSC (what they were recruited, trained and paid to do). Career broadening defined as DTS travel agent, note taker, phone & email answerer, protocol arranger ("Col X likes Diet Dr Pepper with 2 ice cubes in a glass (not plastic!) tumbler), dog walker, etc.

    If it is truly a position (according to AF manpower agency), then make a Special Duty Identifier, fund a billet and make it right. Kind of hard to fight manpower battles when blatant disregard to AFIs is accepted as the "norm" by commanders at so many levels.
    I think you meant 3.34.1.1. (applies to MPS only) and if you kept reading (all the way to 3.34.3.1.) you would see that AFPC can approve assignments over 130 days...
    “I say, imagine in your private life, if you decided that I’m not going to pay my mortgage for a month or two—first of all you’re not saving money by not paying your mortgage. You’re just a dead beat. “

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    Default Re: "Exec" Duties

    Quote Originally Posted by GodFather View Post
    Many of them went on to
    Command Chiefs.
    I'm sure they are out there but I have never met a Chief that was a Command Chief's exec. I've met a ton of them that aspired to be, and few of them were STEP'd but they seem to have got sorted out by the E8/9 board. Weirdly, many of them were coddled, protected or cared for by the CCM. That does not translate well back at the ranch.

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    Default Re: "Exec" Duties

    Quote Originally Posted by SomeRandomGuy View Post
    I understand what you are saying here but this post misses one important point. How will the "additional duty" be handled if someone is not pulled from their AFSC to handle it? Let us look at the DTS Travel agent role. How did the role come about? Is the position really needed or is it a question of someone creating a job? If the person goes away who does the responsibility fall to?

    1. How did the role come about?-DTS people within the unit came about when Finance began pushing their responsibility back to the unit level.
    2. Is the position needed?-Yes and no. DTS was intended to be a user friendly system where the traveler computes the voucher and then the commander or resource advisor approves it. The DTS people within the unit came about because people started adding unnecessary authorizations into the routing chain. To fix this problem just edit the routing list where they go from traveler, to resource advisor, to commander. No one else should be involved and under no circumstances should commanders have other people creating their vouchers and doing their job for them.
    3. If the job goes away where does the responsibility go?- It goes back to the proper AFSC responsible for that function. As in the person who was trained on how to do the job properly.

    Basically, I just used the DTS example to make one key point. Along with eliminating "exec positions" we need to force the AFSCs to take back their duties. If you are the unit finance guy (resource advisor) you should be approving the vouchers. If your AFSC is safety you should be handling those duties instead someone tasked as an additional duty. If unit deployment manager is a legit job make it an AFSC. The biggest offenders in this have always been people from customer service organizations. I know this because I worked in finance and it really frustrated me how much we were asking of our customers. The same can cleary be said of Personnel as well. In order to correct the problem we need to give back duties to the AFSC they belong to.

    In exchange for accepting my primary duties back I would also ask that you take yours back. During my career I was an ammo account custodian, security forces augmentee, self aid and buddy care instructor, and equipment custodian. I do not expect to be doing any of those things as they are not finance related. I will be busy computing your travel voucher while you teach the self aid and buddy care class. I am much faster at working the voucher and you are probably a better instructor than me. Let us all agree to quit passing the buck just because everyone else is doing it.
    The root of the problem is highlighted. All the tools we now have are designed for the member (ALL MEMBERS) to do it for themselves. The problem with the tools are that they were designed by the people (AFSC) that is most familiar with the job...not with a user-friendly concept in mind.
    The problem only gets worse when each echelon of command (and I include chiefs (lower case intentional) and others) does not do it themselves and has no idea of the problems and time involved with those various tools. When I was still AD I did my own DTS, and was dissapointed to hear that my peers were being "taken care of".
    "Never force a fart in Djibouti"..."Always marry your second wife first"..."If anyone says that you're not a team player, maybe they're on the wrong team"..."You can gold plate a turd and it's still a turd"

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    Default Re: "Exec" Duties

    Quote Originally Posted by Pullinteeth View Post
    I think you meant 3.34.1.1. (applies to MPS only) and if you kept reading (all the way to 3.34.3.1.) you would see that AFPC can approve assignments over 130 days...
    Yes, I am including the sub-paragraphs as part of the main. Good luck with anyone asking for (and getting) MPS & AFPC approval...it never happens (in my experience).
    "Never force a fart in Djibouti"..."Always marry your second wife first"..."If anyone says that you're not a team player, maybe they're on the wrong team"..."You can gold plate a turd and it's still a turd"

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    Default Re: "Exec" Duties

    I have to admit I've had a chance to meet some of these execs, some very fine young ladies..

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    Default Re: "Exec" Duties

    Additional Duties, On-loan personnel, to support Gp/Wg anything is a necessary evil. Never going to go away. Never will be funded positions. Squadrons will always pay the manning price and be shorthanded for those selected to do the job.

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