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Thread: Military Mantras I hate.

  1. #11
    Senior Member Bos Mutus's Avatar
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    "Don't gripe/bitch/complain unless you are also bringing the solution"
    Some variation of this is often used by NCOs and SNCOs...a lot of times it's part of your initial introduction to a work center.

    It's intended to keep nonproductive whining/complaining to a minimum...but, I dislike it because, if followed, it also ensures only easy problems get brought to your attention.

    Hard problems that the person does not have the answer to, but knows its a problem, should be brought up, too...and leaders should want to know about them.
    The Voice of Reason

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mjölnir View Post
    Generally the tipping point is the 'reasonable person standard'. If a 'reasonable person' would perceive the action as wrong/inappropriate ... that is when there is a problem. Every wallflower with heightened sensitivities is not immediately catered to. Admittedly, some people take it too far, by and large that is not the case.
    That is how its SUPPOSED to work, however all too often i have seen it taken to that extreme.. Such as one case where ONE person complained about music played by another in the office, and when the one complained against found out they made a claim of an "unfit workplace" to the command's EO office.. That person was then reassigned.. All cause someone didn't like him complaining about the musical choice of another...

  3. #13
    Senior Member Rusty Jones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SomeRandomGuy View Post
    Whomever came up with "Do more with less" is an idiot of epic proportions.
    I don't think that anyone uses this mantra in the serious sense. The people who are actually stuck "doing more with less" because of budget or personnel cuts are the ones who use the phrase to express their frustration with the situation that they find themselves in.
    "Well... Uber's going to "driverless" cars soon, and their research probably shows that they're a natural fit (when it comes to getting paid for doing nothing)."
    -Rainmaker, referencing black males

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    Senior Member Rusty Jones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by garhkal View Post
    And IMO that's why it sucks. you don't NEED to be doing wrong, to be thought of as being wrong. Just someone falsely having the perception of you doing wrong, is all that's needed these days to get in trouble it seems. AND OFTEN even if you PROVE that you are NOT wrong, that's it.. NO 'oops, sorry". No "guess we need to re-educate the one who had the false perception"...
    To me, it wasn't even that. I remember my first duty station: shore duty in Groton. I don't remember exactly what it was that I was perceived to be doing, but someone - who was senior to me - saw it, and decided to tell my LPO. I then, of course, get pulled aside by the LPO who then tells me about it. And, of course, because my LPO wasn't there to see for himself was going on and rank = credibility, my LPO believed the person who saw me, and wasn't interested in anything that I had to say.

    Whereas... if the person who saw me had come to me and spoken up, the confusion would have been cleared on the spot.

    Mind you, I had just gotten to my first duty station, and I was in that happy bright-eyed boot phase... this particular moment, right then and there, killed it. This was the single moment that the reality of military life slapped me in the face.
    Last edited by Rusty Jones; 12-15-2016 at 09:18 AM.
    "Well... Uber's going to "driverless" cars soon, and their research probably shows that they're a natural fit (when it comes to getting paid for doing nothing)."
    -Rainmaker, referencing black males

  5. #15
    Administrator Mjölnir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by garhkal View Post
    That is how its SUPPOSED to work, however all too often i have seen it taken to that extreme.. Such as one case where ONE person complained about music played by another in the office, and when the one complained against found out they made a claim of an "unfit workplace" to the command's EO office.. That person was then reassigned.. All cause someone didn't like him complaining about the musical choice of another...
    Any instance would be too often ... But I don't see this a majority of the time.

    In the case of the guy playing the music, there are a lot of variables that I (and you likely don't) know:

    What type of music was it?
    How loud was he playing it?
    Had he been asked to stop? If so, what was his reaction?
    Was the resolution done formally or informally?
    Did he agree to the realignment?
    If he fought it did he formally appeal it?
    If so, what what the determination of the appeal?

    For all these questions, you have his side of the story, what you know of the original complaint (which may not be accurate, and your perception of what the resolution was.

    I had an EO complaint in the command a few months ago, PO2 was counseled for wearing a skirt vice trousers in uniform. On its surface that is pretty cut and dry, the uniform skirt is an authorized optional uniform component for the uniform of the day. Peeling back the onion on the story a bit revealed that there was her side of the issue, the Alpos side, and the CPO & DIVO had a third version. I am sure that in their respective circles of friends and family the PO2 told people her side, which favored her, the LPO told her(yes, a second her) side and the CPO and DIVO told theirs.
    The most important six inches on the battlefield ... is between your ears.

  6. #16
    Administrator Mjölnir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rusty Jones View Post
    To me, it wasn't even that. I remember my first duty station: shore duty in Groton. I don't remember exactly what it was that I was perceived to be doing, but someone - who was senior to me - saw it, and decided to tell my LPO. I then, of course, get pulled aside by the LPO who then tells me about it. And, of course, because my LPO wasn't there to see for himself was going on and rank = credibility, my LPO believed the person who saw me, and wasn't interested in anything that I had to say.

    Whereas... if the person who saw me had come to me and spoken up, the confusion would have been cleared on the spot.

    Mind you, I had just gotten to my first duty station, and I was in that happy bright-eyed boot phase... this particular moment, right then and there, killed it. This was the single moment that the reality of military life slapped me in the face.
    One of the reasons I sometime miss the Marines, everyone is willing to approach you directly to tell you when you are thought to be fucked up.

    Your situation above does vex me, poor leadership discourages too many people from staying. That said we are all going to work for someone or many someone's who have their head up their ass. For the most part I have been fortunate to have worked for good leaders; but yeah ... In 25 years I have seen some promoted one or two times beyond their capability and it hurts those around them.

    My first duty station was Guantanamo Bay in the Ground Defense Secrity Force ... At the time I hated it. As a LCpl (E3) you lived in a four man room for E3 and below, worked a 2-2-2-80 schedule for a year ... And on your 80 hour break was not Liberty but a break from standing post ... you had training, admin, weapons and vehicle maintenance etc. I would have separated from the military had I not gotten a second tour to see that the entire USMC is not GTMO and that much of my perception of it was being 19 & 20, an E3 and only privy to my small part in the overall organization.

    I am glad now that I got that different perspective ... But had I had strings of bad experiences I likely would not look back.
    The most important six inches on the battlefield ... is between your ears.

  7. #17
    Administrator Mjölnir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rusty Jones View Post
    To me, it wasn't even that. I remember my first duty station: shore duty in Groton. I don't remember exactly what it was that I was perceived to be doing, but someone - who was senior to me - saw it, and decided to tell my LPO. I then, of course, get pulled aside by the LPO who then tells me about it. And, of course, because my LPO wasn't there to see for himself was going on and rank = credibility, my LPO believed the person who saw me, and wasn't interested in anything that I had to say.

    Whereas... if the person who saw me had come to me and spoken up, the confusion would have been cleared on the spot.

    Mind you, I had just gotten to my first duty station, and I was in that happy bright-eyed boot phase... this particular moment, right then and there, killed it. This was the single moment that the reality of military life slapped me in the face.
    One of the reasons I sometime miss the Marines, everyone is willing to approach you directly to tell you when you are thought to be fucked up.

    Your situation above does vex me, poor leadership discourages too many people from staying. That said we are all going to work for someone or many someone's who have their head up their ass. For the most part I have been fortunate to have worked for good leaders; but yeah ... In 25 years I have seen some promoted one or two times beyond their capability and it hurts those around them.

    My first duty station was Guantanamo Bay in the Ground Defense Secrity Force ... At the time I hated it. As a LCpl (E3) you lived in a four man room for E3 and below, worked a 2-2-2-80 schedule for a year ... And on your 80 hour break was not Liberty but a break from standing post ... you had training, admin, weapons and vehicle maintenance etc. I would have separated from the military had I not gotten a second tour to see that the entire USMC is not GTMO and that much of my perception of it was being 19 & 20, an E3 and only privy to my small part in the overall organization.

    I am glad now that I got that different perspective ... But had I had strings of bad experiences I likely would not look back.
    The most important six inches on the battlefield ... is between your ears.

  8. #18
    Senior Member WILDJOKER5's Avatar
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    Snitches get stiches.
    Progressivism; such great ideas, they need to force you to follow them.

    Socialism is for the people, not the socialist.

    Economic Left/Right: 7.38
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  9. #19
    Senior Member Bos Mutus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rusty Jones View Post
    I don't think that anyone uses this mantra in the serious sense. The people who are actually stuck "doing more with less" because of budget or personnel cuts are the ones who use the phrase to express their frustration with the situation that they find themselves in.
    People started using it cynically after years of leadership using it seriously.
    The Voice of Reason

  10. #20
    Senior Member Rusty Jones's Avatar
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    You get paid for 24 hours everyday, seven days a week.
    This is something that's usually said to someone being made to work a ridiculous amount of hours with no time off in the forseeable future.

    Not sure if it's meant to shut a complainer up, or if it's meant make a complainer think "Well, gee, now that you put it THAT way; I'm happy!"

    In any case, it's an insult to the intelligence of the person being told this. Especially since there are plenty of people in the military who have been salaried professionals prior to joining.

    This ain't Burger King; you can't have it your way.
    Just because it's old and corny as fuck.
    "Well... Uber's going to "driverless" cars soon, and their research probably shows that they're a natural fit (when it comes to getting paid for doing nothing)."
    -Rainmaker, referencing black males

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