Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 24

Thread: Is Uniformity Needed for All in Uniform?

  1. #1
    Senior Member Bos Mutus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Posts
    1,560
    Mentioned
    11 Post(s)

    Is Uniformity Needed for All in Uniform?


    —Brian Everstine10/13/2016

    The Air Force is thinking outside of the box and is considering relaxing its fitness standards for some career fields or changing its tattoo policy in an effort to broaden its recruiting pool. Lt. Gen. Gina Grosso, the service’s deputy chief of staff for manpower, said USAF needs to “think deliberately about how we value uniformity.” Standards across the entire force “scares a lot of people,” she said during an AFA-sponsored, Air Force event Wednesday in Arlington, Va. “Do I care what a cyber warrior weighs?” Grosso asked, adding if someone who works on cyber networks needs to focus as much on their mile and a half time. Similarly, does the Air Force need to enforce standards related to tattoos the same way now? “Do I care that someone has a flower on their arm?” Grosso said. Still, the service must make sure it doesn’t stray too far from the requirements it has had for decades. “We’re certainly going to need some people who are brawny, and we’re also going to need some people for their intellect as well,” she said.

    http://www.airforcemag.com/DRArchive...n-Uniform.aspx
    I think the AF is really struggling with the Cyber career fields....the average enlistee who comes in open general and gets assigned as a cyber warrior or whatever just isn't smart enough to keep up with the tech changes, etc.

    I've seen where the AF was considering bringing in trained cyber-guys as direct to E-6 or something also...kind of like band or something I guess.

    Now they are looking at lowering standards because they don't care how fat someone is if they can keep the Russians out of the Gen's email..?? Or is this just what the AF gets for recognizing and promoting image over job performance for the past so many years?
    The Voice of Reason

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Columbus, ohio
    Posts
    3,326
    Mentioned
    29 Post(s)
    Well many of us said they would eventually lower standards, cause of how unfit society is getting...

  3. #3
    Banned sandsjames's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    6,984
    Mentioned
    18 Post(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Bos Mutus View Post
    I think the AF is really struggling with the Cyber career fields....the average enlistee who comes in open general and gets assigned as a cyber warrior or whatever just isn't smart enough to keep up with the tech changes, etc.

    I've seen where the AF was considering bringing in trained cyber-guys as direct to E-6 or something also...kind of like band or something I guess.

    Now they are looking at lowering standards because they don't care how fat someone is if they can keep the Russians out of the Gen's email..?? Or is this just what the AF gets for recognizing and promoting image over job performance for the past so many years?
    I think that the only person who can legitimately respond to this question is PTGod, but I'll give it a shot.

    I'm all for it. I've been for it for years. There are certain jobs that don't require fitness. A job where your entire career is sitting at a desk 12 hours a day doesn't require you to run 1.5 miles. The cyber career fields are only one example. The AF has different categories for M4 qualification. If someone isn't required to shoot as often or as accurate as I am, they shouldn't be required to be as fit as I'm required to be. I thing this has been a long time coming and would fully support such a thing.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Bos Mutus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Posts
    1,560
    Mentioned
    11 Post(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by garhkal View Post
    Well many of us said they would eventually lower standards, cause of how unfit society is getting...
    "You don't go to war with the Army you want, you go to war with the Army you have." ~ Donald Rumsfeld
    The Voice of Reason

  5. #5
    Senior Member Rainmaker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    on a Marl Road
    Posts
    3,882
    Mentioned
    39 Post(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by garhkal View Post
    Well many of us said they would eventually lower standards, cause of how unfit society is getting...
    "Standards across the entire force “scares a lot of people"- Lt. Gen. Gina Grosso

    Pathetic.

    That the AF has been reduced to having to publically spin, the lowering of fitness and appearance standards (to accommodate these fat fucks) as "thinking outside the box", is just another symptom of the decline.
    Last edited by Rainmaker; 10-13-2016 at 09:36 PM.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Rainmaker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    on a Marl Road
    Posts
    3,882
    Mentioned
    39 Post(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Bos Mutus View Post
    "You don't go to war with the Army you want, you go to war with the Army you have." ~ Donald Rumsfeld
    A great quote, from the strategic genius, who tirelessly worked alongside Paul Shlomo Wolfowitz to bring us the Iraq war!
    Last edited by Rainmaker; 10-13-2016 at 09:37 PM.

  7. #7
    Administrator Mjölnir's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2000
    Location
    Norfolk, VA
    Posts
    2,964
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Overall I don't like the idea, I think there should be a standard across the service as a baseline. Granted, the USMC fitness standard would likely be higher than the one for the USN or USAF ... but I think one common baseline is a good thing. Specific for fitness, everything I have ever read shows that a basic level of physical fitness means people get sick & injured less ... which means they are working more. From a management perspective ... it is a really cheap way to save health care $$$ and get more productivity. Subjectively, when I have been working extended & rotating shifts either on deployment or on a watchfloor, the people who were the most attentive etc. were the ones who weren't sloths; no need to be a PT stud ... but the stereotypical overweight and out of shape folks generally had the harder time maintaining the battle rhythm. While not everyone is going to be serving in combat or on a front line ... take AUAB as an example. If something happened and people need to run to the bomb shelter, or buddy assist in getting people out of an area ... basic physical fitness is a core/basic military thing ...

    This begs the question, is the basic standard for the USAF too high? I don't think so, but for an across the board / service-wide standard that covers most of the needs of the USAF ... maybe it is.

    Specific to cyber, this issue has spawned a lot of talk about if the need to establish a separate branch of service for cyber is needed. For DirNSA and CYBERCOM Commander (GEN Alexander - Army) was a supporter of the idea, current DirNSA (ADM Rogers - USN) is not. The people with those skill sets (especially most of the really ... REALLY good ones), are not the typical 'military' type. It is what it is. The need to recruit people with cyber skills spawned the Navy to ask for a waiver to law to allow direct accessions up to E7 in the enlisted ranks and O6 for officers. Most with those skills don't want to start as an E3 or O1 ...
    The most important six inches on the battlefield ... is between your ears.

  8. #8
    Administrator Mjölnir's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2000
    Location
    Norfolk, VA
    Posts
    2,964
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Rainmaker View Post
    A great quote, from the strategic genius, who tirelessly worked alongside Paul Shlomo Wolfowitz to bring us the Iraq war!
    Am overall not a fan of Secretary Rumsfeld ... but the quote was and is appropriate. If you can 'control when, where, who and how you fight, great. Some times we have to fight when we don't want to, where we don't want to and with what we have on hand. Unfortunately the adversary gets a vote on when they are going to require a solid dose of freedom

    As a military overall, we are actually really good at that, doing the best with what the situation dictates to us ... if we wait until the situation or we are totally perfect ... we may be too late.

    The most important six inches on the battlefield ... is between your ears.

  9. #9
    Banned sandsjames's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    6,984
    Mentioned
    18 Post(s)
    How 'bout we just go back to the pre-2004 standards? It was good enough for the greatest AF in the world for more than 55 years...all non-combat Airmen know how much BS the current standards are anyway.

    Damn I wish PT God were here.

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    965
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Mjölnir View Post
    Am overall not a fan of Secretary Rumsfeld ... but the quote was and is appropriate. If you can 'control when, where, who and how you fight, great. Some times we have to fight when we don't want to, where we don't want to and with what we have on hand. Unfortunately the adversary gets a vote on when they are going to require a solid dose of freedom

    As a military overall, we are actually really good at that, doing the best with what the situation dictates to us ... if we wait until the situation or we are totally perfect ... we may be too late.

    But In Iraq he used that quote in a case where we had complete control over if and when we went to war,

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •