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Thread: Army investigates: Are these West Point cadets making a political statement in unifor

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    Army investigates: Are these West Point cadets making a political statement in unifor


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    Senior Member WILDJOKER5's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sparks82 View Post
    Yeah, I don't see where they state a specific cause. Maybe they are just showing their "power" as women, or black women, being cadets at west point?
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    Quote Originally Posted by WILDJOKER5 View Post
    Yeah, I don't see where they state a specific cause. Maybe they are just showing their "power" as women, or black women, being cadets at west point?
    It is perceived as they are supporting the BLM movement while in uniform. I'm pretty sure they're going to get reprimanded in some form. It's always about perception.

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    These cadets have two things going for them. One, they are black. Two, they are female. There's no way anything other than a slap on the hand will happen.

    If this were a group of white males, they'd be called Nazis and made an example of.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sparks82 View Post
    It is perceived as they are supporting the BLM movement while in uniform. I'm pretty sure they're going to get reprimanded in some form. It's always about perception.
    Agreed. The perception of the raised fist these days is to support BLM or the black panthers (like Beyonce did in the half time show for the superbowl), so Can be seen as political speech..
    BUT with how our current administration seems, they won't get punished in anyway imo.

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    http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/08/us/wes...oto/index.html

    Update to it and there's a different photo they also took.

    "Mary Tobin is a graduate of the academy who said she is a mentor to some of the women in the photo and has spoken to them since the inquiry was launched. She said the pose had nothing to do with politics."They weren't doing it to be aligned with any particular movement or any particular party. It was, 'We did it and we did it together,'" Tobin said, referring to their completion of four years at West Point."

    That is probably more to the reason why they did it. I don't feel they were trying to stir up some political affiliation with any group. As mentioned in the article, the raised fist has been used throughout history by many groups.

    Honestly if they were white women I don't think there would have been anything in the news about them. Or white males.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sparks82 View Post
    http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/08/us/wes...oto/index.html

    Update to it and there's a different photo they also took.

    "Mary Tobin is a graduate of the academy who said she is a mentor to some of the women in the photo and has spoken to them since the inquiry was launched. She said the pose had nothing to do with politics."They weren't doing it to be aligned with any particular movement or any particular party. It was, 'We did it and we did it together,'" Tobin said, referring to their completion of four years at West Point."

    That is probably more to the reason why they did it. I don't feel they were trying to stir up some political affiliation with any group. As mentioned in the article, the raised fist has been used throughout history by many groups.

    Honestly if they were white women I don't think there would have been anything in the news about them. Or white males.
    Possibly, but the optic is definitely poor. I once saw a photo taken at an inopportune time when a boy was raising his had to catch something. It looked like the boy was making a Nazi salute (not a rigid extended hand, but close). Public reaction to the photo was pretty bad.

    Now, maybe their after the fact story on why they posed the way they did in the photo is accurate, maybe it is made up after the fact. Either way, the photograph (absent of a banner or description) looks like they are making a political statement. Even if they weren't (which I don't fully think is true), the ability to have it taken this way shows a lack of judgement ... one I expect from someone in this age group.
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    Quote Originally Posted by sparks82 View Post
    Honestly if they were white women I don't think there would have been anything in the news about them. Or white males.
    White women, possibly not...but white males would have been referred to as Nazis almost immediately. Hell, there was a video of a Trump rally where he asked his audience to raise their hands and make a pledge and the media made references to Hitler.

    Also, you mentioned prior that it's about perception. If it's being discussed then there is a perception. That, alone, makes it wrong when in uniform.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sandsjames View Post
    White women, possibly not...but white males would have been referred to as Nazis almost immediately. Hell, there was a video of a Trump rally where he asked his audience to raise their hands and make a pledge and the media made references to Hitler.

    Also, you mentioned prior that it's about perception. If it's being discussed then there is a perception. That, alone, makes it wrong when in uniform.
    I suppose they should have just not taken that picture and should have just gone with the one where they aren't raising a fist. I don't think a majority of people would say "Nazis" with a raised fist by white guys.

    The Trump thing had a very Hitler-esque notion to it. I mean he had them raise their hand and swear a pledge to him. It was a pledge to vote for Trump. C'mon now. That wasn't the smartest thing to do. I can't upload a picture right now but if you Google it...that rally where he asked that the photos look very much like the Nazi salute. No other candidates said "Raise your hand and swear allegiance to me." That is why people said that it was like Hitler.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sparks82 View Post
    I suppose they should have just not taken that picture and should have just gone with the one where they aren't raising a fist. I don't think a majority of people would say "Nazis" with a raised fist by white guys.

    The Trump thing had a very Hitler-esque notion to it. I mean he had them raise their hand and swear a pledge to him. It was a pledge to vote for Trump. C'mon now. That wasn't the smartest thing to do. I can't upload a picture right now but if you Google it...that rally where he asked that the photos look very much like the Nazi salute. No other candidates said "Raise your hand and swear allegiance to me." That is why people said that it was like Hitler.
    You can rationalize it all you want...

    For instance...if this had been a group of black and white women with their fists raised in the air I wouldn't think anything of it because there is no history to anything questionable with white chicks doing this.

    However, white men and black men/women have all made that (or a very similar) gesture for political reasons so to have it perceived as something larger is pretty easy to understand.

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