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Thread: Boehner to resign at end of October

  1. #21
    Senior Member TJMAC77SP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bos Mutus View Post
    One would think, huh...
    I am very surprised by his position on Creationism vs Evolution. Weird for a man of science.

    As for the Big Bang Theory. It is a contested theory among the scientists themselves. I am troubled if his attacking the BBT is a way to defend Creationism though. Being a Seventh Day Adventist explains the basis but you would think his education and experience would have muted those beliefs somewhere along the line.

    I need to read more objective stuff from him.
    Last edited by TJMAC77SP; 09-28-2015 at 09:18 PM.
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  2. #22
    Senior Member Bos Mutus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TJMAC77SP View Post
    I am very surprised by his position on Creationism vs Evolution. Weird for a man of science.

    As for the Big Bang Theory. It is a contested theory among the scientists themselves. I am troubled if his attacking the BBT is a way to defend Creationism though. Being a Seventh Day Adventist explains the basis but you would think his education and experience would have muted those beliefs somewhere along the line.

    I need to read more objective stuff from him.
    I don't know how much it matters whether or not a surgeon believes in evolution or the big bang...not sure that it matters if a President does, either, except for the influence they might have on education standards.

    Doesn't really matter, IMO, if the Big Bang or Evolution for that matter can be "proved true beyond a doubt"....the important thing is that these "theories" come about and are tested through the scientific process, rather than blind faith in the face of opposing evidence.

    I think most scientists would be willing and ready to alter their beliefs in the face of evidence....and the scientific process has a systematic method of dealing with that and arriving at a new understanding.

    The scientific process has brought us many wonderful discoveries throughout history...so, I don't really care if someone believes in the 6,000 year creation story...just don't call it science and don't teach it in science class in place of theories that are arrived at through the scientific process.

    Science class is not so much about whether or not the final answer is "true"...but it's about the process to get to the best available explanation...which can change as new evidence comes in. Wash, rinse, repeat.

    Being as Carson is a man of science...I don't imagine he would be against solid science education....so, that's really the only area I can think of where is belief in creationism is relevant to his ability to be POTUS.
    Last edited by Bos Mutus; 09-28-2015 at 09:38 PM.
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  3. #23
    Senior Member LogDog's Avatar
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    Boehner's problem was he wasn't up to handling the small Tea Party faction within his party. The 2010 and 2014 elections, in which main stream republicans were being bumped-off by the Tea Party candidates, made him too timid to take them on directly. The Tea Party faction has only about 50 members and he still had control of around 195 members. This is a case of the tail-wagging-the-dog. Boehner could have reduced their presence in the House by ensuring they weren't on any committees of importance and stifling their roles in in their party's House caucus thereby eliminating a platform for them to voice their opinions.

    Boehner's term as Speaker will be noted for overseeing the two least productive sessions of Congress.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TJMAC77SP View Post
    Well, I have to admit I had no idea he was so strongly in the fundamentalist Christian camp. The few times I have heard him speak he said nothing along these lines and was quite moderate.

    As for his position on vaccinations I think you might be confused there.

    http://www.cnn.com/2015/02/03/politi...-immunization/

    "A lot of people are put off when they hear the word 'government force,' and perhaps there's a better way to put these things," Carson said. "But the fact of the matter is, studies have shown us over the course of time that the benefit-to-risk ratio for vaccination is way in the favor of doing it as opposed to not doing it."

    So obviously it is unfair hyperbole to claim he is "prepared to let children die to avoid losing a few votes from".
    Did you watch the last debates, Carson pandered to the anti-coaxing idiots very strongly with one of their favorite imaginary problems. when it was time to slap down this idiocy in front of a audience of millions he panders to the fools. I believe that cowardice shows that he is willing to let kids dies if that is what it takes to keep the crazies happy.

    I think that his positions on evolution and the Big bang theory show a d man too disconnected from reality to be trusted with the job of president.


    After all this is the lunatic that want drones strikes on US territory.

    http://www.newsmax.com/TheWire/ben-c.../24/id/671584/


    More from @RealBenCarson on border issues: "You look at some of these caves and things out there one drone strike, boom, and they'd gone."

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    Senior Member TJMAC77SP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeKerriii View Post
    Did you watch the last debates, Carson pandered to the anti-coaxing idiots very strongly with one of their favorite imaginary problems. when it was time to slap down this idiocy in front of a audience of millions he panders to the fools. I believe that cowardice shows that he is willing to let kids dies if that is what it takes to keep the crazies happy.

    I think that his positions on evolution and the Big bang theory show a d man too disconnected from reality to be trusted with the job of president.


    After all this is the lunatic that want drones strikes on US territory.

    http://www.newsmax.com/TheWire/ben-c.../24/id/671584/
    Why do you always use pejorative terms in describing people who disagree with (Republicans)? A while ago all were scumbags, now they are loons. Really tiresome and predictable................

    No, I didn't watch the last debates and quite frankly probably won't until it is a smaller field. Everyone is pandering at this point to some degree. Not sure if that was an error but I have no idea what the 'anti-coaxing idiots' are but Carson is not anti-vaccination and actually is quite the opposite so continuing to say that he is willing to let children die simply negates your argument (such as it is) and puts a spotlight on your agenda. If you are attempting to put him in the same camp as Jenny McCarthy and the other anti-vaccination crowd because he has some fundamental questions about the government making them mandatory that is a very specious logic jump.

    As to the drone strikes he is by far not the only one who has mentioned this. I don't necessarily agree with him but let's make sure we present the true nature of what he said................

    ""There are caves that they utilize," Carson explained. "Those caves can be eliminated. There are a number of possibilities -- that could be one of them. … I'm not talking about killing people. No people with drones."

    I actually thought the cartels use tunnels and not caves but whatever.

    Sometimes a candidate mentions a desire off the top of his head that is a non-starter right off the bat. Like closing the detention facility at Gitmo. Made for nice campaign sound bites but just didn't work out.
    Last edited by TJMAC77SP; 09-29-2015 at 02:43 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TJMAC77SP View Post
    Why do you always use pejorative terms in describing people who disagree with (Republicans)? A while ago all were scumbags, now they are loons. Really tiresome and predictable................

    No, I didn't watch the last debates and quite frankly probably won't until it is a smaller field. Everyone is pandering at this point to some degree. Not sure if that was an error but I have no idea what the 'anti-coaxing idiots' are but Carson is not anti-vaccination and actually is quite the opposite so continuing to say that he is willing to let children die simply negates your argument (such as it is) and puts a spotlight on your agenda. If you are attempting to put him in the same camp as Jenny McCarthy and the other anti-vaccination crowd because he has some fundamental questions about the government making them mandatory that is a very specious logic jump.

    As to the drone strikes he is by far not the only one who has mentioned this. I don't necessarily agree with him but let's make sure we present the true nature of what he said................

    ""There are caves that they utilize," Carson explained. "Those caves can be eliminated. There are a number of possibilities -- that could be one of them. … I'm not talking about killing people. No people with drones."

    I actually thought the cartels use tunnels and not caves but whatever.

    Sometimes a candidate mentions a desire off the top of his head that is a non-starter right off the bat. Like closing the detention facility at Gitmo. Made for nice campaign sound bites but just didn't work out.
    I use the terms I use becasue more accurate terms are against the rules here and i don't like using that level of profanity

    Carson crawled for Trump while Trump was spouting pure anti-vaxxer idiocy, and MD that does that is scum or worse, especially when it is done inform of 20+ million people,. If he had any honor, professional ethics, or integrity he would have slated the idiot down. Since some of the audience treats Trump as a credible source for some bizarre reason.

    the caves bit is pretty simple, If you shoot at a empty cave on US territory you are very unlikely to harm it, and it could easily be destroyed by a guy with 50$ worth of dynamite instead of a missile with a 6 digit price tag that is unlike to do harm to the cave. If you shoot a Cave on US soil with a missile and you kill someone you have just committed per-meditated murder since the legal and constitutional requirements for the use of deadly force have not been met. You have also violated Posse Comitatus since the mitary is not allowed to enforce civil law, much less commit murder while doing so. Yes, other people have proposed that but that just means that they are ignorant asses at best.

    I notice you ignore the quote of him advocating the use of missiles

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    Senior Member TJMAC77SP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeKerriii View Post
    I use the terms I use becasue more accurate terms are against the rules here and i don't like using that level of profanity

    Carson crawled for Trump while Trump was spouting pure anti-vaxxer idiocy, and MD that does that is scum or worse, especially when it is done inform of 20+ million people,. If he had any honor, professional ethics, or integrity he would have slated the idiot down. Since some of the audience treats Trump as a credible source for some bizarre reason.

    the caves bit is pretty simple, If you shoot at a empty cave on US territory you are very unlikely to harm it, and it could easily be destroyed by a guy with 50$ worth of dynamite instead of a missile with a 6 digit price tag that is unlike to do harm to the cave. If you shoot a Cave on US soil with a missile and you kill someone you have just committed per-meditated murder since the legal and constitutional requirements for the use of deadly force have not been met. You have also violated Posse Comitatus since the mitary is not allowed to enforce civil law, much less commit murder while doing so. Yes, other people have proposed that but that just means that they are ignorant asses at best.

    I notice you ignore the quote of him advocating the use of missiles
    So you use lesser pejoratives to avoid using profane pejoratives. Ok, that doesn't answer my questions but whatever.

    I understood what he wanted to do to the caves. Did you seriously think I didn't. Not sure why the explanation of that. BTW, your interpretation of the Posse Comitatus Act is a bit narrow and assumes the US military would operate the drones. The CBP has been flying Predator B's for over a decade. Why do you assume they wouldn't fly the strike version especially given the off-hand and hypothetical nature of Carson's remark (as in it is hardly a developed proposed policy)? I addressed Carson's mention of drone strikes, what quote about 'missiles' did I 'ignore'?

    I would avoid making legal determinations if I were you. Your definitive statements are incorrect and sometimes just ignorant.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TJMAC77SP View Post
    So you use lesser pejoratives to avoid using profane pejoratives. Ok, that doesn't answer my questions but whatever.

    I understood what he wanted to do to the caves. Did you seriously think I didn't. Not sure why the explanation of that. BTW, your interpretation of the Posse Comitatus Act is a bit narrow and assumes the US military would operate the drones. The CBP has been flying Predator B's for over a decade. Why do you assume they wouldn't fly the strike version especially given the off-hand and hypothetical nature of Carson's remark (as in it is hardly a developed proposed policy)? I addressed Carson's mention of drone strikes, what quote about 'missiles' did I 'ignore'?

    I would avoid making legal determinations if I were you. Your definitive statements are incorrect and sometimes just ignorant.
    I notice you make no comments on the folks that can't even spell the Presidents or MS. Clinton's name? Look up the term "Hypocrite "

    I use pejoratives becasue ti think that the names fit theses loons who are so willing to throw way rte lives of American soldiers and the Constitution. I think that they are dangerous to the civilian citizenry of the United States, the Military and the Constitution.


    I was assuming that the military would be used becasue any policeman who received orders for the drone strikes would be obligated to arrest the nut-job giving him the orders. And order to commit murder is not one that a honest cop can take without arresting the person who gives him the order. A mitary member at least can claim ignorance of the laws Cops must both follow and enforce.

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    Administrator Mjölnir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeKerriii View Post
    I notice you make no comments on the folks that can't even spell the Presidents or MS. Clinton's name? Look up the term "Hypocrite "
    You have said that you have some issues that impair your typing ... but you may want to lay off being the spelling and grammar police.

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeKerriii View Post
    I was assuming that the military would be used becasue any policeman who received orders for the drone strikes would be obligated to arrest the nut-job giving him the orders. And order to commit murder is not one that a honest cop can take without arresting the person who gives him the order. A mitary member at least can claim ignorance of the laws Cops must both follow and enforce.
    What are you basing that on? There are 'ignorance of the law rulings and precedent, but it is large jump to claim ignorance of an obscure section of criminal code and murder. Military members are obligated and legally accountable to follow lawful orders; being ordered to shoot or drop munitions on an unarmed and non-hostile is pretty basic ROE type stuff that most of your combat arms / direct action people are well versed on as well as the drone operators who operate the drones. As far as collateral damage from the use / employment of drones and if killing a person is murder ... you should research that better and while some may try to classify it as murder, but there is significant legal precedent and application of international law to show that (at least legally) that is not murder ... no more so than demolishing a home to find out someone was hiding in it ... good faith in effort to clear the house or verify the validity of a combat target.
    The most important six inches on the battlefield ... is between your ears.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mjölnir View Post
    You have said that you have some issues that impair your typing ... but you may want to lay off being the spelling and grammar police.
    I was refering to the fools that use term such as Obumpmer and the like, people who intentionaly mangle the name and think they are clever.



    Quote Originally Posted by Mjölnir View Post
    What are you basing that on? There are 'ignorance of the law rulings and precedent, but it is large jump to claim ignorance of an obscure section of criminal code and murder. Military members are obligated and legally accountable to follow lawful orders; being ordered to shoot or drop munitions on an unarmed and non-hostile is pretty basic ROE type stuff that most of your combat arms / direct action people are well versed on as well as the drone operators who operate the drones. As far as collateral damage from the use / employment of drones and if killing a person is murder ... you should research that better and while some may try to classify it as murder, but there is significant legal precedent and application of international law to show that (at least legally) that is not murder ... no more so than demolishing a home to find out someone was hiding in it ... good faith in effort to clear the house or verify the validity of a combat target.
    Inside the US the rules used by police on when the use of armed force is authorized are the ones that count, especial when the force is being used to enforce civil law. You would have a point is you were talking about military actions in a state of war, or a situation approaching war outside the US, but in the US the military has to obey civil law like everyone else and the SC has made it very clear when the use of deadly force is authorized to stop a criminal. That the US Government can torture people outside the US doesn't mean that they can ignore Miranda and torture criminal suspects within the US for example.

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