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Thread: Gay Conservative: Boycott CPAC until they accept gays

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    Re: Gay Conservative: Boycott CPAC until they accept gays

    Quote Originally Posted by F4CrewChick View Post
    Politics are personal. I have some gay conservative friends, but I can tell you we NEVER talk politics. I do not understand those in the LGBT community who support a party that denies basic rights. I agree with Joe. JD, if you agree with 100 parts of an organizations platform but the 101st item disregards your rights to be who you are, how can you continue to support them? It's not an accident that so conservatives who support anti-gay legislation then get busted with their pants down. If you support conservative values, lifestyle, etc., fine but if they don't support you, why wouldn't you then support actual FREEDOM to be whoever you are? You don't have to support "liberal" values to understand that liberal values include your right to be whatever you like; the opposite of conservative values.

    Log Cabin Republicans contributed to Dubya's campaigns, both of them. The contribution was returned--both times.
    Except if you are gay, minority, or a woman and want to be conservative that is. The most evil, hateful and racist things you ever hear tweeted are from liberals about a conservative that isnt a white male. The way they attacked Palin, Bachmann, Cain, West, and lately the wife of McConnell (asian woman) is just reprehensable.
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    Re: Gay Conservative: Boycott CPAC until they accept gays

    Quote Originally Posted by WILDJOKER5 View Post
    Except if you are gay, minority, or a woman and want to be conservative that is. The most evil, hateful and racist things you ever hear tweeted are from liberals about a conservative that isnt a white male. The way they attacked Palin, Bachmann, Cain, West, and lately the wife of McConnell (asian woman) is just reprehensable.
    I am gay, a woman and while not technically a minority, I'm brown enough to have been thought to be a 'person of color.' No single group I know has cornered the market on manners; there are as many hateful, vile conservatives as there are liberals.

    People take it personally when someone--anyone--talks smack about an issue they feel affects them. There are many ways in which to express one's opinion, unfortunately some do so in a heinous fashion. When rebuttals to a person's position on an issue take an ad hominem approach, tempers flair and people act out--we have all been guilty at some time in our lives of saying something mean-spirited. Recreant comments are fear-based and nothing is more frightening that feeling powerless over one's own fate, which is often times the tact politicians use to divide and conquer particular groups. Liberals by no means use personal attacks as modus operandi; conservatives often use mean statements as a punchline.

    I make no apologies for those on my side of the political spectrum who choose craven commentary over meaningful debate but sometimes, a heartfelt "Fuck You" feels pretty good.
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    Re: Gay Conservative: Boycott CPAC until they accept gays

    Quote Originally Posted by F4CrewChick View Post
    Politics are personal. I have some gay conservative friends, but I can tell you we NEVER talk politics. I do not understand those in the LGBT community who support a party that denies basic rights. I agree with Joe. JD, if you agree with 100 parts of an organizations platform but the 101st item disregards your rights to be who you are, how can you continue to support them?
    I get your point, but (shocker) disagree. Let's say I'm a gay Christian and find it more important to have my religious rights protected than I do to have my lifestyle choice protected. It would seem selfish, at that point, to dismiss a party that most closely represents who I am and what I believe.

    Or, maybe I'm anti an abortion, anti gay, bible thumper, but the MOST important thing to me is the protection of labor unions. I I might then support the democrats, even though that's the only item I agree with them on.

    The issue is that nobody is going to agree with any party 100%. Also, I'm surprised that you would have that judgement of people within your own community because of which party they might support. I thought liberals were all about freedom of choice?

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    Re: Gay Conservative: Boycott CPAC until they accept gays

    Quote Originally Posted by F4CrewChick View Post
    Politics are personal. I have some gay conservative friends, but I can tell you we NEVER talk politics. I do not understand those in the LGBT community who support a party that denies basic rights. I agree with Joe. JD, if you agree with 100 parts of an organizations platform but the 101st item disregards your rights to be who you are, how can you continue to support them? It's not an accident that so conservatives who support anti-gay legislation then get busted with their pants down. If you support conservative values, lifestyle, etc., fine but if they don't support you, why wouldn't you then support actual FREEDOM to be whoever you are? You don't have to support "liberal" values to understand that liberal values include your right to be whatever you like; the opposite of conservative values.

    Log Cabin Republicans contributed to Dubya's campaigns, both of them. The contribution was returned--both times.
    I get what you are saying but sometimes people look at the big picture, read what they hope is writing on the wall and wait for change. I am a fairly conservative leaning person but believe that it certainly is not a 'conservative value' to keep anyone from being who they are. I also strongly believe that I think like a lot of conservatives. Unfortunately the GOP (and let's face it that is really what you mean by conservatives) has been virtually taken over by those who hold radical far right beliefs, often based on religious doctrine that insists that the gay lifestyle is morally wrong and those who practice it are going to burn in hell. I and other hope that cooler (and saner) heads prevail. As much as I may have supported Bush Jr, I will always blame him for letting them stick their noses under the tent.

    It is in my mind akin to people the likes of the young Gerry Brown and Tom Hayden taking over the Democratic Party. Holy shit! We all need to learn to moderate our beliefs and even more so, our rhetoric.

    To be so completely amazed when hearing that even one gay person is a conservative is very telling in my opinion. It is naive at the very least.
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    Re: Gay Conservative: Boycott CPAC until they accept gays

    Quote Originally Posted by F4CrewChick View Post
    I am gay, a woman and while not technically a minority, I'm brown enough to have been thought to be a 'person of color.' No single group I know has cornered the market on manners; there are as many hateful, vile conservatives as there are liberals.

    People take it personally when someone--anyone--talks smack about an issue they feel affects them. There are many ways in which to express one's opinion, unfortunately some do so in a heinous fashion. When rebuttals to a person's position on an issue take an ad hominem approach, tempers flair and people act out--we have all been guilty at some time in our lives of saying something mean-spirited. Recreant comments are fear-based and nothing is more frightening that feeling powerless over one's own fate, which is often times the tact politicians use to divide and conquer particular groups. Liberals by no means use personal attacks as modus operandi; conservatives often use mean statements as a punchline.

    I make no apologies for those on my side of the political spectrum who choose craven commentary over meaningful debate but sometimes, a heartfelt "Fuck You" feels pretty good.
    Thanks again for a reasonable post (and once again for your avatar - God I wish those pics were bigger).

    I have to disagree with your assertion that somehow only conservatives are guilty of mean statements or personal attacks. This last election campaign blows that completely out of the water.
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    Re: Gay Conservative: Boycott CPAC until they accept gays

    Quote Originally Posted by sandsjames View Post
    I get your point, but (shocker) disagree. Let's say I'm a gay Christian and find it more important to have my religious rights protected than I do to have my lifestyle choice protected. It would seem selfish, at that point, to dismiss a party that most closely represents who I am and what I believe.

    Or, maybe I'm anti an abortion, anti gay, bible thumper, but the MOST important thing to me is the protection of labor unions. I I might then support the democrats, even though that's the only item I agree with them on.

    The issue is that nobody is going to agree with any party 100%. Also, I'm surprised that you would have that judgement of people within your own community because of which party they might support. I thought liberals were all about freedom of choice?
    Not judging anyone, I just don't understand the choice and as I said, I do have gay republican friends, and we don't talk politics. No one agrees 100% with their party, sure, but to have that party LEGISLATE AGAINST YOUR PERSONHOOD is beyond the pale for me. If someone believes they are served by the party they affiliate with, great. I support the freedom to choose.
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    Re: Gay Conservative: Boycott CPAC until they accept gays

    Quote Originally Posted by TJMAC77SP View Post
    Thanks again for a reasonable post (and once again for your avatar - God I wish those pics were bigger).

    I have to disagree with your assertion that somehow only conservatives are guilty of mean statements or personal attacks. This last election campaign blows that completely out of the water.
    Quoting myself: "...there are as many hateful, vile conservatives as there are liberals."

    My response was to the assertion that liberals make mean, racist, etc., comments about conservatives. I contend that BOTH sides do it and for the most part, I am as offended by the comments from supposed-liberals as I am from mean-spirited comments by conservatives.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]You giggle every time you say 'cockpit'

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    Re: Gay Conservative: Boycott CPAC until they accept gays

    Quote Originally Posted by F4CrewChick View Post
    Not judging anyone, I just don't understand the choice and as I said, I do have gay republican friends, and we don't talk politics. No one agrees 100% with their party, sure, but to have that party LEGISLATE AGAINST YOUR PERSONHOOD is beyond the pale for me. If someone believes they are served by the party they affiliate with, great. I support the freedom to choose.
    It's possible that the people you speak of use more than their sexuality to identify their "personhood".

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    Re: Gay Conservative: Boycott CPAC until they accept gays

    Quote Originally Posted by TJMAC77SP View Post
    I get what you are saying but sometimes people look at the big picture, read what they hope is writing on the wall and wait for change. I am a fairly conservative leaning person but believe that it certainly is not a 'conservative value' to keep anyone from being who they are. I also strongly believe that I think like a lot of conservatives. Unfortunately the GOP (and let's face it that is really what you mean by conservatives) has been virtually taken over by those who hold radical far right beliefs, often based on religious doctrine that insists that the gay lifestyle is morally wrong and those who practice it are going to burn in hell. I and other hope that cooler (and saner) heads prevail. As much as I may have supported Bush Jr, I will always blame him for letting them stick their noses under the tent.

    It is in my mind akin to people the likes of the young Gerry Brown and Tom Hayden taking over the Democratic Party. Holy shit! We all need to learn to moderate our beliefs and even more so, our rhetoric.

    To be so completely amazed when hearing that even one gay person is a conservative is very telling in my opinion. It is naive at the very least.
    If the GOP today resembled that of Eisenhower's day, I don't think we would be in disagreement. The far-right has taken over the republican party and "far-left liberals" are far from the mainstream in today's political landscape. The democratic party has moved much to the right over the last generation and 'liberals' are the least influential of its constituents. I consider myself to be fairly conservative values-wise--12 years of Catholic school followed by 22 years of Air Force can have that effect. My values basically line up nicely with the "Conservative Party" values of the Eisenhower Administration.

    I may not agree with how someone lives their life but unless it infringes on my ability to live as I see fit, it's none of my business. The GOP wants to inflict its values on everyone and that is where we part company.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]You giggle every time you say 'cockpit'

    -David Letterman "Top Ten ways to know you might not be ready to join the USAF"

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    Re: Gay Conservative: Boycott CPAC until they accept gays

    Quote Originally Posted by sandsjames View Post
    It's possible that the people you speak of use more than their sexuality to identify their "personhood".
    James, you confuse 'sexuality' with sex. It is very difficult to separate who you love, want to build family and community with, share all that is what creates 'marriage' i.e., house w/ mortgage, bills, vacations, etc., and not have it be about your personhood. If you are able to do this, create this separate "experience" while supporting that which codifies discrimination, it's compartmentalization of the highest order, not all together different than many German soldiers during WWII and the "Good German" citizens that allowed the rise of Hitler and denial of the genocide of Jews. (There I've done it--Godwin's Law)

    "Personhood" is about sexuality and all of the many features and qualities that make us individuals and human beings.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]You giggle every time you say 'cockpit'

    -David Letterman "Top Ten ways to know you might not be ready to join the USAF"

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