View Poll Results: Do you obey the order to force Americans at gunpoint into concentration camps?

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  • Yes, I will obey the order.

    12 36.36%
  • No, I will refuse the order.

    16 48.48%
  • I Don't Know

    5 15.15%
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Thread: Would you have forced Americans into concentration camps at gunpoint in the 1940s?

  1. #11
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    Re: Would you have forced Americans into concentration camps at gunpoint in the 1940s

    With what I know how I would refuse it because it is well known you can refuse an unlawful order. If we are at war to the point where we were during WWII it might be different. Still while I voted no, situations could arise where I may have to.

  2. #12
    Senior Member BRUWIN's Avatar
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    Re: Would you have forced Americans into concentration camps at gunpoint in the 1940s

    Well I'm just gonna go out on a limb and say that if it were a certain group of people raising hell that I didn't approve of than yes...I would round them up and take them in. That's why for me it is entirely situational. Nothing is ever written in stone for me...I do what I think is the right thing and I'll ignore a peice of paper if I feel it doesn't apply. Not everything is black or white.
    "Respect My Authoritah!" - Eric Cartman

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    Re: Would you have forced Americans into concentration camps at gunpoint in the 1940s

    We do not have martial law. We have posse comitatus. We have a constitution we take an oath to defend. We do not have a dictator. We have free will. We have Article 90 of the UCMJ. This would clearly be an illegal order and as an officer (former) it would be my duty to bring such an order into question.

    Any questions?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]You giggle every time you say 'cockpit'

    -David Letterman "Top Ten ways to know you might not be ready to join the USAF"

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    Senior Member VFFTSGT's Avatar
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    Re: Would you have forced Americans into concentration camps at gunpoint in the 1940s

    Here's another hypothetical situation...where would you stand if you were in the position that the USS Colorado is on Last Resort?

    http://beta.abc.go.com/shows/last-resort

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    Re: Would you have forced Americans into concentration camps at gunpoint in the 1940s

    Quote Originally Posted by VFFTSGT View Post
    Here's another hypothetical situation...where would you stand if you were in the position that the USS Colorado is on Last Resort?

    http://beta.abc.go.com/shows/last-resort
    Being in the business of decoding and validating EAMs, I could one day be in a similar situation (though there are few enlisted jobs where I'd be actually in a position to execute independantly)... I'll have to go back to the 3rd choice of "I don't know" on this one... it may have been a valid EAM, but the fact that it was transmitted over a secondary net, when the primary was up and running and out of the blue I got one over the secondary, it'd have me questioning it.
    "If a man is called to be a street sweeper, he should sweep the streets even as Michelangelo painted, or Beethoven composed music, or Shakespeare wrote poetry. He should sweep the street so well that all the hosts of heaven and earth will pause to say, here lived a great street sweeper who did his job well. "

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  6. #16
    Member TVANSCOT's Avatar
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    Re: Would you have forced Americans into concentration camps at gunpoint in the 1940s

    Quote Originally Posted by PickYourBattles View Post

    1. The military took an oath to support and defend the Constitution.
    I have said it before and I will say it again, the Oath is useless because it contradicts itself, you simply quoted the first part, but here is the next: "of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic"... DOMESTIC... then there is this: "I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me".... so basically your screwed no matter what.

    No where in the oath or in the regulations or UCMJ does it tell how us WHO decides what enemy might be domestic, foreign is pretty easy to figure out but domestic... it requires you to fall back to the next part of the oath.

  7. #17
    Senior Member ConfusedAirman's Avatar
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    Re: Would you have forced Americans into concentration camps at gunpoint in the 1940s

    Not enough info for too biased of a question. All orders and responses are based on the law (as dictated by the Constitution) but neither the law nor the Constitution are so perfect and absolute that any one person, including myself, can say with absolute certainty that any particular law or order is lawful. I reserve the right to make a judgement at the time and will accept my fate if my decision and subsequent response is later determined to be unlawful by the US legal system.

  8. #18
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    Re: Would you have forced Americans into concentration camps at gunpoint in the 1940s

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert F. Dorr View Post
    Many of the Japanese who were rounded up were not American citizens.
    The poll discusses the 70,000 American citizens - that is why I used that number, and not the larger number that included non-American citizens. The 70,000 were all American citizens.

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert F. Dorr View Post
    Some were active supporters of the Japanese government and cheered when Japanese forces achieved victories early in the war.
    Source? What does "active support" mean? What does "cheering" mean, and is that protected speech?

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert F. Dorr View Post
    These were not concentration camps. These people were detained, not exterminated.
    There is a difference between death camps, and concentration camps. These were in fact concentration camps, and President Roosevelt and many others referred to these camps as concentration camps. http://americanhistory.si.edu/perfec...permanent.html

    "As a member of President Roosevelt's administration, I saw the United States Army give way to mass hysteria over the Japanese...Crowded into cars like cattle, these hapless people were hurried away to hastily constructed and thoroughly inadequate concentration camps, with soldiers with nervous muskets on guard, in the great American desert. We gave the fancy name of 'relocation centers' to these dust bowls, but they were concentration camps nonetheless."


    —Harold Ickes, Secretary of the Interior, Washington Evening Star, September 23, 1946
    COURAGE!

    Quote Originally Posted by sandsjames View Post
    Well, you aren't going to like this answer either, but yes [I would follow an unlawful order to round up innocent Americans by force and throw them into concentration camps]. ...I probably would have obeyed the order for self preservation purposes.

  9. #19
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    Re: Would you have forced Americans into concentration camps at gunpoint in the 1940s

    Quote Originally Posted by BRUWIN View Post
    Well I'm just gonna go out on a limb and say that if it were a certain group of people raising hell that I didn't approve of than yes...I would round them up and take them in. That's why for me it is entirely situational. Nothing is ever written in stone for me...I do what I think is the right thing and I'll ignore a peice of paper if I feel it doesn't apply. Not everything is black or white.
    Quoted for posterity. Thanks for the honesty.
    COURAGE!

    Quote Originally Posted by sandsjames View Post
    Well, you aren't going to like this answer either, but yes [I would follow an unlawful order to round up innocent Americans by force and throw them into concentration camps]. ...I probably would have obeyed the order for self preservation purposes.

  10. #20
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    Re: Would you have forced Americans into concentration camps at gunpoint in the 1940s

    Quote Originally Posted by BRUWIN View Post
    But doesn't the new proposed law make it not a crime?
    No law passed by Congress, short of a Constitutional Amendment, can controvert the Fifth and Sixth Amendments. So any law passed that says, "Go ahead and ignore the Fifth Amendment" is unlawful, even though it will be treated as lawful by one or more branches of government. It also puts the military in the position of having to honor their oaths to the Constitution, if they are principled, or going with the flow if they are not.
    COURAGE!

    Quote Originally Posted by sandsjames View Post
    Well, you aren't going to like this answer either, but yes [I would follow an unlawful order to round up innocent Americans by force and throw them into concentration camps]. ...I probably would have obeyed the order for self preservation purposes.

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