Page 13 of 26 FirstFirst ... 3111213141523 ... LastLast
Results 121 to 130 of 257

Thread: Uniformed Services Former Spouse Protection Act (USFSPA)

  1. #121
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    SW. Michigan
    Posts
    153
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)

    Re: Uniformed Services Former Spouse Protection Act (USFSPA)

    Originally Posted by TSgt"M"
    I had a ex that left after 9 years of marriage, probably 12 years AD. Luckily I waited her out. I wouldn't sign and she was wanting to marry (again) to a bigger money bag than me. She finally signed off of my mil ret. I was young enough to probably bale if she would have been awarded it. Didn't get married again until about 18 1/2 years AD because of this. (Shhhhh ,Don't tell my current wife)

    So, to clarify, the USFSPA did not automatically award your former spouse any part of your retirement.

    Nope

  2. #122
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Columbus, ohio
    Posts
    3,326
    Mentioned
    29 Post(s)

    Re: Uniformed Services Former Spouse Protection Act (USFSPA)

    Quote Originally Posted by USN - Retired View Post
    Interestingly, military service is somehow considered to be a property of the marriage, yet a college degree earned during marriage is not. For example, let's say that a civilian woman married a military service member and the military service member put his wife through medical school during their marraige. The wife then divorced her hubby after she became a doctor. The wife can claim partial ownership of her hubby's military retirement income, yet the hubby can not claim any ownership of his wife's medical degree. Show me the fairness there.
    To me if he (or she) used her GI bill to send the other to college to get that degree it bloody well should be 'communal' property.

    Something to keep in mind...the USFSPA does not require military retirement to be treated as property...it gives the states the option to do so and means to enforce it.
    Required no, but that is how i have seen most states view it.

  3. #123
    Senior Member USN - Retired's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Ewa Beach, Hawaii
    Posts
    702
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)

    Re: Uniformed Services Former Spouse Protection Act (USFSPA)

    Quote Originally Posted by Measure Man View Post
    Okay...

    Let's start with a simple one:

    If it were pay why do you get a 1099-R and not a W-2?
    Social security retirement benefits are reported to the taxpayer on Form SSA-1099. Social security retirement benefits are not community property.

  4. #124
    Senior Member USN - Retired's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Ewa Beach, Hawaii
    Posts
    702
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)

    Re: Uniformed Services Former Spouse Protection Act (USFSPA)

    Quote Originally Posted by Measure Man View Post
    Something to keep in mind...the USFSPA does not require military retirement to be treated as property...it gives the states the option to do so and means to enforce it.
    That post of MM reminds me of a VERY old post that I recently discovered on this forum...

    Quote Originally Posted by Jefferson Davis
    Something to keep in mind...the US Constitution does not require black people to be treated as property...it gives the states the option to do so and means to enforce it.
    That poster was a West Point grad and he posted that comment on this forum back in the year 1860. Yes, this forum has been around for quite a while.

    I'm not saying that MM condones slavery, but it does seem that he and Jefferson Davis do see eye-to-eye on the concept of states' rights.

    My question to both MM and Jefferson Davis - Does the concept of states' rights give the states the right to violate a person's civil rights? Slavery is obviously a violation of a person's civil rights. Allowing a family court judge to redistribute property, money and future income in a divorce is also a violation of civil rights. USFSPA is a violation of the civil rights of military service members. A family court judge shouldn't have the power to take property, money and future income that belongs to one spouse and give it to another spouse, especially in this day and age. The only reasonable exception is child support payments. The family court judges have way too much power and they have demonstrated time and again that they will abuse that power.

  5. #125
    Senior Member TJMAC77SP's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    3,156
    Mentioned
    4 Post(s)

    Re: Uniformed Services Former Spouse Protection Act (USFSPA)

    Quote Originally Posted by Measure Man View Post
    A 1099-R?

    File Form 1099-R, Distributions From Pensions, Annuities, Retirement or Profit-Sharing Plans, IRAs, Insurance Contracts, etc., for each person to whom you have made a designated distribution or are treated as having made a distribution of $10 or more from profit-sharing or retirement plans, any individual retirement arrangements (IRAs), annuities, pensions, insurance contracts, survivor income benefit plans, permanent and total disability payments under life insurance contracts, charitable gift annuities, etc.
    Ah, I see. It is called Retirement Pay so the third option covers it. My real point was that there is a lot of types of income which does not entail a W-2 being issued.
    ___________________
    Read carefully, think, then write thoughtfully……………………………..

    I don’t have any quotes……you can pick one for yourself

  6. #126
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Opt out
    Posts
    2,285
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)

    Re: Uniformed Services Former Spouse Protection Act (USFSPA)

    Quote Originally Posted by TJMAC77SP View Post
    Ah, I see. It is called Retirement Pay so the third option covers it. My real point was that there is a lot of types of income which does not entail a W-2 being issued.
    I believe it says distributions, not pay.

    Yes, there are a lot of types of income not reported on W-2, but the 1099-R is for retirement-type distributions.

  7. #127
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Opt out
    Posts
    2,285
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)

    Re: Uniformed Services Former Spouse Protection Act (USFSPA)

    Quote Originally Posted by USN - Retired View Post
    Social security retirement benefits are reported to the taxpayer on Form SSA-1099. Social security retirement benefits are not community property.
    The significance of the 1099-R is not whether or not it is community property...it was responding to TJ's "this is pay, not a retirement annuity, etc"

    That it is distributed on a 1099-R shows, at least the IRS, considers it more like a retirement annuity than they do wages, pay, etc.

    Still waiting if he has a source that it is pay...and also curious as to what the significance of that is.

  8. #128
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Opt out
    Posts
    2,285
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)

    Re: Uniformed Services Former Spouse Protection Act (USFSPA)

    Quote Originally Posted by USN - Retired View Post
    3. If a military spouse has been married to a military service member for 19 years or more, then the military spouse will be awarded 50% of the military retirement pay for life..
    Hmmmm...just relooking at this.

    so, your plan is that if they are married 19 durings, during which time the spouse does not work, has multiple affairs, calls the first sergeant everytime he goes TDY...that she should automatically get 50% of his retirement?

  9. #129
    Senior Member USN - Retired's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Ewa Beach, Hawaii
    Posts
    702
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)

    Re: Uniformed Services Former Spouse Protection Act (USFSPA)

    Quote Originally Posted by Measure Man View Post
    Hmmmm...just relooking at this.

    so, your plan is that if they are married 19 durings, during which time the spouse does not work, has multiple affairs, calls the first sergeant everytime he goes TDY...that she should automatically get 50% of his retirement?
    Great question. Here's what I would like.

    As much as possible, the family court would not be involved with marriages and divorce. In a divorce, all property that is legally titled as joint property, would be divided in half. Houses, land, bank accounts that are jointly owned is joint property. Divide them in half. If there is no legal paperwork that says the property is jointly owned, then it is not jointly owned. Unless the military spouse can show some paperwork, such as a prenuptial agreement, that the military retirement income is jointly owned, then it is not jointly owned. Divorce would be simple and the divorce lawyers would starve.

    None of that will ever happen. It just won't happen. My plan would deprive all the slimy divorce lawyers with a means to make lots of money. They would most certainly fight my plan.

    So let's take a minute to review my plan/proposal to modify USFSPA

    Quote Originally Posted by USN - Retired View Post
    1. If a military spouse has been married to a military service member for less than 6 years, then the military spouse will be awarded none of the military retirement pay in a divorce.

    2. If a military spouse has been married to a military service member for more than 6 years, but less than 19 years, then the military spouse will be awarded a lump sum of the military retirement pay. The military's involuntary separation pay tables will be used to calculate her lump sum.

    For example, let's say that the wife of an O-5 divorces her husband and she will have been married for 16 years at the time of the divorce. Her share of the military retirement pay will be $151,586. Of note: The former spouse's lump sum share of the retirement will be based on her hubby's rank at the time of the divorce; not at the time of his retirement. The O-5 can pay that amount directly to his ex-wife or pay it through an allotment (with interest) from his military retirement pay. Of course, the allotment must be a fair percentage of his military retirement pay.

    3. If a military spouse has been married to a military service member for 19 years or more, then the military spouse will be awarded 50% of the military retirement pay for life.

    Note: those years of marriage only include the years of marriage during which the service member performed creditable military service. For example, let's say a woman marries a military service member and the military service member then retires from the military a year after their wedding. 20 years later, the couple divorce. The woman would receive none of the military retirement pay since she was only married for one year during her hubby's military career and she would fall under the "less than 6 years" category above.
    Aspects of my plan do stink; however, I do believe that my plan is a fair comprise between the military service member and the military spouse. It provides financial protection to a military service member who was in a short term marriage, it also provides financial protection to a military spouse who was in a long term marriage, and it deprives the divorce lawyers of an opportunity to make a lot of money.

    so back to your original question...

    Quote Originally Posted by Measure Man View Post
    Hmmmm...just relooking at this.
    so, your plan is that if they are married 19 durings, during which time the spouse does not work, has multiple affairs, calls the first sergeant everytime he goes TDY...that she should automatically get 50% of his retirement?
    Yes. That aspect of my plan stinks, but yes. Under the current system, she will almost certainly get it anyway. If the military spouse was really that bad, then the military service member should have divorced her sooner.

    I believe that my plan is a fair comprise and I challenge all forum readers, especially from the military spouse community, to show me how my plan/proposal is unfair.

  10. #130
    Senior Member USN - Retired's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Ewa Beach, Hawaii
    Posts
    702
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)

    Re: Uniformed Services Former Spouse Protection Act (USFSPA)

    Quote Originally Posted by Measure Man View Post
    Because military retirement is not social security and social security is not military retirement.
    When you were active duty...did you have a deduction for on your LES for the military retirement system? Did that deduction go to pay current retirees?
    No...they are different programs, not related in any way.
    If we shouldn't compare military retirement income with social security retirement income, then why should we compare military retirement income with a pension plan from a civilian company?

Similar Threads

  1. BAH Going Away?
    By Mjölnir in forum BAH
    Replies: 60
    Last Post: 01-06-2017, 06:45 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •