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Thread: PT in the Army

  1. #21
    Biglew97
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    Re: PT in the Army

    Quote Originally Posted by majrdad View Post
    Please allow an old timer to add his two cents:

    The current PT test is just fine and we dont need to add any new events like the hop-skip-jump to measure fitness, endurance, or combat readiness.

    When I enlisted in the Army in 1981, the Army just got rid of several goofy events like the horizontal ladder climb and a ditch crawl that made administering a PT test require a special course and reduced the number of places a soldier could go to practice the events before taking a record test. Everybody was glad to finally go to the current 3 events that can be practiced anywhere and can be administered anyplace you can measure two miles to run. Simple is good.

    Everyone agrees soldiers should be fit, just no one agrees exactly what that means. I was in XVIII Abn Corps when we did those hellish long road marches with full gear in 3 hours. The 1SG would have a bullhorn and a big clock and anyone who took more than 3 hours to complete the march had to do it over again. Those marches were loads of fun, but did they really build muscle mass or endurance by doing them once a quarter? I always finished them under time and pass my APFT's, but does that mean I am fit for combat? I really can't say. What is 'fit'? APFT score? Military look? Body fat index? Frame of mind? Ability to carry heavy stuff in the heat? Maybe all of the above - I dont know.
    I agree with you completely although, I don't think its prudent a two mile run/12 mile ruck, should be accomplished at a FOB in Iraq or Afghanistan. I think and equivelent sprint/ 40 yard dash would be sufficient as a supplemental to the standardized APFT 2 mile run.

    Quote Originally Posted by majrdad View Post
    Bottom line is if you can pass the existing APFT you are probably in good enough shape to do your job. Sure, we can make up a new version of the test to add the toe-twisting tra-la-la or the lateral oblique bunny-hop, but unless someone can really show these new events would be better - why fix what is not broke just to make changes and call it 'progress'?
    I think you are on to something here! LOL

  2. #22
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    Re: PT in the Army

    well pt in the army is fine keeps me in shape, but the test standards are screwed up they say im fat noooo... im 190lbs with a big muscle build and 6 feet tall and im fat? whats going on.... obviously the armys standards think everyone should be skinny and weak...

  3. #23
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    Re: PT in the Army

    yea I would agree that many soldiers in the army have weight issues, but I work out every day and I have a strict diet, trust me im not fat most my weight is muscle, the army considers it fat which bothers me. but also one thing the army does not realize is everyone has a different body structure and measuring body fat with a measuring tape is not the correct way, according to some nutritionists as well

  4. #24
    majrdad
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    Re: PT in the Army

    I agree everyone has different body shapes and styles. AR 600-9 (reg for body fat) has always been a little bit of a mystery to me since I have seen people who look a bit overweight who easily pass tape yet I have seen people in the overweight or remedial PT formation who look just fine to me.

    As I understand tape measurements of AR 600-9, if you are over screening table weight, you need to do all you can to make your neck larger and your waist smaller so you can make tape. In a nutshell, tape measures difference between your waist and neck, adjusted for your height. If you have problems making the screening table weight, doing exercises that make your neck bigger and your waist smaller will get you back under the body fat percent for your age.

    Hope this helps,
    Ken :-)

  5. #25
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    Talking Re: PT in the Army

    PT in the Army

    I think the Army places way too much emphasis on PT. What about your job and isn't it important to have a brain? I am very tired of "Mr. Stud Muffin" getting all the glory and he can't even function in his job. But, he can do 120 push-ups and run a mile in 5 minutes. I on the other hand am doing my job and his because he is too busy at the gym. What will Mr. Stud Muffin do in the real world? It is very hard to full up your resume when you cannot complete even simple tasks on your job without the help of others. I suppose he will impress them with the fact that he can run to the copy machine faster.
    I also think the weight standard is not a very good thing. There are many people that do not meet the height and weight standards that pass PT tests and function quite well regardless. I have seen overweight people run just as well as others. I have also seen the opposite where the weight was a problembut not very often. I have seen good individuals forced out of the Army because they could not meet the numbers. To top it all off, they get paid for it. The individual that meets the standard and passes the PT test gets a month's pay if he or she elects to get out. Something wrong with this picture, eh? I wonder if that is why so many people decide to fail the PT test or eat to their heart's content?
    Let's also consider the soldier that is in their 17th or 18th year and has completed a Bachelor's and a Master's degree. They are now bored with their current MOS and the Army has spent a ton of money on education for them. But, the good old Army will not let the soldier work outside of his or her MOS, verbotten. These are the people retiring left and right because they want to move up in the real world. The Army is throwing money out the window. Yes, they have put in an initial investment in this soldier but that was years ago. How about giving the person some on the job training and a chance to do something different? Don't get me started on the problems with the various branches. Wake up people, soldiers are not just another number. You cannot expect to put a circle into a square box and not everyone fits the same mold. How about some matching the right individual with the right job? Oh my god, did I just think outside of the box? Forgive me...I'll do some push ups......NOT!

  6. #26
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    Smile Re: PT in the Army

    Quote Originally Posted by darkspecops View Post
    yea I would agree that many soldiers in the army have weight issues, but I work out every day and I have a strict diet, trust me im not fat most my weight is muscle, the army considers it fat which bothers me. but also one thing the army does not realize is everyone has a different body structure and measuring body fat with a measuring tape is not the correct way, according to some nutritionists as well
    Yes, I absolutely agree with you. The Army is still in the dark ages when it comes to certain things like measuring body fat. I have seen body builders have a problem with our current system. The Army realizes the differences but they do not want to acknowledge it. It's easier to look the other way than to have to deal with the problem itself, that means work.

  7. #27
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    Re: PT in the Army

    Quote Originally Posted by jay_ellis04 View Post
    Sorry, as this is a bit off topic, but how is the photo discriminatory and racist? Could you please expound upon that? As a recent selectee for the SFC Board, I KNOW beyond a shadow of a doubt, that if my promotion hinged on a dang photo, I'd probably STILL be a Private, cuz I'm one short, bald, ugly SOB. I think that it is IMPERATIVE that the photo is used, and if you remember back to the older days, just a couple of years ago, they have revamped the photo, in that you see from the waist up, versus, the entire Soldier. This accomplishes a couple of things:

    1: Better able to gauge if the Soldier does indeed meet weight standards, i.e., is not fat.
    2: Better able to see what that Soldier has accomplished by being better able to see that individual's personal awards.
    3: Better able to gauge if that NCO KNOWS what he is doing, by being able to better see if the Soldier's uniform is correct and accurately reflects the data in the SRB.

    From many of your posts, dude, you are ONE disgruntled fella with a problem with EVERYTHING. What are you doing HERE? I attempt to refrain from personal attacks, but to blatantly call our current promotion system racist, is WAY off. Discriminatory, yes, it is, as it should be, for it DISCRIMINATES the good ones from the dirtbags.
    This post get the Hooah 2008 year award lol. +2,000,000. I concur

  8. #28
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    Re: PT in the Army

    Quote Originally Posted by jay_ellis04 View Post
    Sorry, as this is a bit off topic, but how is the photo discriminatory and racist? Could you please expound upon that? As a recent selectee for the SFC Board, I KNOW beyond a shadow of a doubt, that if my promotion hinged on a dang photo, I'd probably STILL be a Private, cuz I'm one short, bald, ugly SOB. I think that it is IMPERATIVE that the photo is used, and if you remember back to the older days, just a couple of years ago, they have revamped the photo, in that you see from the waist up, versus, the entire Soldier. This accomplishes a couple of things:

    1: Better able to gauge if the Soldier does indeed meet weight standards, i.e., is not fat.
    If the "standard" is how you look in photo...you don't have a "standard" at all...you have personal perception and opinion.

    2: Better able to see what that Soldier has accomplished by being better able to see that individual's personal awards.
    Isn't that in their official record?

    3: Better able to gauge if that NCO KNOWS what he is doing, by being able to better see if the Soldier's uniform is correct and accurately reflects the data in the SRB.
    Okay...this is a good one.

  9. #29
    rmcdougle
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    Re: PT in the Army

    The Army does need to revamp the APFT. Go to crunches like the Marine Corps and not sit-ups. Sit-up damage the lower back. Bring in pull-ups and get rid of push-ups. Leave the 100 yard dash to unit or plt pt. Also if a soldier can score above a 270 than he/she should not have to go through height and weight. I have seen soldiers who are under weight not be able to pass the APFT but because they are under their weight it doesn't seem to matter much but if a soldier fails and is over weight than it becomes a big issue. Leave the male/female standards where they are at. Not all female can do the same amount of push-ups, sit-ups, or 2 mile run like males. There have been some females out do their male counter parts but not all females are like that but I would say raise the minimum number in the push-ups. A female should have to be required to do more than 13 push-ups to get 60 points.

  10. #30
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    Re: PT in the Army

    The current APFT is just that. A physical fitness test. Not a combat readiness test. If that is what the Army wants then it seems to me that maybe a separate test is appropriate. The current APFT really is a total body test. While maybe leg strength is slighted a bit, upper body and core strength and endurance are put to the test. I think the problem does not lie the testing but individual units attitudes and acumen towards the actual physical training. Not to mention deployment and training cycles. Those that lead PT should be experts in fitness and motivation. Enough of this running for runnings sake. Have detailed goals and plans and then execute. If the mission allows, work more time into the duty day for PT. I know leading up to this deployment there was many a day we performed 2 hours worth of work and then waited around for COB at 1730. Get your soldiers active. Make PT fun. Build camaraderie and cohesiveness. Don't just run bodies into the ground with out gaining anything.

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