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natethegreat
06-04-2015, 03:47 PM
When I was stationed in Germany (Ramstein) there was a vendor on base that sold kilts. They old me that there was guidance saying you could where a kilt in Mess Dress if you could trace your lineage back to Scotland or Ireland. I have heard from several people that they have been to official military functions with people wearing kilts in Mess Dress. Does anyone know what this AFI/regulation is? It's not mentioned anywhere in 36-2903. Thank for the help.

SomeRandomGuy
06-04-2015, 04:03 PM
When I was stationed in Germany (Ramstein) there was a vendor on base that sold kilts. They old me that there was guidance saying you could where a kilt in Mess Dress if you could trace your lineage back to Scotland or Ireland. I have heard from several people that they have been to official military functions with people wearing kilts in Mess Dress. Does anyone know what this AFI/regulation is? It's not mentioned anywhere in 36-2903. Thank for the help.

I don't mind looking this up for you if you could do me a favor. I have spent all morning looking for the key to the approach gate. Maintenance says they gave it to the tower, the tower says they saw it last at supply, and supply says maintenance has it. I'm at a loss for what to do here. I can check on your kilt in uniform thing if you can find the approach gate key. If we don't find it by the end of the day we are going to have to call Col. Sanders at 1-800-225-5532 and let him know.

Absinthe Anecdote
06-04-2015, 04:24 PM
When I was stationed in Germany (Ramstein) there was a vendor on base that sold kilts. They old me that there was guidance saying you could where a kilt in Mess Dress if you could trace your lineage back to Scotland or Ireland. I have heard from several people that they have been to official military functions with people wearing kilts in Mess Dress. Does anyone know what this AFI/regulation is? It's not mentioned anywhere in 36-2903. Thank for the help.

This is 173% true. However, you must carry your family lineage with you at all times in the form of a Scottish Hossenfeffer or an Irish Snipenclagit.

I can sell you kits for both at a reasonable price so you won't have to bother with Colenel Sanders and his approach gate key.

Rollyn01
06-04-2015, 04:50 PM
I don't mind looking this up for you if you could do me a favor. I have spent all morning looking for the key to the approach gate. Maintenance says they gave it to the tower, the tower says they saw it last at supply, and supply says maintenance has it. I'm at a loss for what to do here. I can check on your kilt in uniform thing if you can find the approach gate key. If we don't find it by the end of the day we are going to have to call Col. Sanders at 1-800-225-5532 and let him know.

Actually, that directive has changed. According to the OPORD, he has to fill out a BA-11 Series form to get access to the keys. Why in the hell will you send the man off on a mission with bad intel? What's wrong with you?

Rusty Jones
06-04-2015, 05:12 PM
When I was stationed in Germany (Ramstein) there was a vendor on base that sold kilts. They old me that there was guidance saying you could where a kilt in Mess Dress if you could trace your lineage back to Scotland or Ireland. I have heard from several people that they have been to official military functions with people wearing kilts in Mess Dress. Does anyone know what this AFI/regulation is? It's not mentioned anywhere in 36-2903. Thank for the help.

I'm going to guess that you're an FNG from straight out of basic/tech school, and some SrA has you going around and asking about this.

natethegreat
06-04-2015, 05:27 PM
Wow, sorry I posted this. I guess I'll tell you guys thanks from all the people you weren't being an ass to because you spent the time doing this.

Rusty Jones
06-04-2015, 05:33 PM
Wow, sorry I posted this. I guess I'll tell you guys thanks from all the people you weren't being an ass to because you spent the time doing this.

You just got your turn on MTF just like everyone else does.

Rainmaker
06-04-2015, 05:38 PM
Dude looks like a lady...

Absinthe Anecdote
06-04-2015, 05:53 PM
Dude looks like a lady...

No ranting about diversity or multi-culturalism?

I'm disappointed in you.

Mjölnir
06-04-2015, 06:04 PM
While natethegreat isn't a new poster, he is a low-count poster; rather than using his question to potentially gain a more frequent user, some people just ridiculed his question.

I guess the irony is lost on people that in a week or two there will likely again be complaining about MTF being slow.

Mjölnir
06-04-2015, 06:14 PM
When I was stationed in Germany (Ramstein) there was a vendor on base that sold kilts. They old me that there was guidance saying you could where a kilt in Mess Dress if you could trace your lineage back to Scotland or Ireland. I have heard from several people that they have been to official military functions with people wearing kilts in Mess Dress. Does anyone know what this AFI/regulation is? It's not mentioned anywhere in 36-2903. Thank for the help.

When I was in the Marine Corps I saw people wear kilts at a Marine Corps Birthday Ball a couple times and had heard that there was some vague line in the Uniform Regulation that authorized it for ceremonies etc. The reality was that this was something that some local Commanders allowed and the the particular SgtMaj kind of ignored but was in fact not really authorized. I imagine if you cannot find it in the USAF Uniform Regulation it is very likely the same thing.

natethegreat
06-04-2015, 06:19 PM
Mjolnir, thanks. That is kind of what I have been seeing from Google searches. I was wondering if there was an old reg that said something about it. I have a fascination with traditions that we used to have & forgotten about.

TJMAC77SP
06-04-2015, 06:32 PM
While @natethegreat (http://forums.militarytimes.com/member.php?u=15221) isn't a new poster, he is a low-count poster; rather than using his question to potentially gain a more frequent user that some people just ridiculed his question.

I guess the irony is lost on people that in a week or two there will likely again be complaining about MTF being slow.

You certainly have a point but I didn't read the responses as being mean-spirited. It actually might help him next time someone tells him something that just doesn't sound right.

For what it's worth there used to be an AF unit that wore kilts. Well used to wear kilts. A part of the USAF Reserve Band at Warner Robins AFB (pretty sure they were disbanded in 2012) used to have a drum and pipe unit that wore kilts. I saw them perform a military tattoo ceremony at Tyndall years ago. Pretty impressive.

TJMAC77SP
06-04-2015, 06:34 PM
Mjolnir, thanks. That is kind of what I have been seeing from Google searches. I was wondering if there was an old reg that said something about it. I have a fascination with traditions that we used to have & forgotten about.

One major problem with the USAF is we don't really have any traditions. Every CoS wants to leave his mark on the service so enacts major changes which change shit. Then the next guy comes in and....wash, rinse, repeat.

Absinthe Anecdote
06-04-2015, 07:13 PM
You certainly have a point but I didn't read the responses as being mean-spirited. It actually might help him next time someone tells him something that just doesn't sound right.

For what it's worth there used to be an AF unit that wore kilts. Well used to wear kilts. A part of the USAF Reserve Band at Warner Robins AFB (pretty sure they were disbanded in 2012) used to have a drum and pipe unit that wore kilts. I saw them perform a military tattoo ceremony at Tyndall years ago. Pretty impressive.

I was just looking at a picture of the USAFR Band and while they were wearing kilts, they weren't mixing USAF uniform items with them.

They were wearing a full Highland uniform, so it wasn't a variation of USAF uniform. It was just a costume.

Bos Mutus
06-04-2015, 08:14 PM
One major problem with the USAF is we don't really have any traditions. Every CoS wants to leave his mark on the service so enacts major changes which change shit. Then the next guy comes in and....wash, rinse, repeat.

We have a tradition of changing :-)

Rusty Jones
06-04-2015, 08:30 PM
We have a tradition of changing :-)

That's a good thing. With the exception of blue stuff and enlisted rank on the sleeves of woodland camo, the Air Force hasn't allowed itself adopt progress-inhibiting traditions.

TJMAC77SP
06-04-2015, 11:28 PM
We have a tradition of changing :-)

I suppose that is one way to look at it.

TJMAC77SP
06-04-2015, 11:31 PM
I was just looking at a picture of the USAFR Band and while they were wearing kilts, they weren't mixing USAF uniform items with them.

They were wearing a full Highland uniform, so it wasn't a variation of USAF uniform. It was just a costume.

Really. It seems to me that rank insignia is a uniform item. Of course not really important.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bKz1_1_BOs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GQowA0zupOc

Airborne
06-05-2015, 06:54 AM
Not even trying to be funny. When I was stationed at Mildenhall there were people wearing kilts in Mess Dress. Dont know why or how, didnt think to ask or care. But it being in the UK it was more of the norm so even if it wasnt in the regs people were making it look good so it was allowed.

Absinthe Anecdote
06-05-2015, 11:57 AM
Really. It seems to me that rank insignia is a uniform item. Of course not really important.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bKz1_1_BOs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GQowA0zupOc

They probably have so many different costumes that they have an entire building to keep them in.

I agree, not important, or is it advisable to look at what a band wears as a measure as to what your average airmen can wear.

Bands are performers and clearly have a different set of rules of what they can wear on stage.

http://usafdrumcorps.us/pipeband/images/Lucas.jpg

Absinthe Anecdote
06-05-2015, 12:10 PM
Not even trying to be funny. When I was stationed at Mildenhall there were people wearing kilts in Mess Dress. Dont know why or how, didnt think to ask or care. But it being in the UK it was more of the norm so even if it wasnt in the regs people were making it look good so it was allowed.

If I had a troop that wanted to wear a kilt at a dining-in, I would send them to the committee that was organizing it.

My thinking is that if they could convince the committee to seek the commander's approval before hand, they would be covered.

I wouldn't advise anyone to just show up at a dining-in wearing a kilt without some sort of command approval.

Unless of course, if you have a Hossenfeffer or a Snipenclagit with you.

Mjölnir
06-05-2015, 12:37 PM
Few people can pull of a kilt well ...

https://nerfgunbobbins.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/stormtrooperinkilt.jpg

TJMAC77SP
06-05-2015, 05:40 PM
They probably have so many different costumes that they have an entire building to keep them in.

I agree, not important, or is it advisable to look at what a band wears as a measure as to what your average airmen can wear.

Bands are performers and clearly have a different set of rules of what they can wear on stage.

http://usafdrumcorps.us/pipeband/images/Lucas.jpg

That is the way I always viewed it. I would imagine though that there is or was some written guidelines on the items and wear of the band uniforms.

garhkal
06-08-2015, 03:42 AM
When I was in the Marine Corps I saw people wear kilts at a Marine Corps Birthday Ball a couple times and had heard that there was some vague line in the Uniform Regulation that authorized it for ceremonies etc. The reality was that this was something that some local Commanders allowed and the the particular SgtMaj kind of ignored but was in fact not really authorized. I imagine if you cannot find it in the USAF Uniform Regulation it is very likely the same thing.

I have also seen that happen, mostly at MC balls, and 2 Navy balls too. But whether it was just 'commander's discretion or some obscure rule, i don't know.

And MJ.. Thanks for that pick!

Mjölnir
06-10-2015, 03:24 AM
I have also seen that happen, mostly at MC balls, and 2 Navy balls too. But whether it was just 'commander's discretion or some obscure rule, i don't know.

And MJ.. Thanks for that pick!

Officially (per the Marine Corps Uniform Regulations MCO P1020.34 -- the last version the Marine Corps was on when I was in was 'e' -- P1020.34e), there was no provision for wearing a kilt ... some places just bent the rules.

Also, there is a no-kidding, officialtartan that is registered with the Scottish Register of Tartans for each of the U.S. Armed Forces. I have a bow tie made of the USMC tartan, they also make regular neck ties and kilts of it ...

Marine Corps
http://www.scotlandshop.com/Images/Tartans/us-marine-corps-10oz-wool-tartan-swatch_lg.jpg