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fufu
12-04-2014, 05:37 AM
I've been in 16 years. Pretty much everything has evolved except WAPS. We are still using what is basically a scantron sheet. Are we ever going to move to computerized testing?

I'm guessing we haven't b/c Big Blue is worried about cheating/hacking into the database....but then I think there has to be a database somewhere.

It would take longer I think...I spent less than 5 mins filling in the bubble sheet today....lol

I'm just curious why we haven't started using a computer based waps testing system.

Absinthe Anecdote
12-04-2014, 11:17 AM
I've been in 16 years. Pretty much everything has evolved except WAPS. We are still using what is basically a scantron sheet. Are we ever going to move to computerized testing?

I'm guessing we haven't b/c Big Blue is worried about cheating/hacking into the database....but then I think there has to be a database somewhere.

It would take longer I think...I spent less than 5 mins filling in the bubble sheet today....lol

I'm just curious why we haven't started using a computer based waps testing system.

This is going to sound like another one of my bullshit yarns because it involves Free Masons, but I'm being serious.

For over half my career there were two black Free Masons (AF civilians), that were getting copies of SKT tests and PFE tests and providing them to other Free Masons.

The cheating ring was world-wide and it unraveled in 1999, but had been going on for over a decade.

From what I heard from and OSI agent, a couple of years after the case, they only prosecuted a fraction of the people involved for receiving test material.

Remember when they started putting the test packets in sealed plastic bags? That was in response to the case I'm talking about.

I think you had to shred your test booklet after the test? My memory is fuzzy on that.

Anyway, people will always find a way to cheat, but I'm not too sure what a computer based test would bring.

Why would computer based test make testing better?

Airborne
12-04-2014, 04:42 PM
This is going to sound like another one of my bullshit yarns because it involves Free Masons, but I'm being serious.

For over half my career there were two black Free Masons (AF civilians), that were getting copies of SKT tests and PFE tests and providing them to other Free Masons.

The cheating ring was world-wide and it unraveled in 1999, but had been going on for over a decade.

From what I heard from and OSI agent, a couple of years after the case, they only prosecuted a fraction of the people involved for receiving test material.

Remember when they started putting the test packets in sealed plastic bags? That was in response to the case I'm talking about.

I think you had to shred your test booklet after the test? My memory is fuzzy on that.

Anyway, people will always find a way to cheat, but I'm not too sure what a computer based test would bring.

Why would computer based test make testing better?

Would it make it better? That's subjective. Do I need to spend half a day waiting in line while a civilian makes sure I am who I say I am and fill in bubbles with my name, SSN, AFSC, testing cycle etc. I can have that civilian face match my ID card and pop it in the reader on the computer and off on the test I go. You could perhaps have more "live" questions for those of us who use maps or videos of engines or weapons etc. Humans are humans so anything created by man can be broken by man, there is no perfect system. So youre excuse of people cheating on paper WAPS so we must stick with it is invalid. Create an electronic test, have the 1% get away with cheating and leave it at that.

fufu
12-04-2014, 06:19 PM
Would it make it better? That's subjective. Do I need to spend half a day waiting in line while a civilian makes sure I am who I say I am and fill in bubbles with my name, SSN, AFSC, testing cycle etc. I can have that civilian face match my ID card and pop it in the reader on the computer and off on the test I go. You could perhaps have more "live" questions for those of us who use maps or videos of engines or weapons etc. Humans are humans so anything created by man can be broken by man, there is no perfect system. So youre excuse of people cheating on paper WAPS so we must stick with it is invalid. Create an electronic test, have the 1% get away with cheating and leave it at that.

Thats something I never even considered. Think of the possibilities for to have simulator malfunctions developed by AFSC "experts", you have to diagnose the malfunction and corrective action. Seems like moving to electronic testing could open up a new world of testing possibilities.

sandsjames
12-04-2014, 07:40 PM
Thats something I never even considered. Think of the possibilities for to have simulator malfunctions developed by AFSC "experts", you have to diagnose the malfunction and corrective action. Seems like moving to electronic testing could open up a new world of testing possibilities.

That would cause an overhaul of the entire CFETP system, as well as WAPS, as testable information is only on "knowledge" level (A-D, a-d). This kind of change would require having performance objectives added to the WAPS. That's a pretty big leap. Would it be a good thing? Well, it might, as it would allow those who actually are skilled at application instead of just knowledge to be on a level playing field. But I'd imaging those types of things will stay at the upgrade training level and not the WAPS testing.

BRUWIN
12-05-2014, 06:50 AM
Why would computer based test make testing better?

Because then you could claim computer glitches on why you didn't make it. The same reason why finance pays a Lt Col E-1 pay and gets away with being the ones that screwed up. I wish I had these excuses back in the day.

Absinthe Anecdote
12-05-2014, 11:19 AM
Thats something I never even considered. Think of the possibilities for to have simulator malfunctions developed by AFSC "experts", you have to diagnose the malfunction and corrective action. Seems like moving to electronic testing could open up a new world of testing possibilities.

Great idea! They could even hook up an array of sensors that measures the test taker's VO2 max as they take the test.

I always pushed for a cholesterol test to be added to WAPS, they could easily computerize that too. The computer could take a blood sample from a fingertip sensor on the keyboard.

I never liked how a Fatty McChickenwings type of guy could potentially score the same as me on a paper test.

Rusty Jones
12-05-2014, 11:24 AM
Great idea! They could even hook up an array of sensors that measures the test taker's VO2 max as they take the test.

I always pushed for a cholesterol test to be added to WAPS, they could easily computerize that too. The computer could take a blood sample from a fingertip sensor on the keyboard.

I never liked how a Fatty McChickenwings type of guy could potentially score the same as me on a paper test.

In all seriousness, though, the big problem is that they don't factor PT scores in. The Army and Marine Corps are the only two services that do. Imagine how many more Airmen might actually hit the gym if they knew that an extra pushup or a few more seconds off of their run might make the difference in whether or not they get promoted.

Absinthe Anecdote
12-05-2014, 11:39 AM
In all seriousness, though, the big problem is that they don't factor PT scores in. The Army and Marine Corps are the only two services that do. Imagine how many more Airmen might actually hit the gym if they knew that an extra pushup or a few more seconds off of their run might make the difference in whether or not they get promoted.

I'm with you there, I always wanted PT, and even eating habits to count for promotion points.

I lobbied hard to get a cholesterol test added to the PT assessment, but I never found an audience to take it seriously. I wasted my time writing letters to USAF HQ.

Wish I had thought to write a letter a week to the Senate Armed Services Committee, like that Andy Dufresne character from Shawshank Redemption.

giggawatt
12-06-2014, 12:25 PM
I always thought having your PT score factored in would be a good idea. Of course, if I had it my way, I wouldn't make have too much weight. I'd maybe give it as much weight as decorations. Perhaps a max of 5 points for 95+ and go from there.

Absinthe Anecdote
12-06-2014, 12:49 PM
I always thought having your PT score factored in would be a good idea. Of course, if I had it my way, I wouldn't make have too much weight. I'd maybe give it as much weight as decorations. Perhaps a max of 5 points for 95+ and go from there.

That sounds very reasonable, but there would be so much crying from the Fatty McChickenwings crowd, if that was ever tried.

Heck, I would make it so that you could challenge any other member to a PT test at any time. If you get the higher score, you take their stripes.