PDA

View Full Version : Unit CC bad decision



sharkhunter
08-13-2013, 10:46 PM
I've seen this happen a few times at my base:
A unit commander has recommend an airman to be discharge from the service. The airman goes before an Admin Discharge Board, but the Admin Discharge Board decides to keep the individual in the service.

My question, since the airman was not discharge and allowed to continue to serve, does it look bad on the unit commander for making this recommendaton or is it simply not documented anywhere on his records?

Ripcord
08-14-2013, 12:05 AM
Are you talking about the CC's records?

HMT
08-14-2013, 01:04 AM
IMO, doesn't make the CC look bad, it was just a recommendation. Probably will not go into any official record for the CC but a lesson learned in his/her future decisions.

Ripcord
08-14-2013, 01:33 AM
Most CC's won't pursue discharge unless legal thinks there is a case. A discharge board is allot like a courts marshal. The decision is up to the board members who may have seen things differently then the CC did. ADCs are good at there job too so that may have helped allot.

Chief_KO
08-14-2013, 12:11 PM
There is no paper trail (OPR or PRF) that would document something like this. Like said, the CC was making a recommendation based upon the situation and advice from ADC (and hopefully his SNCO leadership CCF/CCM).

20+Years
08-14-2013, 01:20 PM
Hmmm. I bet I know what the CCs reccomendation will be when reenlistment comes around.

Pullinteeth
08-14-2013, 01:21 PM
Most CC's won't pursue discharge unless legal thinks there is a case. A discharge board is allot like a courts marshal. The decision is up to the board members who may have seen things differently then the CC did. ADCs are good at there job too so that may have helped allot.

They don't have to pursue anything...all they have to do is put not reccomended on the 418...

BRUWIN
08-14-2013, 04:12 PM
Very little follows as CC unless it somehow reflects on their OER. Substantiated IG complaints don't even follow them. The situation is just corrected and the CC moves on. How it hurts them is entirely dependent on how the CC's boss decides to handle it. And it was my experience that most bosses give them a free ride on a one off mistake.

However, there is one thing that can really help/hurt a CC...the Unit Climate Assessment. Their bosses are required to read those and if the surveys are consistent across the board this can really give the CC's boss insight into a CC's leadership...whether it be good or bad. For example...if a squadron of 150 has over 100 surveys of questionable actions by a CC...the CCs boss now has a vested interest in fixing the problem because the CC's continued behavior could eventually bite his or her's boss in the ass, especially if it was noted during climate surveys

Don't let your troops blow off Unit Climate Assessment surveys. It's the one time a CC's boss can get a good gauge on CC and senior enlisted leadership. The AF is now beginning to take these more seriously every year. I know it was also a good gauge for me and where I needed to improve. A CC didn't have to let me read those surveys, but fortunately all my CCs wanted me into the loop regardless since it helped them if I had insight into what needed to be looked at. I had only one CC that didn't let me into the loop...and that was because she refused to have a climate assessment done since it wasn't in her best interest to get one done. However, they are required by reg.

Ripcord
08-14-2013, 07:15 PM
They don't have to pursue anything...all they have to do is put not reccomended on the 418...

Depends on if the CC wants to deal with the person until their enlistment is up or not. If they have a year or two left and the circumstances warrant it a CC may pursure discharge/separation. Crap troops can be a poison pill to a unit.

Shaken1976
08-14-2013, 08:32 PM
Very little follows as CC unless it somehow reflects on their OER. Substantiated IG complaints don't even follow them. The situation is just corrected and the CC moves on. How it hurts them is entirely dependent on how the CC's boss decides to handle it. And it was my experience that most bosses give them a free ride on a one off mistake.

However, there is one thing that can really help/hurt a CC...the Unit Climate Assessment. Their bosses are required to read those and if the surveys are consistent across the board this can really give the CC's boss insight into a CC's leadership...whether it be good or bad. For example...if a squadron of 150 has over 100 surveys of questionable actions by a CC...the CCs boss now has a vested interest in fixing the problem because the CC's continued behavior could eventually bite his or her's boss in the ass, especially if it was noted during climate surveys

Don't let your troops blow off Unit Climate Assessment surveys. It's the one time a CC's boss can get a good gauge on CC and senior enlisted leadership. The AF is now beginning to take these more seriously every year. I know it was also a good gauge for me and where I needed to improve. A CC didn't have to let me read those surveys, but fortunately all my CCs wanted me into the loop regardless since it helped them if I had insight into what needed to be looked at. I had only one CC that didn't let me into the loop...and that was because she refused to have a climate assessment done since it wasn't in her best interest to get one done. However, they are required by reg.

A few years ago on a Unit Climate Assessment our Chief got blasted for several things he had done. Things like having a "fun run" when the CC was on leave because he knew the CC hated them. Tasking airmen with something and not notifying supervisors of the shop, making people doing maintenance change in and out of Blues between jobs, doing open ranks at 0530 when the CC was on leave, blasting individuals in mass emails over something rather trivial, and much more. Anytime you tried to talk to him about an issue such as tasking your airman without letting you know...he said he was a chief and could do what he wanted. It was bad. But everyone blasted him on the UCA. He then called a meeting with all enlisted and chewed us all out. Told us that the UCA was not the place to address issues with him.

BRUWIN
08-14-2013, 09:18 PM
A few years ago on a Unit Climate Assessment our Chief got blasted for several things he had done. Things like having a "fun run" when the CC was on leave because he knew the CC hated them. Tasking airmen with something and not notifying supervisors of the shop, making people doing maintenance change in and out of Blues between jobs, doing open ranks at 0530 when the CC was on leave, blasting individuals in mass emails over something rather trivial, and much more. Anytime you tried to talk to him about an issue such as tasking your airman without letting you know...he said he was a chief and could do what he wanted. It was bad. But everyone blasted him on the UCA. He then called a meeting with all enlisted and chewed us all out. Told us that the UCA was not the place to address issues with him.

LOL...well he is wrong. Nobody is off limits in a UCA. Your Chief sounds like a real douche.

Shaken1976
08-14-2013, 09:20 PM
LOL...well he is wrong. Nobody is off limits in a UCA. Your Chief sounds like a real douche.

He has since retired. He was an ass.

BRUWIN
08-14-2013, 09:27 PM
He has since retired. He was an ass.

Sounds like he may have gotten his dick slapped when he was informed of the UCA results. It's funny...you can find out a lot of different things about people on those things if a CC decides to put you in the loop. Of course, one has to take the one off comments with a grain of salt. However, you can definitely identify some negative trends on some people in supervisory positions.