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BOSS302
04-23-2013, 01:12 AM
How stupid and wasteful does this story make the AF look? How the hell does a $348,00 30 ton tractor just get forgotten about?

http://www.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123345311

Tak
04-23-2013, 01:18 AM
How stupid and wasteful does this story make the AF look? How the hell does a $348,00 30 ton tractor just get forgotten about?

http://www.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123345311

WTF: "Though Harrison will not receive a monetary award..."

JD2780
04-23-2013, 01:22 AM
How stupid and wasteful does this story make the AF look? How the hell does a $348,00 30 ton tractor just get forgotten about?

http://www.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123345311

I wonder who the tool major was that said the Msgt was simply doing his job. No the MSgt went beyond. He could've just shrugged his shoulders and said it wasn't his problem.

Tak
04-23-2013, 01:34 AM
I wonder who the tool major was that said the Msgt was simply doing his job. No the MSgt went beyond. He could've just shrugged his shoulders and said it wasn't his problem.

Should the MSgt be praised or the guy he replaced busted

JD2780
04-23-2013, 01:37 AM
Should the MSgt be praised or the guy he replaced busted

Why can't both happen? The MSgt wasn't complacent and executed like a we all think SNCOs should but seldom do. Mean while the guy he replaced pulled the usual, I'm out sucka, don't worry about it. As a matter of fact it could've been a few replacements before it was noticed.

BOSS302
04-23-2013, 01:49 AM
Why can't both happen? The MSgt wasn't complacent and executed like a we all think SNCOs should but seldom do. Mean while the guy he replaced pulled the usual, I'm out sucka, don't worry about it. As a matter of fact it could've been a few replacements before it was noticed.

Exactly. I hope there is a "behind the scenes" focus on who the hell forgot about a 30-ton tractor that is worth over a quarter of a million dollars. The Air Force wants its people to take fiscal responsibility seriously; it needs to show it is serious by resolving this issue and properly punishing those who let this equipment fall through the cracks. Their incompetence almost led to a wasteful $350K purchase + a needless cargo mission that would have cost the taxpayer tens of thousands of dollars.

If people can lose stripes and careers because of their waist size or push-ups, then people can SHOULD lose stripes and careers over the neglectful tracking of Air Force materiel.

imported_Joker76
04-23-2013, 02:04 AM
to all those who want someone to be held responsible, have you forgotten that is was ultimately the commanders responsibility. that being said, nothing will happen.

JD2780
04-23-2013, 02:08 AM
Exactly. I hope there is a "behind the scenes" focus on who the hell forgot about a 30-ton tractor that is worth over a quarter of a million dollars. The Air Force wants its people to take fiscal responsibility seriously; it needs to show it is serious by resolving this issue and properly punishing those who let this equipment fall through the cracks. Their incompetence almost led to a wasteful $350K purchase + a needless cargo mission that would have cost the taxpayer tens of thousands of dollars.

If people can lose stripes and careers because of their waist size or push-ups, then people can SHOULD lose stripes and careers over the neglectful tracking of Air Force materiel.

As an A1C I had signed for over 1.2 million in equipment and it all had to be operationally ready all the time. If I lost I'm sure something would've happened to me.

JD2780
04-23-2013, 02:09 AM
to all those who want someone to be held responsible, have you forgotten that is was ultimately the commanders responsibility. that being said, nothing will happen.

Haven't forgotten, I remember having my CC sign my R14. However, the CC does delegate.

Tak
04-23-2013, 02:44 AM
Okay here's a quick story. We had a mx sq who had a horrible safety program.
It was bad and commander wasn't concerned. Well when their subpar report was sent to wing Cc,
It had a "push note" from grp cc. It talked about making improvements, but mostly
Addressed a subpar nco who failed in his duty and was removed. I told my boss
I was happy they fessed up, he said bullshit, its a commanders program and they
Scapegoated an nco, who simply was appointed by cc to help his program, just a
Unit safety poc. It opened my eyes to how quickly leaders throw off blame for commander
Failed programs to enlisted.

Chief_KO
04-23-2013, 03:00 AM
In 1994 I took over the computer maintenance shop in Korea, we maintained the AN/TYQ-23 Modular Control Element (MCE) along with the AN/TSC-110 Adaptable Surface Interface Terminal (ASIT). As I was going over the open jobs and the supply logs, I noticed all the parts ordered for the MCE were ordered "shop use" vice against the end item (MCE). I asked the guys why that was (since shop use was the lowest priority and some items had been order for over a year). The answer was "the system rejected if we ordered against the end item. So, I started to figure out why. Our shop CA/CRL (equipment account) did not have the MCE on it, so I went to all the other workcenters to see if the MCE was on theirs. Nope, it was on nobody's account. The MCE was valued at $16M. So, I filled out a AF form 2005, with FOB (Found On Base) as the action and turned in the form to base supply. The next day I got a call from Mr Pak 2, who told me "You don't have...It cost $16M...you don't have". Well, I went to base supply to meet Mr Pak 2, and took him to see the MCE (which was a large green tactical shelter). Seems that when the system arrived (2 years before) the unit had a "gung ho" commander who had the unit pick up the system at the port (bypassing base supply and equipment management). Once we got it on account we were able to reorder all the parts against the end item (high priority) and got everything fixed in about 3 months. How was it possible that no one (not PACAF, not unit leadership, not the item manager) ever noticed this oversight before TSgt_KO got there? Guess Forrest Gump had it right: "Stupid is as Stupid Does"

LogDog
04-23-2013, 04:01 AM
How stupid and wasteful does this story make the AF look? How the hell does a $348,00 30 ton tractor just get forgotten about?

http://www.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123345311
There should be a computer transaction in their supply system records identifying when and who authorized it to be dropped of the equipment records.

VFFTSGT
04-23-2013, 04:06 AM
I had an $500,000 piece of equipment get forgotten about and sat at a deployed location for several years unused.

If it wasn't for the fact that it was a low density item tracked (somewhat) at home station...who knows where it would be today.

LogDog
04-23-2013, 04:22 AM
I oversaw our Medical Equipment Management Office (MEMO) at RAF Lakenheath. All equipment was on our MEMO Equipment Records and each section had an NCO or officer who signed for the equipment in their section. My policy with my MEMO personnel was if any equipment custodian gave you any problems you couldn't handle or needed help with, they were to come straight to me. The policy I established was when a new equipment custodian takes over a MEMO account, they must inventory every item with the current custodian before we finalized the paperwork. We asked the new custodian, "Did you physically see and touch every equipment item and was it all there?" If they answered yes, we'd transfer the account to the new custodian. If they said no, then we find out why and wouldn't transfer the account until every item was accounted for; no exceptions.

In the late 90s, One of my SSgts had a TSgt who was PCSing, with his family, back to the states said he couldn't find a defibrillator he was signed for. He was trying to get the SSgt to sign-off his group out-processing sheet but she wouldn't do it because he couldn't locate the defibrillator. He was raising a stink so she brought him to me and explained the problem. I told him he either finds the defibrillator or we'll call the Orderly Room and place a hold on his travel. He told us we couldn't do that and he wasn't going to look for the equipment. I directed the SSgt to notify the Orderly Room and place a hold on his travel. The next he was in my office complaining about the disruption it was causing his family. I told him to find the missing equipment with the new custodian and once found we'd lift the travel hold. The following day he and the new custodian came in and said the found the equipment; it was in another section and he had that section sign an AF Form 1297, Temporary Hand Receipt. The new custodian confirmed this and signed for the equipment account. We contacted the Orderly Room and cleared him and he and his family PCS'd on schedule.

The problem with a lot of "missing" equipment is one custodian will tell the new custodian the equipment is located across base and to go ahead and sign for it, which they mistakenly do. Equipment custodians need to conduct their own inventory of their equipment every quarter to keep on top of it. If the loan out an item then they need to get a 1297 signed to protect themselves. It's not the equipment office responsibility to keep track of the equipment in the work section, it's the person who signed for the equipment responsibility.

F4CrewChick
04-23-2013, 09:32 AM
if there was some kind of monetary award for finding savings, say a fraction of a percent of the savings, a lot more "mistakes" would turn up. People need incentives when they don't feel appreciated and especially when it's about somebody else's money. It's called "a reward."

VFFTSGT
04-23-2013, 09:41 AM
if there was some kind of monetary award for finding savings, say a fraction of a percent of the savings, a lot more "mistakes" would turn up. People need incentives when they don't feel appreciated and especially when it's about somebody else's money. It's called "a reward."

True story, one of the reasons I am burned out is continually fixing other people's screw ups and substandard performances.

I get the same paycheck and the same EPR rating. Why make 100 times more the extra effort to jump through the red tape to fix something like this?

The person that screwed it up was probably too busy organizing a bake sale.*

*I cannot find the story but this is a jab at a story about a Captain organizing a bake sale or something to that effect in a deployed location...think it was Iraq if I remember right. I remember we talked about it on here a couple years ago.

Added to my list of things I won't miss.

Absinthe Anecdote
04-23-2013, 12:09 PM
True story, one of the reasons I am burned out is continually fixing other people's screw ups and substandard performances.

I get the same paycheck and the same EPR rating. Why make 100 times more the extra effort to jump through the red tape to fix something like this?

The person that screwed it up was probably too busy organizing a bake sale.*

*I cannot find the story but this is a jab at a story about a Captain organizing a bake sale or something to that effect in a deployed location...think it was Iraq if I remember right. I remember we talked about it on here a couple years ago.

Added to my list of things I won't miss.

A combat zone bake sale?

Depending on the details, that is pure gold in an OPR/EPR. I’m confident that I could craft that into a very powerful bullet.

The trick is not to call it a bake sale when you write it up.

VFFTSGT
04-23-2013, 02:23 PM
A combat zone bake sale?

Depending on the details, that is pure gold in an OPR/EPR. I’m confident that I could craft that into a very powerful bullet.

The trick is not to call it a bake sale when you write it up.

Yeah, I tried to find the article. I thought it was on AF Times but it may have been af.mil. It was a popular thread on here, but probably disappeared after one of the many forum "upgrades."

imported_SergeantJack
04-23-2013, 02:41 PM
Though Harrison will not receive a monetary award, as do those who submit money-saving ideas through the Air Force's Innovative Development Through Employee Awareness Program, he's glad he was able to save his service a substantial sum.

"As you know, the budget is tight," he said, "and just knowing I saved the Air Force this money is a great feeling."

Said no NCO, ever.

Tak
04-23-2013, 02:48 PM
When the camera rolls,
The bullshit flows.

Tak
04-23-2013, 02:56 PM
New #1 contender

http://www.kdab.afcent.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123277726

Airmen from the 451 ESFS Tactical Security Element organized a fundraiser known as "Barbells for Boobs," which gave participants the opportunity to compete against each other in a clean and jerk contest

Pullinteeth
04-23-2013, 03:50 PM
Why can't both happen? The MSgt wasn't complacent and executed like a we all think SNCOs should but seldom do. Mean while the guy he replaced pulled the usual, I'm out sucka, don't worry about it. As a matter of fact it could've been a few replacements before it was noticed.

I am curious how they know exactly when it fell off the inventory if they didn't even know it was missing?


New #1 contender

http://www.kdab.afcent.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123277726

Airmen from the 451 ESFS Tactical Security Element organized a fundraiser known as "Barbells for Boobs," which gave participants the opportunity to compete against each other in a clean and jerk contest

How in the hell did that make it past the SARC or whomever does the PC Police thing these days?

JD2780
04-23-2013, 04:21 PM
I am curious how they know exactly when it fell off the inventory if they didn't even know it was missing?



How in the hell did that make it past the SARC or whomever does the PC Police thing these days?

You got back over to past inventories and find out pretty easily. Oh and cops are on to something there!!!

Bumble78
04-23-2013, 04:30 PM
Maybe someone drove it there from another base, did anyone think of that? Or they could have towed a plane from one base to that base and left it there. Everyone is so quick to jump on the band wagon of it fell off the inventory, but what if it is hand receipted out at another base and someone just borrowed it? There could be a hand receipt floating around for it.

SomeRandomGuy
04-23-2013, 04:39 PM
Maybe someone drove it there from another base, did anyone think of that? Or they could have towed a plane from one base to that base and left it there. Everyone is so quick to jump on the band wagon of it fell off the inventory, but what if it is hand receipted out at another base and someone just borrowed it? There could be a hand receipt floating around for it.

My brother is an auditor for the Army Guard. On one audit they found a unit that had acquired a different ice machine from the one they were supposed to have. I suspect this equipment could have a similar issue. A piece of equipment like this had to come from somewhere. It did not simply appear out of thin air.

imported_CLSE
04-23-2013, 05:10 PM
How stupid and wasteful does this story make the AF look? How the hell does a $348,00 30 ton tractor just get forgotten about?

http://www.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123345311

Multiple levels of fail there.

First, how in the hell do you miss one of these? They are f**king huge. "No, I never noticed the gigantic, 30 foot long, 15 foot wide vehicle with 6 foot tall wheels just sitting in the yard there..."

Then there's the maintenance guys - there aren't a lot of vehicles that can tow a C-17, so the first time somebody needed to tow a bird, they would have been looking for something big, like, maybe one of these...

Logical progression from there should be pretty simple - we didn't bring one with us, so there should be one here...where is it? If you don't see one, start asking around - "Have you seen a gigantic, 30 foot long, 15 foot wide vehicle with 6 foot tall wheels? No, it doesn't have a gun on it and it doesn't move sea cans."

Then there are the loggies... a 100,000 pound (It's 50 tons, not 30) piece of a equipment takes up a lot of space on any aircraft and land transport isn't exactly simple - it requires a special transporter, it's a high-value item and I would expect that it would be considered highly pilferable (it is self-propelled, after all).

So, you'd think that it would be pretty obvious when it arrived on base - Aerial Port guy: "We have a gigantic, 30 foot long, 15 foot wide vehicle with 6 foot tall wheels. Where do you want us to put this thing?"

KellyinAvon
04-23-2013, 11:26 PM
There should be a computer transaction in their supply system records identifying when and who authorized it to be dropped of the equipment records.

This is a vehicle. "Back in the day" the fleet manager had them on the CA/CRL and they were tracked with REMS (registered equipment management system, not just Bob) details that had the vehicle reg number. I was last in Equipment Mgt in 1996, cross-trained out of Supply in 99. DannyJ is the resident 2S071 in the present day, opposed to "back in the day".

And yes, there is a transaction when accountability is dropped.

Outback 1982
04-24-2013, 05:20 PM
Doesnt surprise me one bit. Over a million dollars in aircraft parts were found in forgotten storage in Asia. Almost 100 WW2 Army helmets, blankets and glass IV bottles were found during an AFSO-21 event in Texas. When PSAB closed it was incredible at what was left behind, not to mention what was discovered during the clean up.

MadRussian
05-03-2013, 08:38 AM
to all those who want someone to be held responsible, have you forgotten that is was ultimately the commanders responsibility. that being said, nothing will happen.

#1. But since the commander derives his or her authority from the President, it was really the POTUS's fault! But since the POTUS is elected by the American people, then that means it was really our fault! And on and on. Pass the blame, right?

#2. Let's assume you're right. That means the commander needs to start baby-sitting everything that's delegated to every Airman and NCO in the unit; it's the commander's responsibility, after all. Then people start whining that nobody trusting them with any responsibility and treating them like children.

The commander trusted the equipment custodian to do the right thing. This MSgt did; kudos to him. The previous custodian did not; that person should be held accountable.

Your comment was just a cheap shot implying that commanders are never held accountable. You must not have been paying very close attention for the past few years.

loggie94
05-03-2013, 10:00 AM
What's not said in the article, but can be assumed by the picture...is that this item was down at Camp A*(&#, and not up at XXX Airbase where the 386th is located. This piece was likely one of the left-overs of over $100M of the assets that were pulled out of Iraq and awaiting transfer to Afghanistan or back to the US.

A couple of rotations back, one of our folks saw "something-air-forcy" (her words) in the pile bound for scrap at the same Camp A*(&#. She did a quick NSN check and 'discovered' an unused [we were quoted $5M??] radar system for an F-15 about to be scrapped. Needless to say, the AF had a VERY happy item manager when we called and asked who wanted it. But, silly me for not calling in the PA to write a story about it. I'll have to call the young SSgt and appologize for not making a news story about her doing her job.

My continued beef with our asset management systems is that the only work when you follow the 15 back-assward steps required to maintain the database. Few checks and balances to prevent it getting lost if you don't "follow procedures"...