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BOSS302
04-20-2013, 11:45 AM
I would like a painless "PCS Orders Process" with MPF.


No losing my documents
No excuses as to why my documents were lounging in someone's desk drawer for two weeks
No attitude from the MPF staff
No having to get the CoC involved because I'm fast-approaching my projected departure date with no orders in hand


Already, I have experienced two of the above with the local MPF. To their credit, the two SSgts who have talked to me on the phone have been helpful and nice, but the nice attitudes can only do so much for me before I start to wonder, "Why can't someone do their damn job and get me my orders?" I'm at the point of out-processing now where orders are required, but no orders in hand = me not able to do what I need to do in order to PCS.

FLAPS
04-20-2013, 12:16 PM
And FIX the Virtual Outprocessing Checklist!
- Don't list a phone number that was disconnected 8 months prior
- Don't list a building number that was bulldozed two years ago
- Don't answer the phone and tell me the ONLY person who can clear me out of virtual is on leave for a week
- Don't tell me to give you a good date when you should delete my name from the global, THEN forget. This happens every PCS!
- Don't list a person's actual name as a POC, then fail to update that info 10 POCs later.
- Don't state that I have to fill out some piece of paper that requires several signatures, then tell me when I show up that I never really had to do that because it's no longer required.
- Don't tell me I have to I have to request Terminal leave through LEAVEWEB prior to my Finance visit, when the system doesn't let you request that leave until 30 days out from the start date...which falls only 9 days prior to Final Out-Processing. In other words, you forced Leaveweb on everyone without beta testing first. Great job!
- Don't state in your virtual instructions that a visit to your office is required. They call it VIRTUAL outprocessing for a reason. Unless you need to stick your finger in my ass to check my prostate, then you don't need to see my "F"ing face.
- This one is my favorite. The LIBRARY needs to clear me out of virtual? This base has a library? Where's that? I thought they closed those back in the 90s!

Rainmaker
04-20-2013, 05:04 PM
I would like a painless "PCS Orders Process" with MPF.


No losing my documents
No excuses as to why my documents were lounging in someone's desk drawer for two weeks
No attitude from the MPF staff
No having to get the CoC involved because I'm fast-approaching my projected departure date with no orders in hand


Already, I have experienced two of the above with the local MPF. To their credit, the two SSgts who have talked to me on the phone have been helpful and nice, but the nice attitudes can only do so much for me before I start to wonder, "Why can't someone do their damn job and get me my orders?" I'm at the point of out-processing now where orders are required, but no orders in hand = me not able to do what I need to do in order to PCS.

Das Raciss...

Sperry1989
04-22-2013, 09:28 PM
And FIX the Virtual Outprocessing Checklist!
- Don't list a phone number that was disconnected 8 months prior
- Don't list a building number that was bulldozed two years ago
- Don't answer the phone and tell me the ONLY person who can clear me out of virtual is on leave for a week
- Don't tell me to give you a good date when you should delete my name from the global, THEN forget. This happens every PCS!
- Don't list a person's actual name as a POC, then fail to update that info 10 POCs later.
- Don't state that I have to fill out some piece of paper that requires several signatures, then tell me when I show up that I never really had to do that because it's no longer required.
- Don't tell me I have to I have to request Terminal leave through LEAVEWEB prior to my Finance visit, when the system doesn't let you request that leave until 30 days out from the start date...which falls only 9 days prior to Final Out-Processing. In other words, you forced Leaveweb on everyone without beta testing first. Great job!
- Don't state in your virtual instructions that a visit to your office is required. They call it VIRTUAL outprocessing for a reason. Unless you need to stick your finger in my ass to check my prostate, then you don't need to see my "F"ing face.
- This one is my favorite. The LIBRARY needs to clear me out of virtual? This base has a library? Where's that? I thought they closed those back in the 90s!

Could not agree more. There is nothing virtual about virtual outprocessing. It is an automated checklist at best.

SomeRandomGuy
04-23-2013, 01:16 PM
Could not agree more. There is nothing virtual about virtual outprocessing. It is an automated checklist at best.

Virtual outprocessing works sometimes. The problem with it is that most agencies on the checklist do not understand the system or are too busy with other things to figure it out. I have been on both sides of the Virtual Outprocessing checklist. When I first started working customer service at Finance the instructions in virtual outprocessing (for a PCS) said to bring a copy of your orders to finance. Once you arrived at finance we collected the orders and asked for your final out date. If you did not want an advance that was simply all there was to it. As the finance technician I would collect the orders and process the necessary transactions. I also had to give a copy of the orders to the one person in our office who had access to clear people from virtual outprocessing. When I asked why only one person could clear people or how to get access no one seemed to know. That is the point where I started asking questions. It turns out that all you need to do in order to get access is ask the nice people at MPF. Once I found this out I got access for everyone in customer service.

Now that I had access I started recieving emails from the system. I would usually get around 100 auto generated emails from the system letting me know about people who had broken their suspense or not yet been cleared. When I asked other people in my office what they were doing about these emails I found out that most of the people had setup a rule in Outlook to auto-delete these messages because otherwise it filled their email up. I also found out that if you have access to clear people in virtual outprocessing you can get a copy of the PCS orders without ever asking the member. At this point I ended up changing the instructions on Virtual Outprocessing to tell people to simply email us the date they plan on leaving. I also started working the emails of people who had busted their suspense. It actually made the virtual outprocessing system virtual again.

The key take away from all of this is that virtual outprocessing can be virtual if people would use the system for what it is designed for. When someone is outprocessing MPF should list all the required outprocessing items on the checklist. At that point it is the agency's responsibility to clear the person. One example mentioned above was the library. When the person at the library sees your name pop up on their list they should check to see if you have any items checked out. If not they should clear you from the list. If you do have something out the agency should contact you and let you know about it. The idea of virtual outprocessing is to save everyone a lot of time. The sad part is that everyone is simply "too busy" to do their job which end the wastes more of everyone's time.

FLAPS
04-23-2013, 01:36 PM
Virtual outprocessing works sometimes. The problem with it is that most agencies on the checklist do not understand the system or are too busy with other things to figure it out. I have been on both sides of the Virtual Outprocessing checklist. When I first started working customer service at Finance the instructions in virtual outprocessing (for a PCS) said to bring a copy of your orders to finance. Once you arrived at finance we collected the orders and asked for your final out date. If you did not want an advance that was simply all there was to it. As the finance technician I would collect the orders and process the necessary transactions. I also had to give a copy of the orders to the one person in our office who had access to clear people from virtual outprocessing. When I asked why only one person could clear people or how to get access no one seemed to know. That is the point where I started asking questions. It turns out that all you need to do in order to get access is ask the nice people at MPF. Once I found this out I got access for everyone in customer service.

Now that I had access I started recieving emails from the system. I would usually get around 100 auto generated emails from the system letting me know about people who had broken their suspense or not yet been cleared. When I asked other people in my office what they were doing about these emails I found out that most of the people had setup a rule in Outlook to auto-delete these messages because otherwise it filled their email up. I also found out that if you have access to clear people in virtual outprocessing you can get a copy of the PCS orders without ever asking the member. At this point I ended up changing the instructions on Virtual Outprocessing to tell people to simply email us the date they plan on leaving. I also started working the emails of people who had busted their suspense. It actually made the virtual outprocessing system virtual again.

The key take away from all of this is that virtual outprocessing can be virtual if people would use the system for what it is designed for. When someone is outprocessing MPF should list all the required outprocessing items on the checklist. At that point it is the agency's responsibility to clear the person. One example mentioned above was the library. When the person at the library sees your name pop up on their list they should check to see if you have any items checked out. If not they should clear you from the list. If you do have something out the agency should contact you and let you know about it. The idea of virtual outprocessing is to save everyone a lot of time. The sad part is that everyone is simply "too busy" to do their job which end the wastes more of everyone's time.

Thanks for being one of the few people who actually gives a shit and makes things better! Reminds me of when MPF once told me that in order to get short tour credit (ribbon), I was required to hand carry a copy of my completed t-voucher to their office. Simply emailing a copy of the pcs orders (to/from the short tour) wasn't acceptable. Better yet, they could have verified my tour in milpds. I sent a WTF email directly to their CC, which quickly took care of the issue. Just another stupid rule that could have been fixed with a little initiative on the part of the MPF technicians.

BOSS302
04-23-2013, 02:20 PM
I visited an organization today that was listed on my out-processing checklist. The instructions were clear: "Visit our office with the completed form to be cleared out of virtual".

When I arrived, the guy behind the counter asked if I was less than thirty days out. I responded, "No". He told me, "Well come back then". After I asked him why these instructions were not in the out-processing checklist, why I just wasted my time and his, the guy's response was, "I don't know what to tell you, that's just the system and how it works around here".

Great attitude, great customer service, great professionalism. Thus far, this has been an incredibly frustrating out-processing experience. Between the local MPF's ineptitude and the other organizations whose professionalism is on-par with a pack of junkyard dogs, I'm getting fed-up.

VFFTSGT
04-23-2013, 02:28 PM
Could not agree more. There is nothing virtual about virtual outprocessing. It is an automated checklist at best.

It works well at some bases. Building number, phone numbers, and instructions are maintained by the POC for that particular item. IME, people granted access to vMPF OP Administrator actions have no clue how to update their information.

If the responsible people don't maintain, then it is like everything else...crap.

But as far as orders...that's a cluster everywhere I have been.




When I arrived, the guy behind the counter asked if I was less than thirty days out. I responded, "No". He told me, "Well come back then". After I asked him why these instructions were not in the out-processing checklist, why I just wasted my time and his, the guy's response was, "I don't know what to tell you, that's just the system and how it works around here".

"The system" has an option to tell you when you need to complete the task, from anytime to 30, 60, 90 days out. He is a moron that doesn't know how to use the system/OP task he has administrator access too.

SomeRandomGuy
04-23-2013, 02:33 PM
I visited an organization today that was listed on my out-processing checklist. The instructions were clear: "Visit our office with the completed form to be cleared out of virtual".

When I arrived, the guy behind the counter asked if I was less than thirty days out. I responded, "No". He told me, "Well come back then". After I asked him why these instructions were not in the out-processing checklist, why I just wasted my time and his, the guy's response was, "I don't know what to tell you, that's just the system and how it works around here".

Great attitude, great customer service, great professionalism. Thus far, this has been an incredibly frustrating out-processing experience. Between the local MPF's ineptitude and the other organizations whose professionalism is on-par with a pack of junkyard dogs, I'm getting fed-up.

Does the organization you visited have an ICE (Interactive Customer Evaluation?) website? The reason I ask is because I found that system is awesome for getting things changed. As a finance technician I cannot tell you how many times we go our us handed to us by the commander for ridiculous processes. At one we had a separation/retirement checklist which had to be done in addition to the virtual outprocessing checklist. It had all the same places listed and required the person to go to all the places which were supposed to be done virtually. Someone got pissed off and filed an ICE complaint which went to the wing commander. Wing commander reads complaint which says "why does finance have checklist which duplicates virtual checklist?" Wing comander reads complaint and asks CPTS commander. CPTS commander calls SomeRandomGuy into his office.

CPTS Commander: Why do we have a separate checklist?
SomeRandomGuy: Well Sir, I have no idea I will check on that and get back to you...

SomeRandomGuy pulls copy of checklist and determines that hard copy and virtual checklist were exact same thing. Hard copy checklist gets deleted that very same day and problem is solved.

It is kind of sad that it takes customer complaints to fix these things but customer service people do not always see things from the customer perspective. In the case above the reason we had two checklists was because the hard copy was around long before the virtual checklist and no one ever bothered to change it. Until someone complains to the right people it never gets fixed.

BOSS302
04-23-2013, 02:38 PM
It works well at some bases. Building number, phone numbers, and instructions are maintained by the POC for that particular item. IME, people granted access to vMPF OP Administrator actions have no clue how to update their information.

If the responsible people don't maintain, then it is like everything else...crap.

But as far as orders...that's a cluster everywhere I have been.




"The system" has an option to tell you when you need to complete the task, from anytime to 30, 60, 90 days out. He is a moron that doesn't know how to use the system/OP task he has administrator access too.

That's something I can agree with you on :hug

BOSS302
04-23-2013, 02:39 PM
Does the organization you visited have an ICE (Interactive Customer Evaluation?) website? The reason I ask is because I found that system is awesome for getting things changed. As a finance technician I cannot tell you how many times we go our us handed to us by the commander for ridiculous processes. At one we had a separation/retirement checklist which had to be done in addition to the virtual outprocessing checklist. It had all the same places listed and required the person to go to all the places which were supposed to be done virtually. Someone got pissed off and filed an ICE complaint which went to the wing commander. Wing commander reads complaint which says "why does finance have checklist which duplicates virtual checklist?" Wing comander reads complaint and asks CPTS commander. CPTS commander calls SomeRandomGuy into his office.

CPTS Commander: Why do we have a separate checklist?
SomeRandomGuy: Well Sir, I have no idea I will check on that and get back to you...

SomeRandomGuy pulls copy of checklist and determines that hard copy and virtual checklist were exact same thing. Hard copy checklist gets deleted that very same day and problem is solved.

It is kind of sad that it takes customer complaints to fix these things but customer service people do not always see things from the customer perspective. In the case above the reason we had two checklists was because the hard copy was around long before the virtual checklist and no one ever bothered to change it. Until someone complains to the right people it never gets fixed.

Honestly, the ICE websites and "feedback forms" with drop-boxes in these offices are of little use. With the rotation here, a lot of people have a, "Whatever, I'm almost out of here", a "FIGMO!", or "Pass it on to the new guy" kind of attitude.

The Wing/CC has a monthly Facebook "town hall meeting" and that seems to do more to resolve issues than anything else.

VFFTSGT
04-23-2013, 03:00 PM
Honestly, the ICE websites and "feedback forms" with drop-boxes in these offices are of little use. With the rotation here, a lot of people have a, "Whatever, I'm almost out of here", a "FIGMO!", or "Pass it on to the new guy" kind of attitude.

The Wing/CC has a monthly Facebook "town hall meeting" and that seems to do more to resolve issues than anything else.

I have used the ICE websites, I think a total of 4 times now. And everyone provided immediate and positive resolutions.

TVANSCOT
04-23-2013, 03:25 PM
CBPO did have its merits, you still needed to go to some other buildings, but CBPO worked well for me.

Demaskee
04-24-2013, 02:29 AM
I have had some pretty bad PCS nightmares. What terrifies me this time is the fact that I'm leaving in less than 60 days and NOTHING has gone wrong. I don't know whether I should be thrilled or scared to death the other shoe is is going to drop soon.

imported_UncommonSense
04-24-2013, 02:30 PM
CBPO did have its merits, you still needed to go to some other buildings, but CBPO worked well for me.

Get out of here with your old people talk. Next you'll be spouting off about AFR 35-10, the difference between Security Police and Law Enforcement, brown boots, olive drab fatigues, porkchop sideburns, beer vending machines in the dorms, and people getting counseled for smoking the reefer while at work.

FLAPS
04-24-2013, 02:58 PM
Get out of here with your old people talk. Next you'll be spouting off about AFR 35-10, the difference between Security Police and Law Enforcement, brown boots, olive drab fatigues, porkchop sideburns, beer vending machines in the dorms, and people getting counseled for smoking the reefer while at work.

Don't forget about the long strip of reflective tape down the middle of the back of the fatigue field jacket!

BOSS302
04-25-2013, 02:40 PM
I love MPF. Honestly.

I leave in June; my departure date in my "virtual" out-processing checklist reads as such. Apparently, the experts at MPF have processed my stuff for a departure date in AUGUST.

How? How does that happen? Never once did I put ANY date with "Aug", "August", or "08" on any of my forms. Nowhere in my vMPF does my current assignment or my follow-on have any relation to the month of August. My DAS was in June, not August. There is absolutely nothing about anything in regards to this assignment that has anything to do with the month of August.

How does this happen, that six weeks later after turning in all documents, I suddenly am being told, "Oh we thought you were leaving in August...that's what we were processing..."?! Isn't there some sort of final authority at AFPC who would say, "Umm, WTF are you all doing over there, this guy leaves in June."? How can something so easy get cocked-up so brilliantly?

The answer from MPF is that, if the orders have the wrong departure and RNLTD dates, just to have them amended. The "technician" on the phone states that, "Oh yeah it's easy, we can do that for you in a few days at most." Not impressed and not at all hopeful.