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Rusty Jones
05-17-2013, 03:59 PM
My bad; I see that the question is about morning after pills and the article is about abortion pills.

Anyhow, I'd have to question the intelligence of a guy who does that. If you can carry morning after pills with you, then you can carry condoms with you.

Measure Man
05-17-2013, 04:00 PM
I realize that, but what's the harm? Condoms are not 100%. I'm not trying to discuss the morality of protected sex, just the consequences of having a girl unknowingly take a pill that, by all accounts, isn't dangerous and isn't actually killing anything shouldn't be an issue.

I always wondered about those stats...you know, they say condoms are 98% effective. So, I'm thinking, "great, if I have sex 100 times this year, she'll only get pregnant twice?" WTF? I could do that without condoms.

sandsjames
05-17-2013, 04:02 PM
My bad; I see that the question is about morning after pills and the article is about abortion pills.

Anyhow, I'd have to question the intelligence of a guy who does that. If you can carry morning after pills with you, then you can carry condoms with you.

I realize that, but what's the harm? Condoms are not 100%. I'm not trying to discuss the morality of protected sex, just the consequences of having a girl unknowingly take a pill that, by all accounts, isn't dangerous and isn't actually killing anything shouldn't be an issue.

Pullinteeth
05-17-2013, 04:22 PM
Yep, I see why you might think its hypocrisy. Nothing however says I have to have the same belief on the two subjects. I do agree as the poster above, MY guns are not intended to end human life. The pill is...every time.

Might want to take oh....30 seconds or so and do a Google search OR actually read the article... This pill was actually developed to treat gastric ulcers. It is also very commonly used to assist childbirth. It has been used for both for decades...

Banned
05-17-2013, 05:07 PM
Wow McJohn, good post. That is one of the most logical, convincing posts I have seen so far.

As usual though, Joe just continued to cloud his post with hate of those who think differently. Poor Joe.


Guns are restricted to adults or an adult can purchase a rifle for a child. Are you seeing it JB or should I color a picture for you?

No hate at all. I just find it fascinating that people so concerned for the life of a fetus will so quickly get defefensive about guns.

JD2780
05-17-2013, 05:11 PM
No hate at all. I just find it fascinating that people so concerned for the life of a fetus will so quickly get defefensive about guns.

How is it fascinating?

Banned
05-17-2013, 05:21 PM
How is it fascinating?

That you demand people's lives be controlled by the government to protect fetuses. But your ability to buy weapons and ammunition shouldn't be inconvenienced in any way, no matter how many REAL people die.

Pullinteeth
05-17-2013, 05:34 PM
No hate at all. I just find it fascinating that people so concerned for the life of a fetus will so quickly get defefensive about guns.

This has to be one of your most irrational arguments to date. These people believe that a fetus is a person and should be protected by the same laws that protect everyone that meets you from killing you. A belief that murder is wrong has nothing to do with the Constitutional right to bear arms.


That you demand people's lives be controlled by the government to protect fetuses. But your ability to buy weapons and ammunition shouldn't be inconvenienced in any way, no matter how many REAL people die.

So you think murder should be legal? After all, laws protecting the lives of other people that you (or anyone else) want dead is "controlling."

Banned
05-17-2013, 05:37 PM
This has to be one of your most irrational arguments to date. These people believe that a fetus is a person and should be protected by the same laws that protect everyone that meets you from killing you. A belief that murder is wrong has nothing to do with the Constitutional right to bear arms.

Christians are strange creatures indeed. So we should protect fetuses, but not protect people - adults, born living children - from being slaughtered by assault weapons every day? Really?


So you think murder should be legal? After all, laws protecting the lives of other people that you (or anyone else) want dead is "controlling."

First off - don't turn this argument around on me. These Christians are ruthless and heartless hypocrites, don't turn it around and claim that its ME saying real people dying is all good.

That's the exact argument these "loving" Christians are making - that they are oh so concerned about the life of a fetus - but literally do not give a shit about the actual people who are killed by gun violence every day.

Magic Sky Man forbid that a Christian should be even slightly inconvenienced when it comes to putting holes on paper, or hunting a deer.

JD2780
05-17-2013, 06:27 PM
That you demand people's lives be controlled by the government to protect fetuses. But your ability to buy weapons and ammunition shouldn't be inconvenienced in any way, no matter how many REAL people die.

Guns are already restricted joe. Full auto you can't buy without special permits, can buy a pistol unless you're 21, carry permits, CCWs, I can keep going if you would like.

Banned
05-17-2013, 06:36 PM
Guns are already restricted joe. Full auto you can't buy without special permits, can buy a pistol unless you're 21, carry permits, CCWs, I can keep going if you would like.

Where did I say they weren't restricted? Once again, you're changing the subject to get attention off your own double standard.

Pullinteeth
05-17-2013, 06:43 PM
Christians are strange creatures indeed. So we should protect fetuses, but not protect people - adults, born living children - from being slaughtered by assault weapons every day? Really?

First off - don't turn this argument around on me. These Christians are ruthless and heartless hypocrites, don't turn it around and claim that its ME saying real people dying is all good.

That's the exact argument these "loving" Christians are making - that they are oh so concerned about the life of a fetus - but literally do not give a shit about the actual people who are killed by gun violence every day.

Magic Sky Man forbid that a Christian should be even slightly inconvenienced when it comes to putting holes on paper, or hunting a deer.

You are just as small-minded, petty, heartless, and ruthless as the very people you condemn. You are unable to even comprehend that to some, a fetus is considered a person just as you are. In fact, legally, a fetus is also considered a person-thus when someone kills a pregnant woman they are sometimes charged with two counts of murder. YOU are the one that intimated that murder laws should be held in the same regard as gun control.


Guns are already restricted joe. Full auto you can't buy without special permits, can buy a pistol unless you're 21, carry permits, CCWs, I can keep going if you would like.

Cheese and rice, did you do ANY research before you posted? There are in fact states in which you can go into a gun store and purchase a fully automatic rifle any day of the week. If you are from Vermont, you can purchase a handgun before you turn 21. Several states allow open carry with no permit. Move to Alaska and you don't need a concealed weapons permit. Please, go on but for the love of all that is holy do some research first.

JD2780
05-17-2013, 06:56 PM
Where did I say they weren't restricted? Once again, you're changing the subject to get attention off your own double standard.

Not really. I'm showing there isn't a double standard. Nice try.

JD2780
05-17-2013, 06:57 PM
You are just as small-minded, petty, heartless, and ruthless as the very people you condemn. You are unable to even comprehend that to some, a fetus is considered a person just as you are. In fact, legally, a fetus is also considered a person-thus when someone kills a pregnant woman they are sometimes charged with two counts of murder. YOU are the one that intimated that murder laws should be held in the same regard as gun control.



Cheese and rice, did you do ANY research before you posted? There are in fact states in which you can go into a gun store and purchase a fully automatic rifle any day of the week. If you are from Vermont, you can purchase a handgun before you turn 21. Several states allow open carry with no permit. Move to Alaska and you don't need a concealed weapons permit. Please, go on but for the love of all that is holy do some research first.

Are there not controls in place to track who is buy what guns, not including gun shows, they need stricter back ground checks at those.

Pullinteeth
05-17-2013, 07:08 PM
Are there not controls in place to track who is buy what guns, not including gun shows, they need stricter back ground checks at those.

Absolutely and if you had said THAT, you would have been correct but you didn't...you said;


Guns are already restricted joe. Full auto you can't buy without special permits, can buy a pistol unless you're 21, carry permits, CCWs, I can keep going if you would like.

Which is not true...

20+Years
05-17-2013, 07:18 PM
Hmmm. Lets see.

From Joe in this thread:
1. "Yes because a pill and a gun are totally comparable."
2. "Yup. Because a pill that could - at worst - be used to kill a fetus... is completely comparable with a weapon that could be used to kill dozens of people by a single shooter."

...
...

3. "No hate at all. I just find it fascinating that people so concerned for the life of a fetus will so quickly get defefensive about guns."


Weak...

Measure Man
05-17-2013, 07:53 PM
I think one way to allow men to understand the "Women's right to choose what to do with her body" argument is to imagine that a national databasee identifies you as the only (or most) eligible kidney donor for someone. The only way to save this person's life is to take one of your kidneys.

Should you have the right to choose whether or not your body will be used to sustain the life of that other person, even if it's your child? Or should the government be able to mandate that you do it. I'm pretty sure no one would be in favor of that, but I could be wrong. Yes, I'm sure most of use probably would do it for our child...but should it be legally compulsory? How about for a stranger?

Yes, I do realize it is not a perfect analogy because there is the whole "blah blah you chose to have sex, etc" or abortion is actually "killing the baby" rather than just "letting it die" or whatever....but just the idea of the government legislating a requirement for one person to use their body to sustain the life of another, if you can stretch your brain just a little to see the parallel.

Banned
05-18-2013, 02:37 AM
Hmmm. Lets see.

From Joe in this thread:
1. "Yes because a pill and a gun are totally comparable."
2. "Yup. Because a pill that could - at worst - be used to kill a fetus... is completely comparable with a weapon that could be used to kill dozens of people by a single shooter."

...
...

3. "No hate at all. I just find it fascinating that people so concerned for the life of a fetus will so quickly get defefensive about guns."


Weak...

Just an observation. You're soooo concerned about the fetus - but when it comes to protecting people already alive and walking around - Magic Sky Man forbid you be even slightly inconvenienced when purchasing a weapon (mandatory background checks, gun safety classes, etc)

Banned
05-18-2013, 06:31 AM
You are just as small-minded, petty, heartless, and ruthless as the very people you condemn. You are unable to even comprehend that to some, a fetus is considered a person just as you are. In fact, legally, a fetus is also considered a person-thus when someone kills a pregnant woman they are sometimes charged with two counts of murder. YOU are the one that intimated that murder laws should be held in the same regard as gun control.

I would assume the "two counts of murder" thing is mostly an appeal to emotion on the part of the legal system.

However, my point still stands. The people who pretend to get all bleeding heart about fetuses are very often the same people who don't give a shit how many people are killed by guns. An astonishing double standard - and one of the main reasons I don't take American Christianity seriously.

These zealots don't actually care about the fetus - its about controlling women... a goal that Christianity, and most other religions - consider very important.

JD2780
05-18-2013, 11:22 AM
Occupy Wall Street - kids protesting big bad corporations while video taping it on all their smart phone they bought from big bad corporations. The double standard.

That's why I can't take protesters seriously.

Banned
05-18-2013, 09:21 PM
Occupy Wall Street - kids protesting big bad corporations while video taping it on all their smart phone they bought from big bad corporations. The double standard.

That's why I can't take protesters seriously.

Your argument would have merit if you could find me one protestor against corporations or technology.

I think we can all agree corruption and fraud on an industrial scale are bad things.

Measure Man
05-18-2013, 09:49 PM
Occupy Wall Street - kids protesting big bad corporations while video taping it on all their smart phone they bought from big bad corporations. The double standard.

That's why I can't take protesters seriously.

I don't think they are protesting the existence of corporations, but the corruption and greed in them.

So, would it be a double standard to complain about the govt., but then gladly accept a govt. paycheck or retirement check?

Would it be a double standard to protest the govt., but drive on govt. roads to get there?

Banned
05-18-2013, 11:11 PM
I don't think they are protesting the existence of corporations, but the corruption and greed in them.

So, would it be a double standard to complain about the govt., but then gladly accept a govt. paycheck or retirement check?

Would it be a double standard to protest the govt., but drive on govt. roads to get there?

Great, now little Johnny might see a topless woman, and grow up to be a drug dealer and an atheist!

Banned
05-18-2013, 11:15 PM
https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc1/375078_444335215658394_1256496412_n.jpg

Greg
05-18-2013, 11:57 PM
I don't think they are protesting the existence of corporations, but the corruption and greed in them.

So, would it be a double standard to complain about the govt., but then gladly accept a govt. paycheck or retirement check?

Would it be a double standard to protest the govt., but drive on govt. roads to get there?

The reasoning behind the government constructing these roads?

Rusty Jones
05-19-2013, 12:14 AM
Occupy Wall Street - kids protesting big bad corporations while video taping it on all their smart phone they bought from big bad corporations. The double standard.

That's why I can't take protesters seriously.

Tea Party - the people that the two quotes in my signature are talking about.

sandsjames
05-19-2013, 12:26 AM
Tea Party - the people that the two quotes in my signature are talking about.

Really? I didn't know the Tea Party was around when those quotes were made. Guess I better brush up on my history/politics.

Or did you mean to say that, in your view, those two comments relate to the Tea Party? That's probably more correct...but don't let accuracy deter you.

sandsjames
05-19-2013, 12:27 AM
Great, now little Johnny might see a topless woman, and grow up to be a drug dealer and an atheist!

Glad to know you think it's ok to decide what's good for my child. And I thought that was owned by the Christian right calling in and complaining to the FCC.

Rusty Jones
05-19-2013, 12:55 AM
Really? I didn't know the Tea Party was around when those quotes were made. Guess I better brush up on my history/politics.

Or did you mean to say that, in your view, those two comments relate to the Tea Party? That's probably more correct...but don't let accuracy deter you.

Are you really that confused, or are you trying to confuse me?

Here's a video you might want to take a look at:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFXXNzim1Y0

Don't look at his speech in context of race. Think of the "the master" as the corporations and the executives thereof. Think of "the house negro" as middle and lower class members of the Tea Party. Think of "the field negro" as middle and lower class participants in the Occupy Movement.

The concept of "the house negro" mentality isn't new, and has existed as long as human civilization itself.

sandsjames
05-19-2013, 12:58 AM
Are you really that confused, or are you trying to confuse me?

Here's a video you might want to take a look at:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFXXNzim1Y0

Don't look at his speech in context of race. Think of the "the master" as the corporations and the executives thereof. Think of "the house negro" as middle and lower class members of the Tea Party. Think of "the field negro" as middle and lower class participants in the Occupy Movement.

The concept of "the house negro" mentality isn't new, and has existed as long as human civilization itself.

I'm not confused. I was making a simple tongue in cheek remark that the Tea Party was NOT around when those quotes were made so those quotes could not have been about the Tea Party, as you stated they were.

edit: Oh...and I'll watch a Malcolm X video around the same time I watch a David Duke video.

Rusty Jones
05-19-2013, 01:11 AM
I'm not confused. I was making a simple tongue in cheek remark that the Tea Party was NOT around when those quotes were made so those quotes could not have been about the Tea Party, as you stated they were.

edit: Oh...and I'll watch a Malcolm X video around the same time I watch a David Duke video.

I've watched David Duke videos. I'm not above that. So, go ahead, watch. And you'll see what I'm getting at when I said that Tea Party members fit the quotes in my sig.

sandsjames
05-19-2013, 01:25 AM
I've watched David Duke videos. I'm not above that. So, go ahead, watch. And you'll see what I'm getting at when I said that Tea Party members fit the quotes in my sig.

I understand the point you are making. Again, my comment was completely tongue in cheek about the phrasing of the statement.

And, really, I'm not interested in anything either of those has to say.

Measure Man
05-19-2013, 01:26 AM
The reasoning behind the government constructing these roads?

I don't understand what this comment is getting at. Are you asking why the govt. builds roads?

Greg
05-19-2013, 01:42 AM
I don't understand what this comment is getting at. Are you asking why the govt. builds roads?

The government built the roads for the benefit of the masses. The masses then drive the economic engine, the very same engine the government benefits from.
It's a two-way street. Without one, the other would have a difficult time existing.

RobotChicken
05-19-2013, 05:42 AM
:spy So what has this to do with the AF??? No morning after pills for sex assault victims? (when everyone is still hung over?) :bathbaby

Banned
05-19-2013, 06:46 AM
Are you really that confused, or are you trying to confuse me?

Here's a video you might want to take a look at:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFXXNzim1Y0

Don't look at his speech in context of race. Think of the "the master" as the corporations and the executives thereof. Think of "the house negro" as middle and lower class members of the Tea Party. Think of "the field negro" as middle and lower class participants in the Occupy Movement.

The concept of "the house negro" mentality isn't new, and has existed as long as human civilization itself.

My black power history is a bit fuzzy - but in regard to the whole class warfare thinig - I do recall Malcom X saying he believed the inevitable confrontation between ruling elite and the workers would be unrelated to race.


Glad to know you think it's ok to decide what's good for my child.

Children are going to be exposed to ideas and things their parents don't necessarily approve of. Bad parenting can't be compensated by increased government regulation of everybody else.

sandsjames
05-19-2013, 12:57 PM
My black power history is a bit fuzzy - but in regard to the whole class warfare thinig - I do recall Malcom X saying he believed the inevitable confrontation between ruling elite and the workers would be unrelated to race.



Children are going to be exposed to ideas and things their parents don't necessarily approve of. Bad parenting can't be compensated by increased government regulation of everybody else.

Being exposed to "ideas and things" is a good thing. Having others determine what is acceptable for my children to be exposed to is another thing altogether.

Banned
05-19-2013, 06:29 PM
Being exposed to "ideas and things" is a good thing. Having others determine what is acceptable for my children to be exposed to is another thing altogether.

That's all fine and dandy, but the government is not your personal parenting tool to control everyone else.

Measure Man
05-20-2013, 02:09 AM
The government built the roads for the benefit of the masses. The masses then drive the economic engine, the very same engine the government benefits from.
It's a two-way street. Without one, the other would have a difficult time existing.

Okay...I agree with that.

My point was that it is no more hypocritical for OWS protesters to use corporate products than it is for govt. protesters to use things the govt. provides.

RobotChicken
05-20-2013, 03:28 AM
The government built the roads for the benefit of the masses. The masses then drive the economic engine, the very same engine the government benefits from.
It's a two-way street. Without one, the other would have a difficult time existing.
:spy Govt spends $billions on roads, then we spend $billions on 4x4's to get off the F'in roads!! :lol

JD2780
05-20-2013, 10:47 AM
That's all fine and dandy, but the government is not your personal parenting tool to control everyone else.

But women should be allowed slip a boob now and then out in public because its simply an archaic law that keeps women down. Yea my kids should be exposed to that as to make sure I'm not using the gov as a parenting tool.

sandsjames
05-20-2013, 01:49 PM
That's all fine and dandy, but the government is not your personal parenting tool to control everyone else.

I don't want it to control everyone else, and I also don't want it to control my children.

Pullinteeth
05-20-2013, 04:22 PM
I would assume the "two counts of murder" thing is mostly an appeal to emotion on the part of the legal system.

However, my point still stands. The people who pretend to get all bleeding heart about fetuses are very often the same people who don't give a shit how many people are killed by guns. An astonishing double standard - and one of the main reasons I don't take American Christianity seriously.

These zealots don't actually care about the fetus - its about controlling women... a goal that Christianity, and most other religions - consider very important.

This post from the same person that tried to use a faulty study to "prove" that violence is on the decline?

Banned
05-20-2013, 04:45 PM
But women should be allowed slip a boob now and then out in public because its simply an archaic law that keeps women down. Yea my kids should be exposed to that as to make sure I'm not using the gov as a parenting tool.

While I am amused by how terrified you are of a female nipple - I say again - the government is not your personal parenting tool to make sure your kids never see anything that you don't like.


I don't want it to control everyone else, and I also don't want it to control my children.

Nobody is controlling your children. Go back to sleep.


This post from the same person that tried to use a faulty study to "prove" that violence is on the decline?

I remember this conversation. Weren't you the one who insisted that worldwide violence rates can't be declining because we invaded Iraq?

Banned
05-20-2013, 05:11 PM
https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/969901_10151605876705155_573743500_n.jpg

Pullinteeth
05-20-2013, 05:14 PM
While I am amused by how terrified you are of a female nipple - I say again - the government is not your personal parenting tool to make sure your kids never see anything that you don't like.

I remember this conversation. Weren't you the one who insisted that worldwide violence rates can't be declining because we invaded Iraq?

Agree 100%

Nope that wasn't me.... I was the one that said the study was inherently flawed because it only tallied deaths related to violence and what would have killed someone 100 years ago (say a sucking chest wound) might just leave a kick @$$ scar today...


https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/969901_10151605876705155_573743500_n.jpg


Are you seriously trying to say there is no right or wrong? Seriously? Sticking with your whole murder is OK thing I see...

Banned
05-20-2013, 05:30 PM
Agree 100%

Nope that wasn't me.... I was the one that said the study was inherently flawed because it only tallied deaths related to violence and what would have killed someone 100 years ago (say a sucking chest wound) might just leave a kick @$$ scar today...

Okay I stand corrected - NOW I remember that. My response to that is - we could easily take the same argument in reverse. They didn't used to have machine guns and chemical weapons - its easier now to kill on an industrial scale. Also, if your intent is to kill someone, no amount of medical technology can stop you. Beheading or burning someone still works just as well as it did 500 years ago.



Are you seriously trying to say there is no right or wrong? Seriously? Sticking with your whole murder is OK thing I see...

People know murder is wrong, with or without religion. "Sin" is a different matter entirely - a tool used by religions to manipulate people into feeling guilty.

Got the hots for that girl next door? SINNER! YOU'RE GOING TO HELL!

"Think you might be gay? SINNER! GOING TO HELL!

"Envious of the neighbor's new car? SINNER! GOING TO HELL!

JD2780
05-20-2013, 05:55 PM
While I am amused by how terrified you are of a female nipple - I say again - the government is not your personal parenting tool to make sure your kids never see anything that you don't like.



Nobody is controlling your children. Go back to sleep.



I remember this conversation. Weren't you the one who insisted that worldwide violence rates can't be declining because we invaded Iraq?

I'm not terrified of nipples. I love boobs. I'm also an adult male that can go watch them when I feel like it. I don't want my kids being shown them just walking down the street. Call that scared if you want. I call it good parenting and decency.

Banned
05-20-2013, 06:24 PM
I'm not terrified of nipples. I love boobs. I'm also an adult male that can go watch them when I feel like it. I don't want my kids being shown them just walking down the street. Call that scared if you want. I call it good parenting and decency.

I say again - the government is not your personal parenting tool. You have a problem with it... well... that sucks then. We're not going to spend public resources to make sure your kids are never going to be exposed to a nipple.

JD2780
05-20-2013, 06:28 PM
I say again - the government is not your personal parenting tool. You have a problem with it... well... that sucks then. We're not going to spend public resources to make sure your kids are never going to be exposed to a nipple.

No but it is my job as a parent to voice my position concerning my children. I guess we should just let people have blow jobs in public places. Easy Tak, that last one was sarcasm.

Just let XXX movies get sold to minors.

You've completely lost your mind on this one, or you're just doing a good job as devils advocate. You might earn an Oscar.

JD2780
05-20-2013, 06:49 PM
Nobody is suggesting we allow sex acts in public.



Not necessary. We've got this thing called the internet. Perhaps you've heard of it. Most kids have seen porn - whether you like it or not.

And frankly, I would prefer kids watch porn over them watching people get tortured, shot, and blown up - like what is seen in a typical war flick.

Did you know that in American movies, you're more likely to see a woman murdered, than to see her boobs? In my book, that says a lot about our culture!



Yeah, you're going apeshit over a nipple in public. And I'M the one who's losing my mind apparently.


Apeshit? I guess we have different definitions of apeshit. Mine being, flying off the handle ranting and screaming. Yours definition is being forced to read somebody else's opposing view.


Yes, the Internet is full of porn. Does that make it ok?

Oh and I don't let my kids watch movies where women are being murdered, nor do I let them watch war movies. Nice try with the examples though JB.

Banned
05-20-2013, 06:51 PM
No but it is my job as a parent to voice my position concerning my children. I guess we should just let people have blow jobs in public places. Easy Tak, that last one was sarcasm.

Nobody is suggesting we allow sex acts in public.


Just let XXX movies get sold to minors.

Not necessary. We've got this thing called the internet. Perhaps you've heard of it. Most kids have seen porn - whether you like it or not.

And frankly, I would prefer kids watch porn over them watching people get tortured, shot, and blown up - like what is seen in a typical war flick.

Did you know that in American movies, you're more likely to see a woman murdered, than to see her boobs? In my book, that says a lot about our culture!


You've completely lost your mind on this one, or you're just doing a good job as devils advocate. You might earn an Oscar.

Yeah, you're going apeshit over a nipple in public. And I'M the one who's losing my mind apparently.

JD2780
05-20-2013, 06:55 PM
Nobody is suggesting we allow sex acts in public.



Not necessary. We've got this thing called the internet. Perhaps you've heard of it. Most kids have seen porn - whether you like it or not.

And frankly, I would prefer kids watch porn over them watching people get tortured, shot, and blown up - like what is seen in a typical war flick.

Did you know that in American movies, you're more likely to see a woman murdered, than to see her boobs? In my book, that says a lot about our culture!



Yeah, you're going apeshit over a nipple in public. And I'M the one who's losing my mind apparently.


Apeshit? I guess we have different definitions of apeshit. Mine being, flying off the handle ranting and screaming. Yours definition is being forced to read somebody else's opposing view.


Yes, the Internet is full of porn. Does that make it ok?

Oh and I don't let my kids watch movies where women are being murdered, nor do I let them watch war movies. Nice try with the examples though JB.

Banned
05-20-2013, 06:58 PM
Apeshit? I guess we have different definitions of apeshit. Mine being, flying off the handle ranting and screaming. Yours definition is being forced to read somebody else's opposing view.

In my book, jumping from an exposed nipple to "blowjobs in public" is going apeshit.


Yes, the Internet is full of porn. Does that make it ok?

Sure.


Oh and I don't let my kids watch movies where women are being murdered, nor do I let them watch war movies. Nice try with the examples though JB.

In my book - when I have kids, I see my job as being there to provide context for what my kids see out in the world. If you have a different viewpoint, that's fine. As long as you don't use the government to enforce it.

JD2780
05-20-2013, 07:15 PM
In my book, jumping from an exposed nipple to "blowjobs in public" is going apeshit.



Sure.



In my book - when I have kids, I see my job as being there to provide context for what my kids see out in the world. If you have a different viewpoint, that's fine. As long as you don't use the government to enforce it.


I'm surprised you didn't like my technique as far as nipples to blow jobs since you like to take things way out of context and go to the extreme with them.

I guess you would be OK with your daughter seeing a grown mans wang while walking down the street.

Banned
05-20-2013, 07:21 PM
I'm surprised you didn't like my technique as far as nipples to blow jobs since you like to take things way out of context and go to the extreme with them.

I guess you would be OK with your daughter seeing a grown mans wang while walking down the street.

No, actually I wouldn't. In fact, I think it would do the country a lot of good if we abandoned Christian principles and stopped associating nudity with sex. Nudity should be left at exactly that - nudity. The human body is a beautiful thing - we should stop being ashamed of it just because of an ancient book of fairy tales.

sandsjames
05-20-2013, 07:21 PM
People know murder is wrong, with or without religion. "Sin" is a different matter entirely - a tool used by religions to manipulate people into feeling guilty. Do they? What if it's justified? Many people feel it's ok to kill someone in self defense. Some feel it's ok to kill for revenge. So I don't think a blanket statement of "people know murder is wrong" is accurate.


Got the hots for that girl next door? SINNER! YOU'RE GOING TO HELL!

"Think you might be gay? SINNER! GOING TO HELL!

"Envious of the neighbor's new car? SINNER! GOING TO HELL!None of these is a Christian belief. We are all sinners. That doesn't mean we are all going to hell. I don't know any sect of Christianity that believes any of these things will send you to hell. They do all, however, teach you that you need to realize you are wrong and ask for forgiveness. But stick to your fear mongering.

sandsjames
05-20-2013, 07:23 PM
I say again - the government is not your personal parenting tool. You have a problem with it... well... that sucks then. We're not going to spend public resources to make sure your kids are never going to be exposed to a nipple.

How much time do you spend to come up with these ridiculous statements? I have no problem with it on television because I can block stations/not watch if I choose. I cannot, however, be expected to never go outside.

Banned
05-20-2013, 07:23 PM
Do they? What if it's justified? Many people feel it's ok to kill someone in self defense. Some feel it's ok to kill for revenge. So I don't think a blanket statement of "people know murder is wrong" is accurate.

Hence why I specified "murder", and not just "killing".


None of these is a Christian belief. We are all sinners. That doesn't mean we are all going to hell. I don't know any sect of Christianity that believes any of these things will send you to hell. They do all, however, teach you that you need to realize you are wrong and ask for forgiveness. But stick to your fear mongering.

So you don't know of a single sect of Christianity that follows the bible? Interesting. So its okay to be envious of your neighbor's possessions, lust after his wife, and be gay?

sandsjames
05-20-2013, 07:25 PM
Nobody is suggesting we allow sex acts in public.
Why not? It's not up to the government to determine what I can and can't do in pubic. Sex is a natural act.

sandsjames
05-20-2013, 07:30 PM
Hence why I specified "murder", and not just "killing".
Is there a difference? Not in some people's minds. There is still much discussion on whether any killing is right or wrong, no matter the circumstance.



So you don't know of a single sect of Christianity that follows the bible? Interesting. So its okay to be envious of your neighbor's possessions, lust after his wife, and be gay?

It's not ok to do these things. However, doing these things does not damn us to hell. Nowhere does the New Testament say that. What it says is that we need to repent for these things. Even then, it doesn't necessarily say we are going to hell if we don't repent. That's all left up to the judgment. Maybe you should try reading the bible and understanding the religion before you start trying to tell others what it actually says.

sandsjames
05-20-2013, 07:36 PM
Some - including Christ - held this belief. However, most people don't - because survival at times requires self defense, up to and including killing. I'd like to see your stats on "most".




And this is where Christianity - and most other religions - fail. These religions try to guilt us into feeling shame over feelings and emotions we have no control over. There is NOTHING wrong with lust or anger. Nothing at all. Its only bad if we act on these feelings and harm someone else. The point is that we should be trying to control it. We should avoid situations, as much as possible, that could lead to these things. No guilt, just trying to do better.




"All fall short of the glory of god" - you WILL go to hell unless you're "saved". What's debated is what the criteria is for salvation. Can a mass murderer still go to heaven if he repents? Can a nice guy still go to hell just because he never heard of Jesus? That's a question debated over and over to no avail over the centuries. Absolutely. We do not know the criteria for salvation. I can't answer whether a mass murderer can or not. Not up to me. As a matter of fact, I can't answer any of these questions. It's not up to me to judge.


Why even bother? Why worry about all the religious crap and just do the right thing without fear of divine punishment?I have no fear of divine punishment. I'll use this comparison. Growing up my parents spanked me. However, I didn't have fear of the punishment. I had "fear" of disappointing them and not trying my best to lead my life the way I was taught.

Banned
05-20-2013, 07:38 PM
Is there a difference? Not in some people's minds. There is still much discussion on whether any killing is right or wrong, no matter the circumstance.

Some - including Christ - held this belief. However, most people don't - because survival at times requires self defense, up to and including killing.


It's not ok to do these things.

And this is where Christianity - and most other religions - fail. These religions try to guilt us into feeling shame over feelings and emotions we have no control over. There is NOTHING wrong with lust or anger. Nothing at all. Its only bad if we act on these feelings and harm someone else.


However, doing these things does not damn us to hell. Nowhere does the New Testament say that. What it says is that we need to repent for these things. Even then, it doesn't necessarily say we are going to hell if we don't repent. That's all left up to the judgment. Maybe you should try reading the bible and understanding the religion before you start trying to tell others what it actually says.

"All fall short of the glory of god" - you WILL go to hell unless you're "saved". What's debated is what the criteria is for salvation. Can a mass murderer still go to heaven if he repents? Can a nice guy still go to hell just because he never heard of Jesus? That's a question debated over and over to no avail over the centuries.

Why even bother? Why worry about all the religious crap and just do the right thing without fear of divine punishment?