PDA

View Full Version : Extension..Retrain..Re-Enlist = How much SRB?



thegoodguy
01-07-2010, 01:59 AM
I'm on a 2 year extension for my retraining. When I graduate I'll get a 6 for a SRB. If I reenlist for 5 years will that count as 6*5*Base Pay or will it be 6*3*Base Pay since I'll still be on an extension?

imported_Gigglendorf
01-07-2010, 04:29 AM
It will be 6 x (number of months of newly obligated service) x (Base Pay) / 12

The last time I reenlisted, the contract itself was EXPLICIT about what the number of newly obligated months was.

Remember that 50% of the bonus is paid up front as a down payment, and that the Federal Government will withhold 28% of that against your income tax debt. You will also owe tax debt to your state, as per the state's laws. So, you will receive 36% of the value (minus state tax withholding) sometime after all the paperwork is finalized.

The process you are using, though now standard, is a direct violation of the intent of the SRB program. The program was designed to provide an incentive for fully qualified people to stay in a career field and save the USAF the expenditure of replacing them. You ARE a replacement.

But, again, this is the modern standard of behavior . . ..

takthekak
01-07-2010, 04:34 AM
When I was on an extension back in '00, I reenlisted for 6 years and they
deducated the years of my extension and only paid me based on 4 years...

Not sure what they do now...Whatever it is, I bet it doesn't benefit you...

BRUWIN
01-07-2010, 06:09 AM
The process you are using, though now standard, is a direct violation of the intent of the SRB program.

This is very true. I can only hope that the large influx of new people coming into my career field are coming into it for more reasons than the just SRB. I recently had one retrainee that couldn't do the job. He's still in the AF but out of the career field. That person had to pay the remianing portion of his SRB back.

Rawful Kawpter
01-07-2010, 07:47 AM
The process you are using, though now standard, is a direct violation of the intent of the SRB program. The program was designed to provide an incentive for fully qualified people to stay in a career field and save the USAF the expenditure of replacing them. You ARE a replacement.

But, again, this is the modern standard of behavior . . ..

Actually it's in direct support of AF goals and specifically within the intent of the SRB program according to the SECAF.

AFI 36-2606

2.3. Purpose and Application. The SRB is a monetary incentive paid to enlisted members to attract
reenlistments in, and retraining into, critical military skills with insufficient reenlistments to sustain the
career force in those skills. HQ USAF/DPRS adds and deletes skills from the SRB list as requirements
change.

Perhaps it wasn't intended when you were a young'n. Though you should probably keep abreast of changes in policy before speaking down to people.

BRUWIN
01-07-2010, 08:01 AM
Actually it's in direct support of AF goals and specifically within the intent of the SRB program according to the SECAF.

AFI 36-2606

2.3. Purpose and Application. The SRB is a monetary incentive paid to enlisted members to attract
reenlistments in, and retraining into, critical military skills with insufficient reenlistments to sustain the
career force in those skills. HQ USAF/DPRS adds and deletes skills from the SRB list as requirements
change.

Perhaps it wasn't intended when you were a young'n. Though you should probably keep abreast of changes in policy before speaking down to people.

He stated "although now standard". I don't believe he was speaking down to anybody. He was just stating the original intent of the program.

Rawful Kawpter
01-07-2010, 08:12 AM
He stated "although now standard". I don't believe he was speaking down to anybody. He was just stating the original intent of the program.

He should use commas properly then. It's quite obtuse to think the last comment with the ellipse wasn't with disdain.

BRUWIN
01-07-2010, 08:25 AM
It's quite obtuse to think the last comment with the ellipse wasn't with disdain.

Well I think it's obtuse of you to use the word "obtuse" with me...tell me that wasn't in disdain. I'm just mediating here...so don't get obtuse with me.

ChiefB
01-07-2010, 09:28 AM
Actually it's in direct support of AF goals and specifically within the intent of the SRB program according to the SECAF.

AFI 36-2606

2.3. Purpose and Application. The SRB is a monetary incentive paid to enlisted members to attract
reenlistments in, and retraining into, critical military skills with insufficient reenlistments to sustain the
career force in those skills. HQ USAF/DPRS adds and deletes skills from the SRB list as requirements
change.

Perhaps it wasn't intended when you were a young'n. Though you should probably keep abreast of changes in policy before speaking down to people.

Hey RK, you made your point, we all can read. You done good. Now why do you have to give the "parting shot" like you're schooling your kid?

The cut-and-paste is more than adequate.

The last sentence says "blow it up your arse, you uninformed old dork" and is real unnecessary and a cheap shot.

We are not amused.

ChiefB

imported_BRAVO10000
01-07-2010, 11:54 AM
It will be 6 x (number of months of newly obligated service) x (Base Pay) / 12

The last time I reenlisted, the contract itself was EXPLICIT about what the number of newly obligated months was.

Remember that 50% of the bonus is paid up front as a down payment, and that the Federal Government will withhold 28% of that against your income tax debt. You will also owe tax debt to your state, as per the state's laws. So, you will receive 36% of the value (minus state tax withholding) sometime after all the paperwork is finalized.

The process you are using, though now standard, is a direct violation of the intent of the SRB program. The program was designed to provide an incentive for fully qualified people to stay in a career field and save the USAF the expenditure of replacing them. You ARE a replacement.

But, again, this is the modern standard of behavior . . ..

Dunno Giggety. In 1999-2002 they needed a mass of people to retread into network Comm career fields and were handing out mad SRBs to the retreads. I never got one, I had too much time remaining on my enlistment and I was outside of Zone C when my time came up. Lots of fun being the highest-ranking and lowest-paid in my NCC crew. :-)

Now - I don't know what the "original intent" of the SRB program was, since my initial career field never had one. However, if a career field must grow quickly to meet a new mission or demand, sometimes keeping every last experienced person isn't enough...hence the SRBs for retreads.

Still, I don't completely disagree. It REALLY chaps my arse when people want to leverage a deployment because they are due to re-enlist and want to duck the taxes on the SRB. As if the friggin' free money wasn't enough. It also bugs me when someone massages extensions and re-enlistments to leverage max payout on the SRB. I just think it sends the wrong signal...and too many times the SRB lures people into career fields that have no real interest in the trade.

imported_blacksheep1208
01-07-2010, 12:07 PM
So the SRB program keeps people in that are good at their job and attracts people that want a quick payday. I'll say it, I think it's wrong. No offense to retrainees, but you aren't skilled in the job, you really don't deserve the money. And while the numbers may look good on a slide at ACC, AFPC or whoever is looking at manning, the E-5's that are under the E-6's and E-7's that retrain are the ones that bear most of the work. I've seen it at my last few bases. We've been so over loaded with people that have retrained we're faced with a large amount of the higher NCO's having no clue about our job. And while it may not seem like a big deal, it kinda sucks when you want a second opinion on something and the guy that's your boss can't give you one because he has no experience to fall back on. I understand that it's within the AFI and the purpose of the program, I just don't like it.

imported_BRAVO10000
01-07-2010, 12:36 PM
So the SRB program keeps people in that are good at their job and attracts people that want a quick payday. I'll say it, I think it's wrong. No offense to retrainees, but you aren't skilled in the job, you really don't deserve the money. And while the numbers may look good on a slide at ACC, AFPC or whoever is looking at manning, the E-5's that are under the E-6's and E-7's that retrain are the ones that bear most of the work. I've seen it at my last few bases. We've been so over loaded with people that have retrained we're faced with a large amount of the higher NCO's having no clue about our job. And while it may not seem like a big deal, it kinda sucks when you want a second opinion on something and the guy that's your boss can't give you one because he has no experience to fall back on. I understand that it's within the AFI and the purpose of the program, I just don't like it.

Agreed. Here's the easy fix...retreads need to go through the 3-5-7 level skill level training upgrades, just as the pipeline folks do. In my career field, that was not enforced...the AF was about 4 years too slow on modifying the CFETP and building JQS docs. In many, many locations, you had 3-level MSgts running workcenters. These retrainee guys all assumed (as I did as a Tech) that they would enter a regimented OJT program. That just doesn't happen in too many cases, and it should.

The idea that a SNCO doesn't need to know anything about his trade is laughable. It might have been appropriate when the AF was 4x it's current size and 1/4 as top-heavy. These days, it just doesn't work. As the Army likes to say, "A good leader is proficient both technically and tactically".

sigecaps
01-07-2010, 01:07 PM
I have to say that every SNCO flight chief that I've worked for in intel, has been a retrainee from the SF career field. Does it hurt the flight? Yes and no. Most flight chiefs weren't involved in intel production, they were taking care of the admin side. However it would have been valuable to be able to turn to someone who had the sort of experience you might expect an SNCO to have. By the time I was a SSgt I was running circles around my supervisors on intel subjects/analysis, and only surpassed by our weapons officers.

Freelancer
01-07-2010, 02:51 PM
I'm currently cross training into the flight engineer career field. In this career field, we are 100% manned entirely by cross trainees. Although from what I read, you can't get the SRB for your new career field until you hold at least an official 3 level in it. So I can't cancel my extension and re-enlist till after I finish BFE and expect to receive the FE SRB bonus(which is now crap anyways >< .) In our enlisted aircrew here, the gunners in general can usually be expected to have more overall flight experience since many started straight out into the gunner job and didn't have to cross train into it. Now some of the old SNCOs though were of course weapons troops who started off as a weapons special duty and found themselves in a new career field.

imported_Sgt HULK
01-07-2010, 04:05 PM
Well as I sit here looking at my 7.0 SRB sitting in my bank account at ( well 50% ) that is

I did the retrain and canceled my entension when i got to my next base then re-enlisted the next day.

You can cancel in the middle of your extension but your gonna lose the time you were supposed to have worked.

My buddy sitting next to me was 2 months into his ext and lost 22 months so he reupped for 6 go credit for just over 4

I didnt enter my ext yet so I got the full 5 yr credit I needed to cap out.

just some knowledge for when you get to your next base after graduation.


taxes suck but I have no truck payment :D

imported_Gigglendorf
01-07-2010, 05:26 PM
Uhhhh . . ..

All I said was truth.

I went out of my way to point out that I wasn't blaming people for following what has become standard procedure.

Your desire to be insulted has nothing to do with whether or not I provided insult.

I received an SRB at my FIRST reenlistment only, all the way back in the winter of '88/'89. I'm not sure which side of the New Year I was on when I reenlisted that time. The material I was provided then was VERY explicit about the intent of the program, as were all of the enlisted leaders in my field. ALL of them retrained into the field back then, and they all LOVED to ensure that you knew retrainees couldn't get a bonus for the new field. _I_ was the first TSgt I knew of in my career field who was NOT a retrainee. I have, to date, met 6 other MSgts who were not retrainees. I should note that none of the 7 are/were selected for SMSgt to date, either. 3 (including me) are still in uniform. Apparantly remaining in a shortage career field makes you less promotable than those who retrain into it.

Also, it is a violation of AFI to cancel an extension (entered or not) for the purpose of incresing SRB elgibility. This is explicitly mentioned under the rules for cancelling extensions.

Shadowless
01-07-2010, 06:13 PM
I'm not going to say if I agree or disagree with a person who retrains, extends, waits to deploy to save on taxes ect....but I will say that I am not the person to judge anyone for doing what they do. I see no reason why any given person should not try to benefit in anyway or shape they can without breaking any regs or laws.

EVERYONE has their own motives, and I'm not saying everyone takes advantage of the system but if they do then oh well, if they are not breaking rules I honestly could care less.

For me personally, I find it hard to believe that someone would retrain out of a job they love into a new job because they are doing it for the Air Force, I mean come on lets be serious.

Rawful Kawpter
01-08-2010, 10:10 AM
Well I think it's obtuse of you to use the word "obtuse" with me...tell me that wasn't in disdain. I'm just mediating here...so don't get obtuse with me.

I wasn't being obtuse with you, I was being dismissive. You were being overly defensive.

I am one of those you seem to have trepidations about though, I finished 1N Core yesterday and started 1N1 Apprentice today. If it will keep you up at night or cause undue stress that I might become a pox upon your clan, then I am willing to provide the names of previous supervisors and flight chiefs for you to perform your own background check on me if you'd like. I'm quite confident it would assuage your fears.

If it makes you feel better on a more immediate level my two retraining selections were 9S100 and 1N1X1 before I even thought about the SRB. If I didn't get either of those I would be separating next month.


Hey RK, you made your point, we all can read. You done good. Now why do you have to give the "parting shot" like you're schooling your kid?

The cut-and-paste is more than adequate.

The last sentence says "blow it up your arse, you uninformed old dork" and is real unnecessary and a cheap shot.

We are not amused.

ChiefB


I was actually aiming for 'be more careful because this is the Air Force and the only constant is change,' but in a sardonic manner. The last sentence in my first post was intended to be polite, hence the fancy words. If I were aiming for insult I'd be crass. I'm sure the likes of Micheap has conditioned many of you to have less receptive attitudes for what you perceive as insults I will concede.

Just so it isn't confused either, I use big words because I really do enjoy the vastness of the English language. I speak much more plainly than I write. It certainly does help with official correspondence most of the time, except when I let the sarcasm and cynicism seep into it too much...then the flight chief makes me redo it even if he agrees that the CC won't even pick up on it.

With regards to canceling extensions for retraining...

There is another AFI reference explaining that for CAREERS retrainees(FTA) any obligated service is not deducted from your reenlistment term for bonus calculations. I won't copy and paste it though, you'll all probably send me various incendiary parcels and powder laced envelopes for my effort(Warning: High probability that sarcasm has been used).

ChiefB
01-08-2010, 10:53 AM
I wasn't being obtuse with you, I was being dismissive. You were being overly defensive.

I am one of those you seem to have trepidations about though, I finished 1N Core yesterday and started 1N1 Apprentice today. If it will keep you up at night or cause undue stress that I might become a pox upon your clan, then I am willing to provide the names of previous supervisors and flight chiefs for you to perform your own background check on me if you'd like. I'm quite confident it would assuage your fears.

If it makes you feel better on a more immediate level my two retraining selections were 9S100 and 1N1X1 before I even thought about the SRB. If I didn't get either of those I would be separating next month.



I was actually aiming for 'be more careful because this is the Air Force and the only constant is change,' but in a sardonic manner. The last sentence in my first post was intended to be polite, hence the fancy words. If I were aiming for insult I'd be crass. I'm sure the likes of Micheap has conditioned many of you to have less receptive attitudes for what you perceive as insults I will concede.

Just so it isn't confused either, I use big words because I really do enjoy the vastness of the English language. I speak much more plainly than I write. It certainly does help with official correspondence most of the time, except when I let the sarcasm and cynicism seep into it too much...then the flight chief makes me redo it even if he agrees that the CC won't even pick up on it.

With regards to canceling extensions for retraining...

There is another AFI reference explaining that for CAREERS retrainees(FTA) any obligated service is not deducted from your reenlistment term for bonus calculations. I won't copy and paste it though, you'll all probably send me various incendiary parcels and powder laced envelopes for my effort(Warning: High probability that sarcasm has been used).

Yes, Micheap has his way of conditioning many to the ways of pompous smart asses.:tongue:

This, I like, though.. "If it will keep you up at night or cause undue stress that I might become a pox upon your clan....". http://www.militarytimes.com/forum/images/icons/icon12.gif

Just lighten up a little and we might be able to appreciate your "prose".

ChiefB

synergy_68
07-18-2013, 01:52 PM
Heres a question for all you that have done the retrain/renlist/SRB path...
I have been in 8 years, will attend/receive my Sensor Operator 3-level in October 2013. I can reenlist( for the second time) a few months later, my DOS is Dec2015.
Will I get the SRB?
Joined for 6 in 2005, reenlisted for 4 in 2011.

Thanks.
Jason

garhkal
07-18-2013, 03:02 PM
A 6 srb> Wow. Never saw that high an SRB for my rate when i was in.. Lucky bugger.