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BigBaze
12-14-2007, 12:26 PM
I am currently in the process of submitting my retraining package into the flight engineer career field. (1A1X1) Apparently it is a critically manned field because the people in it deploy a ton. It has been quite a hassle dealing with AFPC, trying to get answers about how many they select each month, and when they release the results of the board. I know the retraining board meets the 3rd week of every month. Any FE's out there how have been through the retraining experience and can send some advice my way? I am a first term SSgt with 4 years 7 months TIS, all firewall 5 EPR's, BTZ, yada yada, what are my chances getting this job, and does it help that i am in the maintenance world? (F15 jet engine troop)

Shrike
12-14-2007, 12:49 PM
I am currently in the process of submitting my retraining package into the flight engineer career field. (1A1X1) Apparently it is a critically manned field because the people in it deploy a ton. It has been quite a hassle dealing with AFPC, trying to get answers about how many they select each month, and when they release the results of the board. I know the retraining board meets the 3rd week of every month. Any FE's out there how have been through the retraining experience and can send some advice my way? I am a first term SSgt with 4 years 7 months TIS, all firewall 5 EPR's, BTZ, yada yada, what are my chances getting this job, and does it help that i am in the maintenance world? (F15 jet engine troop)

I'm not a 1A1X1, but can speak from a little bit of experience - you're re-training into a chronic critical career field, so you shouldn't have any problems. It just sometimes takes a while for MPF to get your class date. How long has it been since your paperwork was turned in to MPF?

ringjamesa
12-14-2007, 01:41 PM
Heh Heh Heh. Shrike, your age is showing. With the new contact center, all retraining is done through V-MPF. All the real MPF does is your outprocessing for tech school. As to the question at hand, as long as you have completed all of the requirements for the 1A AFSC, (flight physical, PULHES, ASVAB, etc) you should be fine. I believe the manning is good enough for 2A6s for you to leave the AFSC. Keep in mind retraining is a long process and if you are turned down by the first board, you automatically meet the next one, and the next one before you are toast.

Shrike
12-14-2007, 02:18 PM
Heh Heh Heh. Shrike, your age is showing. With the new contact center, all retraining is done through V-MPF. All the real MPF does is your outprocessing for tech school. As to the question at hand, as long as you have completed all of the requirements for the 1A AFSC, (flight physical, PULHES, ASVAB, etc) you should be fine. I believe the manning is good enough for 2A6s for you to leave the AFSC. Keep in mind retraining is a long process and if you are turned down by the first board, you automatically meet the next one, and the next one before you are toast.

Ah, yes, vMPF. I forgot about that. "Paperwork" - I'm so 20th Century.

One thing to keep in mind, however, is that he's going into a chronicle critical field - that usually "greases the skids", so to speak.

Measure Man
12-14-2007, 02:20 PM
I'll be honest...try as I might...I've never found any rhyme or reason to the whole retraining program in the AF.

My career field has been overmanned for several years...I've had several people apply for retraining into these so-called "chronic critical" AFSCs, only to get turned down...even under the CAREERS program which is supposed to be easier.

Then...they'll turn around a give someone of same rank and experience a "mandatory crosstrain or separate" threatening notice...and that guy didn't want to crosstrain. All the while we can't figure out why the first guy was disapproved.

It's all smoke and mirrors if you ask me...and personally, I don't think the process is set up to meet the needs of the Airmen and the AF...it is set up to meet the needs of the CFMs at the moment. It's very short term and it appears to be a crap shoot...of course there is no way to validate that because you never get a good explanation of the disapproval other than:

AFPC: Well, there must not have been any openings this month
FIELD: Well, what does "chronic critical" mean?
AFPC: It means this career field is always short-handed and has a hard time getting or keeping people
FIELD: Isn't this month part of "always?"
AFPC: Sir, there really isn't an explanation given...all I know is it was disapproved

Shrike
12-14-2007, 03:33 PM
I'll be honest...try as I might...I've never found any rhyme or reason to the whole retraining program in the AF.

My career field has been overmanned for several years...I've had several people apply for retraining into these so-called "chronic critical" AFSCs, only to get turned down...even under the CAREERS program which is supposed to be easier.

Then...they'll turn around a give someone of same rank and experience a "mandatory crosstrain or separate" threatening notice...and that guy didn't want to crosstrain. All the while we can't figure out why the first guy was disapproved.

It's all smoke and mirrors if you ask me...and personally, I don't think the process is set up to meet the needs of the Airmen and the AF...it is set up to meet the needs of the CFMs at the moment. It's very short term and it appears to be a crap shoot...of course there is no way to validate that because you never get a good explanation of the disapproval other than:

AFPC: Well, there must not have been any openings this month
FIELD: Well, what does "chronic critical" mean?
AFPC: It means this career field is always short-handed and has a hard time getting or keeping people
FIELD: Isn't this month part of "always?"
AFPC: Sir, there really isn't an explanation given...all I know is it was disapproved

I can agree with you for the most part. But in my experience with people re-training into CC fields - which, admittedly, is only four people - the process was quick and they were all accepted. What took the longest was getting a class start date.

As far as general re-training goes, though, a crap shoot is a good description.

FINKD
12-14-2007, 08:58 PM
When I was in, my career field was forever undermanned and the only time you could retrain was at the end of your first enlistment. During my entire career, only 1 person was able to retrain out of the career field. We did have a number of people retrain into the field but the number that did never amounted enough to help us out. My last base before retiring, our career field AF-wide was at 80% and my shop was at 60%.

For those who want to retrain into a new field, keep trying even if you have to make tons of phone calls to MPFC to make it happen.

BigBaze
12-15-2007, 12:15 PM
I submitted it through my squadron commander today and she approved it and sent it up to AFPC. i know it meets next months board and i should find out by the end of feb. Everything is done online through virtual MPF, you fax all your EPR's and medical documents in to them and they create an account for you, scan those documents and upload them to your account. It is extremely annoying when you try and talk to them and you have to keep on them to make sure they take care of business. It is so ridiculous, they want all these people to fill the slots and then they jerk you around when you apply..oh well..wish me luck

Measure Man
12-15-2007, 12:51 PM
I submitted it through my squadron commander today and she approved it and sent it up to AFPC. i know it meets next months board and i should find out by the end of feb. Everything is done online through virtual MPF, you fax all your EPR's and medical documents in to them and they create an account for you, scan those documents and upload them to your account. It is extremely annoying when you try and talk to them and you have to keep on them to make sure they take care of business. It is so ridiculous, they want all these people to fill the slots and then they jerk you around when you apply..oh well..wish me luck

Good luck with it.

technomage1
12-16-2007, 08:31 AM
I submitted it through my squadron commander today and she approved it and sent it up to AFPC. i know it meets next months board and i should find out by the end of feb. Everything is done online through virtual MPF, you fax all your EPR's and medical documents in to them and they create an account for you, scan those documents and upload them to your account. It is extremely annoying when you try and talk to them and you have to keep on them to make sure they take care of business. It is so ridiculous, they want all these people to fill the slots and then they jerk you around when you apply..oh well..wish me luck

Yeah, and then they screw around so much they have to pick a non-vol!

Good luck to you.

Gunner7
01-11-2008, 12:33 PM
I would have to say that the retraining process through the vMPF has changed the way we do business. I have seen applications sail through in a matter of months and others move at a glacial pace. Each application is different and the speed of processing will depend in part on whether you need a waiver or an exception to policy. Of the eight Flying AFSCs, just about all are critical skills that are constantly in need of volunteers. A limiting factor on how many positions are open during the FY is how many people can be put in seats for training. Our maintenance folks do a fantastic job of getting birds in the air and we squeeze every bit of training we can out of each sortie. There is only so many aircraft that can be dedicated to training while we execute our mission in the AOR.
If you are considering retraining I would urge you to visit this site from a .mil computer: https://afkm.wpafb.af.mil/asps/cop/opencop.asp?filter=oo-dp-so-02
read through the retraining tutorial and the information on the different career fields so you can proactively manage your career.
Have a great day.

BigBaze
01-11-2008, 02:22 PM
Thanks Gunner. I find out the last week of January if I get the job. As of now there are 75 slots open for first term airmen so we will see. If I don't make it this time I automatically roll into next month's board, and then have one more chance after that. I spoke to the scool at Lackland and they said if accepted I probably will be looking at an April class date at the earliest. I do two weeks of that, then have to wait on a survival school class date, and after THAT i still have to wait for a flying class date for whatever airframe I am assigned to, which is a 6 month school. I am told the waiting for that is around 1-2 months after survival school so it is a process. Lot of TDY.

starlifter
01-12-2008, 09:23 PM
I am currently in the process of submitting my retraining package into the flight engineer career field. (1A1X1) Apparently it is a critically manned field because the people in it deploy a ton. It has been quite a hassle dealing with AFPC, trying to get answers about how many they select each month, and when they release the results of the board. I know the retraining board meets the 3rd week of every month. Any FE's out there how have been through the retraining experience and can send some advice my way? I am a first term SSgt with 4 years 7 months TIS, all firewall 5 EPR's, BTZ, yada yada, what are my chances getting this job, and does it help that i am in the maintenance world? (F15 jet engine troop)

I wish you luck.
I have a total of 9,000 logged Flight Hours as a Flight Engineer on C-124, C-141,C-5 and C-123K.
When I started we did all the computations on a slide rule. The Flight Engineer (C-124) was one busy Crew Member. We had four R-4360 Compound PW Engines and the Flight Engineer had complete control from start, taxi, take-off, climb, cruise, decent and landing to shut down.
Being USAF Retired now with nearly 25 years of Active Duty, I look back and reminiscence with pride in having been a Flight Engineer.

Good Luck and have a safe flight.

dub13
01-12-2008, 10:31 PM
i just found out i got approved christmas eve. After it went to the commander and she approved it, it went to the CFM and he approved it on 27 Oct. So it was pretty much a two month wait to get status 5 which was on Dec 24. i got status 6 four days later on Friday and i start EAUC March 14th. so its a little wait but well worth it considering i started this whole process the end of last May

C-130 AMP FE
01-13-2008, 07:37 PM
Keep your heads up guys, it will be worth the wait. I never had some of the issues in my process that some folks have, other than someone at MPF trying to tell me I couldn't retrain because of the manning levels in my maintenance career field. This is a fact that lots of people don't realize: the 2A career fields are feeder AFSCs to the 1A1 career field. This means that it doesn't matter what the manning level is of the mx field, you get to retrain. Look at the notes carefully, this is spelled out specifically.
I've been flying for 15 years now & have never once regretted the move. I've been on C-130s that whole time. While I would like to move to another airframe to see how the other side lives, I still love the Herc! One of the very best jobs in the AF if you want responsibility, adventure & travel.
I'm always happy to help folks out who are interested in making the big career move.

BigBaze
01-14-2008, 08:21 AM
I appreciate the post, I found out they release the results of the board between Jan 29-31 so I am pumped up....this is the job I wanted originally coming in but didn't get it of course because I was not retraining into it. C130's are on the top of my list because of the many different missions they perform. I did read that they are only taking people from 1A and 2A fields so I guess my chances are high.

BigBaze
01-14-2008, 08:27 AM
i just found out i got approved christmas eve. After it went to the commander and she approved it, it went to the CFM and he approved it on 27 Oct. So it was pretty much a two month wait to get status 5 which was on Dec 24. i got status 6 four days later on Friday and i start EAUC March 14th. so its a little wait but well worth it considering i started this whole process the end of last May

Yeah Dub I think it took 2 months for you because the retraining board meets on the third week of every month for FTA, so yours just missed the October board and met the November board. From what they tell me they release the results about the same time the next months board meets..so that is what I am looking at..I got lucky when I sent in my package in December, because of the holidays the board met the last week of Dec so I just snuck in there..I applied in August and AFMC came back and said I needed to lose weight....so I went on a running spree and lost about 35 lbs....so if I get accepted it definately will be a great accomplishment. I just had two guys in my squadron come back from the two week basic course and the 2 week or so survival school. They are now off to Little Rock for the 6 month flying school for C130's...keeping my fingers crossed

BigBaze
01-23-2008, 04:58 AM
Just got the status 5 today, so I will wait around for the class date. Does 5 mean you have been approved, you are just awaiting allocation of a class date?

jkru37
01-25-2008, 12:30 AM
I have decided to try and cross train into Flight Engineering. My situation may be a little different from others. I was sheet metal for three years and then the F-22 came along. Sheet metal troops then became low observable troops. They plan to split the career field this fall, which will cause the low observable career field to be undermanned. Also, I have a line number for SSgt and am currently in 7 level upgrade training. Does anyone think that AFPC will see this and deny my retraining?

jkru37
01-25-2008, 12:33 AM
Sorry for stealing your thread "Big" but I didn't want to start a new one with the same subject. Good luck to you with your retraining.

dub13
01-25-2008, 02:25 PM
Just got the status 5 today, so I will wait around for the class date. Does 5 mean you have been approved, you are just awaiting allocation of a class date?


Ya, it means you've been approved. i got status 5 Monday, Christmas Eve and then got status 6, which is were they show you the class dates four days later on Friday. If you dont know how to check it log in to VMPF, go to Self Service Actions; Retraining; Retraining Application Status Inquiry, and then when you are status 6 you will see the class dates on that page! Mine showed all five courses, EAUC(which is now called Aircrew Fundamentals Course), BFE, Water Survival training, Emergency Parachute training, and SERE.
you should be finding out soon!!

dub13
01-25-2008, 02:29 PM
I have decided to try and cross train into Flight Engineering. My situation may be a little different from others. I was sheet metal for three years and then the F-22 came along. Sheet metal troops then became low observable troops. They plan to split the career field this fall, which will cause the low observable career field to be undermanned. Also, I have a line number for SSgt and am currently in 7 level upgrade training. Does anyone think that AFPC will see this and deny my retraining?

Im currently Sheet Metal too, and i got approved for the FE job. Also i havent heard of sheet metal creating its own AFSC for the LO guys just yet. you should be fine to crosstrain to FE. Once your commander approves it, it goes to the CFM and then they approve it. Mine was approved by him pretty quick. i already have my class dates. Start March 14th, cant wait!!

BigBaze
01-25-2008, 06:25 PM
Sorry for stealing your thread "Big" but I didn't want to start a new one with the same subject. Good luck to you with your retraining.

Lol no problem, no sooner did I read this post then I got status 6 today, my basic flight engineer school is on April 1, and I got dates for the survival schools too. I am sure being in sheet metal you will have no problem with the retraining. I just sewed on SSgt and got my 7 level when I sent my package in. Good luck..if you have any questions feel free to ask

Shrike
01-25-2008, 07:01 PM
Lol no problem, no sooner did I read this post then I got status 6 today, my basic flight engineer school is on April 1, and I got dates for the survival schools too. I am sure being in sheet metal you will have no problem with the retraining. I just sewed on SSgt and got my 7 level when I sent my package in. Good luck..if you have any questions feel free to ask

Congrat's, BigBaze; I'm glad it worked out for you.

WillsPowers
01-28-2008, 07:48 PM
MY ADVICE ( retired C-5 instructor FE / 6981.5 hours)

1) Don't retrain until you have a line number for E-6 / Technical Sergeant!!! Making rank in the FE career field is hell with much higher scores required to make rank (as compared to aircraft maintenance career fields). You want to retire as a MSgt or higher! The Air Force has too many grey haired Staff Sergeants running around approaching retirement.

2) Go through survival school during spring or fall. There are fewer temperature / weather extremes to deal with---don't forget your goretex boots (unless you like misery). Be very physically fit when you go. Be able to run like the wind and possess great physical strength. If you smoke and drink, stop now.

3) Try to get assigned to C-5's or KC10's. C-5's don't deploy like the other airlifters do. If you can't get a FE slot on C-5's then expect to pull rotational deployments to the toilets of the world on C130's and KC10's. On C-5's you go out for a few weeks and then return stateside to Dover or Travis. It's far nicer to stay at the Hilton on Guam then Achmed's tent at Baghdad Intl.

4) Don't be an academic disgrace---You had better do well in your studies and upgrade training or you will be back at Pope working in Bubba's sheetmetal shop pulling 12 hour shifts and #1 on his short deployment list.

5) Know when to retire and prepare for it. Don't worry, you will know when.

Gunner7
01-31-2008, 04:11 PM
Waiting to retrain until AFTER you have reenlisted will cost a member their CAREERs retraining opportunity. That will not have a significant impact on some folks, but could be a huge mistake for those AFSC's that are "balanced". While being promoted in the FE career field is challenging, it is not the toughest of the specialities. If all an Airman wanted was quick rank progression and a few "easy" TDYs I would strongly urge them to consider another line of work. We need people who want to fly and fight. If you are meeting Air Force fitness standards you will not have any problems in survival school, you are training to be an Aircrew member not a SEAL.
If you want to work with DEDICATED professionals who put service before self every day, become a Career Enlisted Aviator.

feusaf
02-02-2008, 09:36 PM
I can give you a BIG reason why class dates come slowly for those retraining to be Flight Engineers. I'm a schoolhouse instructor flight engineer and can speak from a little experience.

Pretty much all the school houses (C-130, C-5, KC-10, E-3, E-8) are all backlogged due to the mass influx of new students. Over the last 3 years, my school house has recieved an average of 4 students per year. I now have 13 inbounds for FY08 and have no other training slots left.

We have retrainees that want to come to our school house, but they can't because we have no training available until FY09. The C-130 school house at Little Rock is just as bad off as us we are right now. Their Initial Qualification Training slots are full through September and on into the first few months of FY09. I can't speak for the C-5 or KC-10 school houses, but am sure they are just as backed up as everyone else. This is all due to a change in the manning documents AF wide. Just about every unit out there has increased their manning, causing the backlog.

As far as waiting to make E-6 (TSgt) to retrain, that is now a farse in our career field. I retrained in 1997 as a SrA, made SSgt in 2000, and sewed on TSgt in 2006. I'm testing for MSgt for my first time this year and will have 5 years to try to make it before I retire. Promotions have come easier after they merged us with 1A1X1B (Flight Engineer, Rotary-Wing) and with the number of deployments, a large number of us have been able to rack up quite a few Air Medals and Aerial Acheivement medals (3 points each). 10-20 years ago, it was not unheard of for a Flight Engineer to separate as a SrA at 10-years or retire at 20 as a SSgt. Things have now changed and it is more common for a Flight Engineer to retire as a MSgt, after coming into the career field as a SSgt. The promotions to SMSgt and CMSgt are still just as hard as they ever were.

The deployments are rough for everyone, including the C-5 guys. Everyone deploys, that's the new mindset. I don't think there is an airframe out there that isn't going somewhere for 3 months a shot.

For those who have submitted paperwork to retrain, just keep your hopes up. It WILL HAPPEN and you WILL get a class date. We are all just a little backlogged and trying to catch up. Keep your patience as we all try to figure out how we are going to increase our training capabilities while we support the ongoing operations overseas.

Good luck to all and let me know if there are any questions I can answer for you.

Jim

BigBaze
02-08-2008, 05:42 AM
Thanks a lot Jim. I applied back in August and my medical was disapproved by AFMC because they said I needed to drop weight. I am not out of shape by any means, I am 6'5 and muscular type, but the Air Force LOVES skinny people, so that's how it goes I guess. I dropped the weight and reapplied in December. I got notified of acceptance about the last week of January, and they assigned class dates a few days later. I will spend a little over a month at Lackland for the basic course and the 3 level awarding course, and go to survival school at Fairchild a week after that. I think that is a little over 2 weeks, then i come back and go to a couple days of water survival school in Pensacola. The waiting game begins after that for a flight school slot, I know of two guys in my maintenance squadron here who just came back from survival school, and are waiting 4 and 6 months respectively for HH60 and C130 flying schools. The entire process from application to flying school is a really long process, so if you are willing to deal with that, go for it. Just if you apply, keep on AFPC and make sure they update all the application forms etc you fax to them because getting answers out of them is like asking for a pot of gold. I am really excited about this new career, and I am not concerned about making rank etc. I have my pilots license so I just love flying, as a 5 year jet mechanic it is good to move on to this career field. I'll let you guys know how it goes.

BigBaze
02-08-2008, 05:48 AM
Oh one more thing, once you get a tech school date, they require you get 48 months retainability from the end of the initial 2 week class, so you basically have to extend or re-enlist. I am a first term SSgt, and was not in my window yet to re-enlist, so all I could do was extend the maximum 23 months, and I will have to re-enlist while I am at tech school. I was told I am not eligible for the flight engineer SRB until I re-enlist for the second time, which is a little disappointing, I mean come on..we all would love $20,000 (approx)! I can think of worse things though;) If you do not get the retainability within 10 working days of being notified for training, AFPC will withdraw your classes.

dub13
02-15-2008, 01:27 AM
Oh one more thing, once you get a tech school date, they require you get 48 months retainability from the end of the initial 2 week class, so you basically have to extend or re-enlist. I am a first term SSgt, and was not in my window yet to re-enlist, so all I could do was extend the maximum 23 months, .


I had to do the same thing.

BigBaze
02-16-2008, 03:42 PM
I do have to reenlist in May though as soon as my reenlistment window opens, and will not be eligible for the SRB until I reeinlist the second time.

AfricanSnowOwl
02-18-2008, 07:43 PM
I started the whole process of retraining to FE back in November, and i just got everything finished and turned in at the start of this month. On the vMPF my status is a 3 as of 12FEB.
I don't have any feeder AFSCs(i'm a 2E) so I had to do an ETP. Does having an ETP make the process take longer or make me an unlikely candidate?

falcon65
03-05-2008, 03:19 AM
I just got approved for retraining to FE and am waiting class dates. I am stationed overseas and married. I am wondering if anyone knows how exacly it will work. I can't seem to get a strait answer. Do I go tdy for the classes and my wife stays here or do I pcs to my next base and then go to school????

dub13
03-05-2008, 06:01 AM
since you are overseas you will be PCS'ing to your new base before you go. You will also find out what airframe you will be on obviously before you PCS. I got all this info over at Military.com Forums; AIr Force Discussions, Its all about the flying.

dub13
03-05-2008, 06:05 AM
Oh one more thing, once you get a tech school date, they require you get 48 months retainability from the end of the initial 2 week class, so you basically have to extend or re-enlist..

I thought that i could extend the 23 months and then reenlist while in the school house but i got a phone call at work from the Career Enlisted Aviator Pipeline Manager from AETC saying i had to cancel the extension and actually reenlist the 48 months since i am in my reenllistment window. So BigBaze you might wanna check that out.

BigBaze
03-06-2008, 07:53 AM
I thought that i could extend the 23 months and then reenlist while in the school house but i got a phone call at work from the Career Enlisted Aviator Pipeline Manager from AETC saying i had to cancel the extension and actually reenlist the 48 months since i am in my reenllistment window. So BigBaze you might wanna check that out.


I double checked that Dub, The reason I cannot do that is that I am not in my reenlistment window. It only opens in May, but I start school in April. Therefore I have to get the extension for now and reenlist down there in May when my window opens

BigBaze
03-07-2008, 08:09 AM
and they just released the retraining advisory for FY09; 150 slots for FTA flight engineers....wow:)

Gundam1978@gmail.com
03-13-2008, 10:52 AM
I just got approved for retraining to FE and am waiting class dates. I am stationed overseas and married. I am wondering if anyone knows how exacly it will work. I can't seem to get a strait answer. Do I go tdy for the classes and my wife stays here or do I pcs to my next base and then go to school????

Hey Falcon, I am currently overseas while I received my approval for FE retraining. I just got my orders for my base and the ACFT that I will be working on. I will be basically PCS'ing during my DEROS month which is in April, and then head to my new base. Your family will stay at your new base while you go TDY in Lackland and Fairchild. My family will be staying with her parents when I go. If you have any more inquiries about the process, just ask. :cool:

BigBaze
03-14-2008, 04:59 AM
I leave next month for the first class at Lackland..can't wait! Here is a helpful link from AETC that shows class descriptions/requirements:

https://etca.randolph.af.mil/

type in the course code, or just enter the aircraft type and look under the flight engineer courses for location of classes, course length and equipment needed. Note: your losing unit is responsible for issuing you all your gear your flight school, ie flight suits, headsets etc. you will only need this gear after you are done with the 3 level school, SERE etc and are ready to go to the flying school for your specific airframe. The SERE school is basic for both fixed wing and helicopters but the parachute/water training is a little different. If you get helicopters you stay at Fairchild for underwater egress, while if you get fixed wing you go to Pensacola NAS in FL for water survival school. I am not completely clear on the helicopter part since right now I am assigned to fixed wing water and parachute survival courses. The parachute course is one day at Fairchild just before I start SERE, and then I go to Pensacola for three days. That is subject to change, my friend just came back from SERE and they had told him after completing the basic 3 level course at Lackland that he was moving over to helicopters. He is waiting 4 months for his UH-1 Huey flying school and my other friend is waiting 6 months for C130 flying school. Here are the course codes you can enter into the above website for the appropriate ground schools and survival schools. For the flying schools just type in the aircraft type, just make sure to leave the "organization" window blank.

L3AQR1A111 01AA - Flight Engineer Helper (Lackland)
L3ALR1A131 048A - Flight Engineer Apprentice (Lackland, right after first course)
S-V80-B - Parachute Training
S-V80-A SERE (all aircrew)
S-V84-A Underwater Egress (Helicopter crew)
S-V86-A Water Survival School-Parachuting
S-V90-A Water Survival School- Non Parachuting

You will not go to all those survival classes, I am scheduled for S-V80-A/B and S-V86-A

Good luck to all you guys going into this career field...now give me some good ratings on this post and add to my reputation because of this amazing information I just gave you! (Maybe I can make "Brass" soon::>

Orrion76
03-15-2008, 04:28 AM
Hi everyone,
My name is Jared. I just found out about this forum and am glad I did. Seems just like everyone else on this thred that I am currently in the process of Xtraing into the 1A1X1 career field. I want to thank everyone for the great info and web sites. I just found out last week that my application was approved and I have class dates starting June 20th. Like most of you the waiting process was quite long just to get to this point in time. I originally started my application July 07. After I had the application sitting and waiting for the contact center to forward it up they came back saying I need a ETP letter because my current AFSC didn't have any "OUT" quotes. Quickly I made up that letter, got is signed and forwarded it to them. Hearing back from the contact center's auto reply saying please wait up to 120 days for final decision. All the mean while on VMPF there was nothing stating that any retraining application was in the works. Then like I said a week ago March 6, I got an email from them saying my application was approved and to wait for officail notice from CSS or MPF. Well needless to say right now I am in Afghanistan and wont be back for another 30 days or so.
Just for demagraphics on myself. I am a SSgt. 11 TIS, I am currently a 2A675 (acft hydraulics). I was at Travis - C-5, Andersen - C-5 & C-17, and now currently station at Davis-Monthan - back shop Hydro and TDY with the 41EECS Compas Call EC-130's.
So is anyone heading to Lackland around the end of June to start classes?

AfricanSnowOwl
03-15-2008, 05:37 PM
I got my 5 status on friday. Hopefully it wont be too long before I leave for class.

I only have 2 and a half years time in service.

AfricanSnowOwl
03-16-2008, 04:45 AM
At what point do you usually find out what airframe you will be working on, and what base you will be stationed at?

Orrion76
03-16-2008, 05:17 AM
I emailed the Functional Manager for the career field and he said that during the first class you fill out a dream sheet. During the second class you get your assignment.

BigBaze
03-17-2008, 01:04 PM
Cool..thanks for the info man

falcon65
03-18-2008, 08:18 AM
Thanks Gundam1978, I start aircrew fundamentals 20 june. My deros is in april also. I am told I should recieve my assingment in the next few days. That does'nt leave much time to do the whole PCS thing. I think my wife will stay with her parents also. When you get your assingment is that when you get what school you'll go to for your airframe??????

falcon65
03-19-2008, 09:53 AM
Just got my orders today I'am going to work HH-60's at Nellis. I got my first choice I'am excited I know it's hard to get helicopters.

BigBaze
03-19-2008, 10:27 AM
Oh man my buddy just went to Nellis as a jet maintainer and said it is an awesome assignment there. And you get to qualify as a gunner:> Good luck!

Orrion76
03-20-2008, 04:08 AM
Thanks Gundam1978, I start aircrew fundamentals 20 june. My deros is in april also. I am told I should recieve my assingment in the next few days. That does'nt leave much time to do the whole PCS thing. I think my wife will stay with her parents also. When you get your assingment is that when you get what school you'll go to for your airframe??????



Hey Falcon65 we are going to be in the same class.

falcon65
03-20-2008, 07:28 AM
Hey Falcon65 we are going to be in the same class.

Right on!!

BigBaze
03-21-2008, 12:57 PM
Hey Falcon65 we are going to be in the same class.

I start fundamentals on April 11 so it looks like you guys will be in the class right after me, I graduate June 17. Good luck!

dub13
03-21-2008, 01:49 PM
At what point do you usually find out what airframe you will be working on, and what base you will be stationed at?

Now it is during block III of BFE. That is what one of the instructors told us the other day. Im getting anxious...

AfricanSnowOwl
03-24-2008, 06:44 PM
I got my 6 status today, I'll be starting class 18JUL.

Jetmac
03-25-2008, 02:31 AM
Good luck to you all

AfricanSnowOwl
03-26-2008, 09:40 PM
In case anyone was interested, here is a list of aircraft that have flight engineers:

AC-130, C-20, C-37, C-5, CV-22, E-3, E-4, E-8, EC-130, HC-130, HH-60, KC-10, MC-130, and the UH-1

BigBaze
03-27-2008, 01:52 AM
I know that the AC130 you need 500 logged flight hours before you can be an FE on that airframe, I am not sure about the other special ops aircraft, I think the same goes for the E8

AfricanSnowOwl
03-27-2008, 02:14 AM
Yeah there were a few that required 500 hours and a few that required 7 level status as a FE

Orrion76
03-27-2008, 02:29 AM
And the EC-130 which I am working on right now you have to get TS clearance.

Gunner007
03-27-2008, 03:26 PM
If you cant find out who can help you find a helicopter squadron and call their ops section and ask to talk to their senior FE or chief. they should be able to point you in the right direction.
When i crossed trained into flying it was fairly easy, i found the job on equal plus, applied for it and received a printout showing what i needed to do along the way, flight physical, eye test, etc...
Having been at the FE schoolhouse for a few years i can tell you that being denied has NOTHING to do with CFMs trying to screw you over. There are a limited number of slots alloted each fiscal year for training. Names are selected rather quickly and placed against slots. Once the slots are full all others are denied enrollment. It could be you get denied this year but resubmit your package again and again, eventually you will be the first few guys submitted and get a slot.
If you network with some senior FE's you may be able to up your chances. As we say in this comunity, its like a big inbred family reunion, everybody typically knows everyboy. If those guys take a liking to you and feel you want the job bad enough are arent just the gucci guy who wants to sport a flightsuit, they may pass your name around and it can help get your foot in the door. Please dont read network to mean kiss their behind, most operators dont like butt kissing and those who do it usually dont flaunt it, atleast in my experience.
There are several units in CONUS with FE's. You can do a search in the AF Times or google to find out where they are, OPSEC is bad enough without me listing them on here.
Hope this helps

AfricanSnowOwl
03-27-2008, 06:21 PM
I'm pretty sure if I can get accepted to be an FE, most anyone can.
When I applied I was only an A1C, didn't even have a 5 level for my current AFSC, and my current AFSC had nothing to do with aircraft. (My current AFSC is telephone maintenance)
About the only thing I had going for me was I had never been in trouble.

BigBaze
03-28-2008, 02:42 AM
I'm pretty sure if I can get accepted to be an FE, most anyone can.
When I applied I was only an A1C, didn't even have a 5 level for my current AFSC, and my current AFSC had nothing to do with aircraft. (My current AFSC is telephone maintenance)
About the only thing I had going for me was I had never been in trouble.


There are 150 slots already opened for FY09, (that are for first term airmen) I got a lot of good info from the instructors at Lackland when I was going through my process, since AFPC is pretty much useless for any type of advice. As a FTA you have 3 chances to go up against the retraining board, and if your package doesn't make it through you have to wait until your 2nd enlistment. In the words of one of the instructors I talked to, there always will be a need for flight engineers. Can't wait for next week, I'll be on my way to Lackland for tech school

BigBaze
03-31-2008, 05:43 AM
We just had an airshow here this weekend, and got to talk to FE's on the E3, E8, C130, UH1 and HH60. Really good time, I talked to them for quite awhile and they were quite happy to offer insight. I am in my last week of work and will leave for Lackland next week for tech school. SERE also had a booth at the show, and they are the guys who run the survival/parachute/water egress schools at Fairchild and the water parachute course at Pensacola, so I got a pretty good idea about that upcoming experience.

AfricanSnowOwl
03-31-2008, 12:10 PM
You must be at Tyndall as well. I was out there doing the exact same thing.

250SCP
04-01-2008, 03:11 AM
Hello everyone I was just browsing online and ran into this forum. Originally I was looking for some information concerning increased promotions in chronic critical shortage AFSCs. But I figure I can offer some insight into the 1A1 career field. I too was very excited when I was accepted into the career field. Looking back on it, it was the best move that I could have made. Before becoming an FE, I was a 2W1 armament troop and like some of the previous posts, I too had to submit an ETP letter. I went through a state of euphoria which has since worn off and all that's left is big blue. Little about me, I've been in the AF for 9 years, E-6, Single no dependents. Let me start by telling you...your airframe, no matter if it's a fixed wing or helo, is a jealous machine. Think of it as your new wife/hubby/GF/BF. The minute you decide to put down your books and decide you know everything there is, you will get bit. The biting comes from many sources but the most noticeable will be from your friendly Stan/Eval representative :) Keep in mind there are those who have Q-3 and those who will Q-3. I have yet to Q-3 an evaluation but I am not perfect and I have already had my humble pie...for sure. Study, Study, Study...Next, concentrate on one step at a time and don't look too far down the road. Cross the bridge when you get to it and you'll make it through just fine. If you start to have trouble in your training remember one thing....KEEP A POSITIVE ATTITUDE. Sorry for yelling but I've been through 2 formal aircrew schools. The #1 reason I see people failing out of training is a piss poor attitude. Don't get me wrong, I'm not asking you to be the first to jump on a live grenade...but I'm asking you to grab your buddy while you're running away from it...make sense? You will have good times and bad times...you're still a part of the Air Force and that will not change until you decide to get out. What that means is you will have additional responsibilities that you must take care of. Take care of your responsibilities and your people...enough said. I retrained back in Feb 2004 and I tell you it's a tough, challenging road ahead but it will be worth it. If any of you happen to enter the world of the Herk, I may be able to offer some addtional guidance as to what you can expect. Last words for the evening, enjoy san antonio the second time around...see just how many MTI's you can get to hold the door open for you...haha...enjoy pensacola for those of you going to water survival there....and keep your EYES and EARS open at fairchild b/c you will find out sooner rather than later...Good night everyone.

BigBaze
04-01-2008, 03:49 AM
You must be at Tyndall as well. I was out there doing the exact same thing.

yeah, you going to the April 11 class?

AfricanSnowOwl
04-01-2008, 04:03 AM
yeah, you going to the April 11 class?


No, my class doesn't start until July 18th unfortunately.

C-130 AMP FE
04-14-2008, 11:27 PM
MY ADVICE ( retired C-5 instructor FE / 6981.5 hours)

1) Don't retrain until you have a line number for E-6 / Technical Sergeant!!! Making rank in the FE career field is hell with much higher scores required to make rank (as compared to aircraft maintenance career fields). You want to retire as a MSgt or higher! The Air Force has too many grey haired Staff Sergeants running around approaching retirement.

2) Go through survival school during spring or fall. There are fewer temperature / weather extremes to deal with---don't forget your goretex boots (unless you like misery). Be very physically fit when you go. Be able to run like the wind and possess great physical strength. If you smoke and drink, stop now.

3) Try to get assigned to C-5's or KC10's. C-5's don't deploy like the other airlifters do. If you can't get a FE slot on C-5's then expect to pull rotational deployments to the toilets of the world on C130's and KC10's. On C-5's you go out for a few weeks and then return stateside to Dover or Travis. It's far nicer to stay at the Hilton on Guam then Achmed's tent at Baghdad Intl.

4) Don't be an academic disgrace---You had better do well in your studies and upgrade training or you will be back at Pope working in Bubba's sheetmetal shop pulling 12 hour shifts and #1 on his short deployment list.

5) Know when to retire and prepare for it. Don't worry, you will know when.

Spoken like a true big MAC dude. Folks, don't be led astray by this guy. C-5 slots are near impossible to come by anyway, and the KC-10 is not taking new FEs (I think that's still the way it is). What do you call climbing up to altitude & cruising along until it's time to land? BORING! While those guys may see more varied places right now, there's no level like low-level!

Gunner007
04-17-2008, 06:00 PM
Lots of good gouge posted here lately! As to making rank, i went from a career field of something like 30K people to one with 350 +/- people. My old coworkers are all SNCO's now. i run into them from time to time and email. I managed to make E-6 but have yet to make E-7. Its harder to make rank thats for sure! As for C-130 AMP FE, i would have to agree, low level flying is the most exciting! If your looking for action you will find it! If you prefer as my old C-141 buddy said, "feet up gear up" lifestyle then you may not be interested in helo's or 130's.
Its hard to find time to study all the pubs and AFI's thats true. I would guess however if your looking to fly you have some desire to excel at things so you will probably be okay.
As for formal training, dont be an ass but try to remember when your there that instructors should be instructing you. Some like to fall into the evaluator mindset and just watch you fly and critique you when its over. If you find yourself being critiqued more than instructed ask for the instructor to demo or show you things. If you dont understand, say so! If you bite your tongue and then go out for a check ride not knowing something, your setting yourself up for failure. There is no instruction on a check ride! Study instead of partying and drinking every night, pay attention, dont be a smart ass, and ask questions. If you can do that and you have an ability to learn you will do fine.

AfricanSnowOwl
04-17-2008, 11:56 PM
So what airframes can one expect to get assigned to when retraining into this career field?

dub13
04-18-2008, 02:26 AM
straight outta BFE you can get:
c-130's
c-5's
e-3
hh-60
uh-1
JSTARS
kc-10

and also i heard that if you are a crew chief on the CV-22's you could have a chance on getting on them.
I think that is all of the airframes out of BFE. I just found out I'm going E-3.

AfricanSnowOwl
04-18-2008, 03:37 AM
How long into your tech-school did you find out you got the E-3? Is that what you wanted? I have no idea which one I would want, but I figure I'd be happy on anything.

dub13
04-18-2008, 10:25 AM
You find out in block 3 now. Also I found out a few days earlier than the instructors told us by going to VMPF, Outprocessing, and then Personal Info. The info was on there as gaining base. Yea, Tinker was my first pick

TheMrs
04-19-2008, 06:44 AM
MY ADVICE ( retired C-5 instructor FE / 6981.5 hours)

1) Don't retrain until you have a line number for E-6 / Technical Sergeant!!! Making rank in the FE career field is hell with much higher scores required to make rank (as compared to aircraft maintenance career fields). You want to retire as a MSgt or higher! The Air Force has too many grey haired Staff Sergeants running around approaching retirement.

2) Go through survival school during spring or fall. There are fewer temperature / weather extremes to deal with---don't forget your goretex boots (unless you like misery). Be very physically fit when you go. Be able to run like the wind and possess great physical strength. If you smoke and drink, stop now.

3) Try to get assigned to C-5's or KC10's. C-5's don't deploy like the other airlifters do. If you can't get a FE slot on C-5's then expect to pull rotational deployments to the toilets of the world on C130's and KC10's. On C-5's you go out for a few weeks and then return stateside to Dover or Travis. It's far nicer to stay at the Hilton on Guam then Achmed's tent at Baghdad Intl.

4) Don't be an academic disgrace---You had better do well in your studies and upgrade training or you will be back at Pope working in Bubba's sheetmetal shop pulling 12 hour shifts and #1 on his short deployment list.

5) Know when to retire and prepare for it. Don't worry, you will know when.

My husband is in the process of retraining to FE. He's SrA. I had no idea that it would be harder for him to make rank in the future...hmmmm. Any of you getting helicopters?

AfricanSnowOwl
04-20-2008, 04:58 PM
After you finish basic flight engineer tech school and sere, do you have to go back to your base and wait for the next tech school for the airframe you get assigned? Also, do you get to fill out some sort of airframe "dream sheet" or anything like that? or do they just go off of what bases you have listed?

TheMrs
04-20-2008, 05:28 PM
After you finish basic flight engineer tech school and sere, do you have to go back to your base and wait for the next tech school for the airframe you get assigned? Also, do you get to fill out some sort of airframe "dream sheet" or anything like that? or do they just go off of what bases you have listed?

My husband just finished sere last month. He was supposed to come home for a few months before his next class started but I guess there is a large fail rate on helicopters so out of the blue (well at least to me) they started another class and now he's there for two more months. As for the dream sheet he put down the bases with the airframe that he wanted.

AMn Hughes
04-20-2008, 09:19 PM
Hello everyone, I'm currently training for my 3 level in the 2a5x1B career field, in other words a C-130 Crew Chief. My career has just started, and Ive only been in the Air Force for 6 months. Currently I have no intentions of cross training into 1a1x1 until Ive gotten a few years under my belt as a crew chief. My question is this, how big of a chance would you all think I would have at getting the 130 as my airframe when I eventually do decide to cross train. Being a crew chief for a 130 now, do you think it would up my chances at all? Or is the process of getting your airframe pretty much random?

Thanks for all you time.

Bomber1
04-22-2008, 06:56 PM
Howdy,
I fought the retrain monster for close to a year. Now I'm sitting fat and happy with a 6 June class start date. Anybody out there in computer land with the same class date?

Bomber

AfricanSnowOwl
04-23-2008, 12:53 PM
I guess I was kinda lucky, it only took me about 5 months to get a class date. Mine is July 18th

BigBaze
04-25-2008, 04:38 PM
Hello everyone, I'm currently training for my 3 level in the 2a5x1B career field, in other words a C-130 Crew Chief. My career has just started, and Ive only been in the Air Force for 6 months. Currently I have no intentions of cross training into 1a1x1 until Ive gotten a few years under my belt as a crew chief. My question is this, how big of a chance would you all think I would have at getting the 130 as my airframe when I eventually do decide to cross train. Being a crew chief for a 130 now, do you think it would up my chances at all? Or is the process of getting your airframe pretty much random?

Thanks for all you time.


I am close to completing the Basic Aircrew Undergraduate course here at Lackland, and start the Basic Flight Engineer (BFE) course next week. We are in the last block, and today filled out our "dream sheet" so to speak, they give you a list of available airframes and bases and you rank them 1-25 etc and your assignment comes down during Block 3 of the BFE course. From what the instructor supervisor told us, if you put C130 anywhere in your top 5 you pretty much are going to get it. We have Guard guys in the class, and one of them is a prior C130 crew chief. We were told the last class pretty much all got what they wanted. Since the people here are in contact with those who do up the assignments, I am sure they could get you C130's Good luck with your retraining down the road.

BigBaze
04-25-2008, 04:42 PM
After you finish basic flight engineer tech school and sere, do you have to go back to your base and wait for the next tech school for the airframe you get assigned? Also, do you get to fill out some sort of airframe "dream sheet" or anything like that? or do they just go off of what bases you have listed?

After BFE and SERE you go back to Tyndall and wait on the flying school. All the flying school slots for Fy08 are filled up, and the slots for Fy09 will be released in August sometime. But they will still project your flying school after you fill out your dream sheet, see my other post below. But I know the other two guys in my squadron at Tyndall just came back from SERE and were waiting 4 and 6 months respectively for Uh-1 Huey and C130 flying schools. After SERE I will be coming back to my old squadron and job and work there while I wait on a flying school

stapper
04-26-2008, 11:12 PM
Hey Guys

I am needing some peace of mind about my year long retraining process. I just got an update from AFPC regarding my retraining into FE. It seems like the funcitonal is already looking at my retraining package. i had to submit the feeder AFSC waiver letter to finalize the package. Do any of you know how much longer it takes to receive a class date once the functionals work their magic? Thanks

-Stapper

stapper
04-26-2008, 11:14 PM
Hey Guys

I need some peace of mind about my year long retraining process. I just got an update from AFPC regarding my retraining into FE. It seems like the functional is already looking at my retraining package. i had to submit the feeder AFSC waiver letter to finalize the package. Do any of you know how much longer it takes to receive a class date once the functional work their magic? Thanks

-Stapper

AfricanSnowOwl
04-27-2008, 06:33 PM
After I submitted my ETP for the feeder AFSC, it took about 2 months I think before I had my 5 status. Then the 6 status about a week later, which had my class date listed as 4 months later.

stapper
04-27-2008, 10:25 PM
What do you mean by 5 and 6 status. As you can see the folks at the call center will not give you any additional info.

AfricanSnowOwl
04-28-2008, 12:21 AM
After you get your application completely submitted, the status of it gets listed in the vMPF under retraining application status inquiry. A 3 status means your application is pending approval, 5 status means you pretty much got accepted, and a 6 status lists your tech school dates.

stapper
04-28-2008, 09:29 PM
AHHH!! Now it all comes together. That is a lot of help. Thanks

icetrey
04-29-2008, 02:16 PM
Hello everyone, after going through the months long process of getting my application together, I finally hit "submit" last week. I stumbled on this site on the net, and I have to say, after reading the 9 pages I feel like I have found my support group:) I do have a couple of questions, if anyone can assist.

When your application goes to CFM. is that the loosing or gaining CFM? What do that look at/for?

My ETP letter (I'm not a feeder AFSC) is just a simple memoradum, which I had endorsed by my CC "just because". Is there anything else to it? Also, I have my FAA PPL, I included a copy of that with the application.

I'm a TSgt, at a base with KC-10s (I guess that kinda narrows it down). I'm hoping to get 10s back here after BFE. With all the PCS dollar cuts I think my chances are good, anyone have any input on this?

Well, after reading all the threads it looks like I won't hear anything back until late June at the very soonest, then a school date no earlier than Oct since it appears all FY 08 slots are full. Is that a reasonable assumption?

Thanks for any informtion. I really wish I would have found this site a couple months ago.

AfricanSnowOwl
04-30-2008, 03:58 PM
My ETP was extremely basic and didn't even really give a reason why, but it still got accepted so you shouldn't need to worry.
Here is a link to a site that has sample ETPs and step by step walkthrough on how to retrain into any enlisted aviator job. It also lists quotas for each job.


https://afkm.wpafb.af.mil/asps/cop/opencop.asp?filter=oo-dp-so-02

Gunner7
05-02-2008, 03:02 PM
Hello everyone, after going through the months long process of getting my application together, I finally hit "submit" last week. I stumbled on this site on the net, and I have to say, after reading the 9 pages I feel like I have found my support group:) I do have a couple of questions, if anyone can assist.


My ETP letter (I'm not a feeder AFSC) is just a simple memoradum, which I had endorsed by my CC "just because". Is there anything else to it? Also, I have my FAA PPL, I included a copy of that with the application.


Thanks for any informtion. I really wish I would have found this site a couple months ago.

ICETREY,
Please call the contact center @ DSN:665-5000 and let them know your FAA PPL negates the need for a Feeder AFSC. The reference will be in the AFECD and also states that an A&P ticket will qualify you for exemption of the feeder AFSC as well. If this was the only reason for an ETP you should never had been advised to pursue one.
Contact me directly if you need help.

icetrey
05-02-2008, 07:05 PM
Thanks Gunner. I'm also in a balanced AFSC. I mentioned both issues in the ETP. It was worded "there are no in or out quotas in my current AFSC". Hopefully that flies (sorry for the pun:) I'll give AFPC a call anyways...

BigBaze
05-04-2008, 07:34 AM
Hello everyone, after going through the months long process of getting my application together, I finally hit "submit" last week. I stumbled on this site on the net, and I have to say, after reading the 9 pages I feel like I have found my support group:) I do have a couple of questions, if anyone can assist.

When your application goes to CFM. is that the loosing or gaining CFM? What do that look at/for?

My ETP letter (I'm not a feeder AFSC) is just a simple memoradum, which I had endorsed by my CC "just because". Is there anything else to it? Also, I have my FAA PPL, I included a copy of that with the application.

I'm a TSgt, at a base with KC-10s (I guess that kinda narrows it down). I'm hoping to get 10s back here after BFE. With all the PCS dollar cuts I think my chances are good, anyone have any input on this?

Well, after reading all the threads it looks like I won't hear anything back until late June at the very soonest, then a school date no earlier than Oct since it appears all FY 08 slots are full. Is that a reasonable assumption?

Thanks for any informtion. I really wish I would have found this site a couple months ago.


We just started the BFE class last week after graduating the Basic Aircrew course...and I have one guy in there who is a flying crew chief from a KC10 base, and another sheet metal guy from an E8 squadron. The AFPC rep who works here came in and talked to us about our assignments which we just put in for and should get back around the end of ths month. He told those guys they could pretty much count on going back to their bases because they would not have to PCS , and because the respective flying schools were right there and they would not have to go on a 6 month TDY. The CV-22 is not available for new FE's nor is anything at Hurlburt Field. However, one guy who graduated last week got CV-22's because he worked on them already and they changed the rules for him. Good luck to all you guys, my best advice is for you when you get a class date is get ready to take in a lot of information in a short time. One thing they don't tell you on the reporting instructions: When you get your flight physical, and you have to go see any other physician for any other reason, you must check with the flight doc afterwards and let him know. When we did the altitude chamber, they didn't let several people go through because when they checked the 1042's the system said they were DNIF (Duties not including Flying). They had to come back the next day and do the training all over again after seeing the flight doc at Wilford. All they had done was go to sick call and received cough medicine. Basically there are very few medicines they allow you to take while on flying duty, and anything you do take has to be approved by the flight doc. Just to be safe, I would check with your flight doc just before you come down here and make sure your flight physical is good to go, especially if you have gone to the hospital/clinic for any reason between the time you got your physical and whenever you leave for class. Good luck one again

icetrey
05-04-2008, 03:49 PM
That's comforting info Big Blaze, Best of luck down at BFE. It sounds like the lined your schools up one after the other no breaks, is that right?

dub13
05-04-2008, 05:25 PM
Big Baze what block you in right now? I just started block 8

c5engineer
05-05-2008, 02:27 AM
Hi all, I'm a former C-5 IFE with 4100 hrs. It sounds like all of you are AD X-training, but you might have some helpful info. I am in the IRR and looking at joining a reserve C-130 unit in Ohio where I'm currently living. Anyone know how long the TTU is? Also where the school house is located. I saw something that indicated Little Rock was still cooking. Before I left my old sqdn we took some 130 guys in from Atlanta, which was genning up to be the school house. I just assumed it was like my past sqdn at Kelly. We ended up in two sqdn, the 68th, which is the ops sqdn and a seperate flying sqdn. I'm curious b/c C-5 TTU is roughly 3 mos., but I saw 130's were longer. C-5's you don't graduate ready to fly, you qual as a 2nd engineer and then take a year at home station to upgrade. 141's used to almost fully qual you so I wondered if 130's do as well.

I envy some of you young bucks b/c I know what it was like to wait for BFE, then TTU and finally to get operational. Good luck to you.

dub13
05-05-2008, 02:44 AM
the school house for BFE is over at the Medina side of Lackland at Forbes hall. That is where all the 1A jobs are being taught at except for the linguists.

BigBaze
05-05-2008, 03:27 AM
That's comforting info Big Blaze, Best of luck down at BFE. It sounds like the lined your schools up one after the other no breaks, is that right?

Yeah I have everything through SERE and water training at Pensacola lined up, the only thing they don't schedule right away is your flying school because they have to come down with your assignment first and then get you a flying school slot

BigBaze
05-05-2008, 03:28 AM
Big Baze what block you in right now? I just started block 8


I just started block 1 of BFE, we block test Tuesday

TheMrs
05-07-2008, 05:56 AM
Did any of you have to go through LRAFB or was that just a one time thing?

BigBaze
05-08-2008, 12:51 AM
Did any of you have to go through LRAFB or was that just a one time thing?


If you get C130's that is where your initial flying school will be.

TheMrs
05-08-2008, 01:10 AM
If you get C130's that is where your initial flying school will be.

DH had to go to LRAFB after Lackland. he'll be on uh-1n and he had class with guys who were on C5s. His class was the first there. I was just wondering if any classes were following or did they decide to keep both at lackland.

BigBaze
05-08-2008, 04:09 AM
DH had to go to LRAFB after Lackland. he'll be on uh-1n and he had class with guys who were on C5s. His class was the first there. I was just wondering if any classes were following or did they decide to keep both at lackland.


The only schools that are here at Lackland are the Basic Aircrew and Basic Flight Engineer Schools as well as the C5 flying school. There may be some other things worked out though I don't know

ArcticChilla
05-12-2008, 12:54 PM
Good Morning!
I found this site a week or so ago after I myself had put in for retraining into in flight engineer. My application was already gone through my commander and Functional in less than a week thus far. I'm assuming this is rare, but hopefully there are others out there with the pipeline opened up to this point. I'm hoping with progress this fast thus far it should clear into a 5 soon! How's everyone elses training going out there? Any new news or new stories?

icetrey
05-12-2008, 03:09 PM
ArcticChilla,

Assuming you've read through the last 10 pages of this thread, you can probably expect to hear something in 2-3 months. I submitted my application in late April, and it took about three days to flow through my CC and CFM. AFPC said the board meets the 20-something of every month. Assuming your package is reviewed in May, you will hear something the end of June. That's when I'd start looking on VMPF to see your application status change from code 3, hopefully to 5 or 6.

If anyone else has better info or advice, please share....

ArcticChilla
05-13-2008, 07:59 PM
I assumed it would be right around that time frame. Thanks!

BigBaze
05-16-2008, 02:28 AM
about to test for Block 4 tomorrow, just got my assignment..getting Kc10's, just I wanted:)

icetrey
05-17-2008, 03:29 AM
Glad to hear it worked out for you BigBlaze. If you're headed to the right coast let me know. I"ll hopefully see you there in about 8 months or so when I'm at FTU (all pending of coarse). Furthermore, I'm sure I'd have some more questions for you. I'm hoping my application meets this month's board, and I'll hear something by the end of June.

Hitman
05-20-2008, 01:05 AM
My wife found this thread and it's been great in answering questions. I'm up here in Alaska and I'm coming up on my window to retrain from overseas. I've been in 10 years so I know I have few options to retrain. Currently I'm a FCC on C-17's and would rather not work on a different kind of heavy airframe. My questions are, what is my chance of getting the Osprey or helicopters, and if I do get a slot when would my family leave Alaska during the winter or could they wait till spring to PCS? Thanks for your help.

dub13
05-20-2008, 01:11 AM
My questions are, what is my chance of getting the Osprey or helicopters, and if I do get a slot when would my family leave Alaska during the winter or could they wait till spring to PCS? Thanks for your help.


Your chances of getting Ospreys just yet is highly unlikely. I just graduated the course and the instructors told us only people getting slots for them are guys who work maintenance on them prior to coming to BFE, i.e. crew chiefs on them. Getting helo's is a possibility. A guy from my class got HH-60's at Nellis and another got UH-1's out at Minot. PCS'ing out of Alaska I'm not sure. All I know about guys overseas retraining to FE is they PCS to the base they getting assigned to before they come out here to Lackland. So basically once you get approved you will already know what airframe you will be flying on. So good luck

BigBaze
05-20-2008, 04:20 AM
My wife found this thread and it's been great in answering questions. I'm up here in Alaska and I'm coming up on my window to retrain from overseas. I've been in 10 years so I know I have few options to retrain. Currently I'm a FCC on C-17's and would rather not work on a different kind of heavy airframe. My questions are, what is my chance of getting the Osprey or helicopters, and if I do get a slot when would my family leave Alaska during the winter or could they wait till spring to PCS? Thanks for your help.


Yep, since I have been here just one guy has got Ospreys and like Dub said he worked on them already so they made an exception. If you got accepted there is a pretty good chance you could get helicopters if you put them on top of the list, it all depends what is available. The only guys who got helos from our class were the two that came from overseas bases and already had their airframe assigned before coming to the school. Out of our class of 7 we have 2 on KC10's, 1 on C5, 1 on JSTARS, and the 2 overseas guys on HH60 and UH1 and our guard guy who is going back to C130's Our 8th got sent home for failing 2 block tests, and he was going to get AWACS. The assignment SNCO from Randolph was pretty helpful in getting you what you wanted if it was available, but needs of the AF come first. I got my second choice. (KC10) Since you are coming from overseas I am pretty sure if you get accepted you will be assigned a base and an airframe before you arrive here at Lackland, I am not sure how you pick, I will ask the guys tomorrow and get back to you all.

BigBaze
05-23-2008, 06:06 PM
Just passed Block 5... 4 more to go::>

AfricanSnowOwl
05-23-2008, 08:50 PM
How many people are in the average sized classes in Lackland? Is it all re-trainee's?

dub13
05-24-2008, 12:45 AM
Big Baze, now that you passed block 5 it is all down hill from there. the 2 other TOLD blocks get easier and blk 8-9 are a breeze

ArcticSnowOwl,., yes they are all retrainees. My class had nine retrainees to start off with and then two washed back into my class so we graduated with 11. The class that graduated before me had 5 graduate I think. I guess it all depends

BigBaze
05-26-2008, 02:32 AM
How many people are in the average sized classes in Lackland? Is it all re-trainee's?


In EAUC you will be in class with some airmen straight out of basic because it won't just be FE's in those classes, but rather any kind of enlisted aviator, we had crypto linguists in our EAUC as well. The BFE is all retrainees though. Yeah Dub I am glad to be done with Block 5, we lost one already from Block 4 so we are down to 7, but two failed Block 5 and have to retest Tuesday, so if they fail again I guess they will be gone too. Like you said I hear the rest is downhill but I am not going to let up...all you guys who are about to come up here, just be ready to study and apply yourselves...and you'll be fine..

BigBaze
05-29-2008, 11:18 PM
Block 6 down....on to 7 tomorrow

Theloweman
05-30-2008, 06:47 AM
The only part about this FE application process I don't understand is when the flight medical examination is performed... Do they have you do it after a class date has been selected for you? I have heard horror stories about Flight medicine dragging their feet and screwing up medicals. I'm sure most of you have been through a class III medical recently.. any tips or pointers?? and when do i do it?? Thanks to all for the good info in this thread!!

- In Korea with no follow on - Help!

AfricanSnowOwl
05-30-2008, 03:05 PM
After you submit a request to retrain, you'll get a response saying you are approved to re-train into this career field and to submit an application. Along with the application is the flight physical. I just went into flight med and showed them all the paperwork I needed for my application. They gave me a big packet of stuff I had to get done before they would even do a flight physical. It was kind of like going through MEPS again, but after all that was done(it took about a full day), I got an appointment to get a flight physical. After they do the physical, it takes a little over a month for them to send the results to your UDM. Then you can submit your application to retrain.

BigBaze
05-30-2008, 09:07 PM
The only part about this FE application process I don't understand is when the flight medical examination is performed... Do they have you do it after a class date has been selected for you? I have heard horror stories about Flight medicine dragging their feet and screwing up medicals. I'm sure most of you have been through a class III medical recently.. any tips or pointers?? and when do i do it?? Thanks to all for the good info in this thread!!

- In Korea with no follow on - Help!

Welcome to the thread. I enjoy helping out people trying to retrain into this career field because I know a lot of people helped me out, since AFPC is useless at times for info. You will need to get the medical completed before you officially submit your application to AFPC. You will not get a class date until you have the entire package submitted and approved by AFPC. Basically you just go to your flight medicine office and request a Class 3 flight physical. In my case they pulled my med records for review to see if there is any medical history preventing me from flying duty. That was about 2 weeks. Then they schedule the flight physical which includes eye, blood, urine, and depth perception tests. They also X ray your chest and do an EKG test. They should give you a checklist of everything you need to get done. After all this is done the flight doc does a few checks and if he approves it he gets the medical commander to sign it and it goes up to AF Materiel Command for final approval which took about 2 weeks. Once it came back you just fax the necessary medical documents in to AFPC (they will give you a list of which ones) along with your EPR's etc. The board meets on the third week of every month and will release results around the time the next month's board convenes. Make sure you make copies of ALL medical documents, you will need to bring them to school with you, especially your Form 1042, which is your flight physical. If you have any questions don't hesitate to ask...I am graduating June 11

Theloweman
06-04-2008, 04:06 PM
Thanks for the info guys! This thread has given me so much good information! Looks like the only thing that might stop me from getting a flying slot would be not passing the Class III Medical. In my last 10 years in the Air Force, I have had 2 shoulder surgeries but am 100% world wide qualified and function normal. Anyone have a previous surgery affect their Class III Medical? I really hope this thing works out for me... I've wanted to fly ever since I joined. Anyone here stationed at Tinker, Dyess, or Little Rock??

TheLoweMan

AfricanSnowOwl
06-04-2008, 11:18 PM
When I look on the vMPF, and in my training RIP, it only has EAUC and BFE classes listed. Do they add SERE and parachute training while i'm in Lackland?

My neighbor just passed a class III flight physical, and he's had some sort of surgery on his back.

icetrey
06-04-2008, 11:19 PM
Bad news today...My retraining applicaton was denied due to all FY08 quotas filled. I was told FY09 is expected out in July, and I can re-submit then. My Class III is good for 6 months, so hopefully there's a couple TSgt slots for 09 and I can simply just re-submit my application if NLT Aug. UUGGHHH!

BigBaze
06-05-2008, 03:42 AM
When I look on the vMPF, and in my training RIP, it only has EAUC and BFE classes listed. Do they add SERE and parachute training while i'm in Lackland?

My neighbor just passed a class III flight physical, and he's had some sort of surgery on his back.


They just may not have SERE slots open yet. Just come to Lackland for your EAUC and BFE schools and they will answer a lot of those questions. The FE functional manager comes up here a lot from Randolph

BigBaze
06-05-2008, 03:43 AM
Bad news today...My retraining applicaton was denied due to all FY08 quotas filled. I was told FY09 is expected out in July, and I can re-submit then. My Class III is good for 6 months, so hopefully there's a couple TSgt slots for 09 and I can simply just re-submit my application if NLT Aug. UUGGHHH!


Hang in there. Our class has to wait for FY09 flying school slots so we are looking at around November/December.

icetrey
06-05-2008, 08:12 PM
Hang in there. Our class has to wait for FY09 flying school slots so we are looking at around November/December.

So what are you guys going to be doing in between school?

BigBaze
06-05-2008, 08:42 PM
So what are you guys going to be doing in between school?


I have SERE right after I graduate and after that it is back to my home unit working my old job until I go to flight school. I may PCS to McGuire for the flight school, so I am looking at around Oct/Nov...

RandomD
06-09-2008, 05:09 PM
Hey I was just approved for my retraining at the end of May. I start class on 10 October. Anyone else gonna be there at that time?

BigBaze
06-10-2008, 09:36 PM
Just finished Block 9 today and graduate tomorrow...good luck to you all...

AfricanSnowOwl
06-10-2008, 11:39 PM
Do you get your wings when you graduate BFE?

BigBaze
06-11-2008, 12:19 AM
Do you get your wings when you graduate BFE?


Yes you get them at graduation in service dress. They have a ceremony in the auditorium and you pick an instructor you want to pin them on. I will be doing that tomorrow.

ArcticChilla
06-11-2008, 12:40 PM
Just got my status 5 today! It was snowing and sleet here today too so it made a horrible day turn into one helluva day! Hope to see a class date soon.

Falcon-Hog
06-11-2008, 01:33 PM
This is my take on it. They (HQ) sould make it easier to croos train into those chronic career fields. I wouldn't mind cross training but I'm in Korea so i dont have the TOS requirement covered. And they don't want TSgt's they should really open it up more!

BigBaze
06-15-2008, 03:38 AM
Just got my status 5 today! It was snowing and sleet here today too so it made a horrible day turn into one helluva day! Hope to see a class date soon.


you should see status 6 very soon...get ready to hit the books hard when you get there and you'll do great..

ChaplainC
06-15-2008, 04:26 PM
Just finished Block 9 today and graduate tomorrow...good luck to you all...

Hey there BigBaze

I wanted to tell you thanks a lot for keeping us all informed as to your progress. It has been really pleasant to read along with your experiences and see that you have done so well.

Let us know where you end up going, and what aircraft you are on please!

Cheers

ChaplainC

BigBaze
06-15-2008, 06:09 PM
Hey there BigBaze

I wanted to tell you thanks a lot for keeping us all informed as to your progress. It has been really pleasant to read along with your experiences and see that you have done so well.

Let us know where you end up going, and what aircraft you are on please!

Cheers

ChaplainC


Thanks a lot Chaplain...! I started this thread quite some time ago because I was having trouble with the application process...and now it has ended up helping lots of others who are trying to apply and I am more than happy to help...I graduated last Wednesday and I am going to KC10's at McGuire AFB sometime towards the end of the year.

Thanks again sir..

BigBaze

dub13
06-16-2008, 04:52 AM
big baze when you start SERE? Just to let you know its tons of fun!! not really

ArcticChilla
06-16-2008, 08:16 PM
you should see status 6 very soon...get ready to hit the books hard when you get there and you'll do great..

I hope so. The sooner I'm on my way into 1A1 life the better. I have no gripes with studying hard. Does anyone have a general tech school layout? I've been trying to find a rough calendar that lays out essentially what kind of a timeline to expect. Trying to look at planning out if it's worth moving out of the house and in with the future in-laws in between tech schools. Thanks!

Orrion76
06-16-2008, 10:52 PM
Big Baze, I just wanted to tell you that I saw a post of yours made it into the printed copy of AF Times a while a few months ago. I don't remember what it was about though. I start my first class this Friday so I am getting excited. Baze also wanted to see if you know about the availible slots there at McGuire? I would either like to be on C5's which I worked on for 9 years or KC-10's.

BigBaze
06-17-2008, 05:38 PM
big baze when you start SERE? Just to let you know its tons of fun!! not really


Hey Dub..wondered when you were going to resurface...I just got back from BFE and I go to SERE this Thursday...can't wait for the fun to start:)

BigBaze
06-17-2008, 05:44 PM
Big Baze, I just wanted to tell you that I saw a post of yours made it into the printed copy of AF Times a while a few months ago. I don't remember what it was about though. I start my first class this Friday so I am getting excited. Baze also wanted to see if you know about the availible slots there at McGuire? I would either like to be on C5's which I worked on for 9 years or KC-10's.


It was about a TACP getting a medal for serving with the Army..good luck with your class...just study hard, especially group study! I am not sure about the slots at all man, but during your class (they will tell you when)..you will fill out a dream sheet for what base you want to go to...if you want C5's your choice will be Travis or Dover and Kc10's will be Travis or McGuire..most of the classes I have seen have gotten their top 5 pick...having worked on C5's will help you because the functional manager will work with if he has slots if you ask him the right way..

BigBaze
06-17-2008, 05:52 PM
I hope so. The sooner I'm on my way into 1A1 life the better. I have no gripes with studying hard. Does anyone have a general tech school layout? I've been trying to find a rough calendar that lays out essentially what kind of a timeline to expect. Trying to look at planning out if it's worth moving out of the house and in with the future in-laws in between tech schools. Thanks!


You basically start on a Friday by showing up at the 344th auditorium in blues where they give you a briefing and you get split up into classes for EAUC. You will be in class with other enlisted aviator hopefuls like crypto linguists, loadmasters, flight attendants etc (yes, flight attendants:)) My EAUC was from 11 April to 30 April..and involves 3 blocks, mainly a lot of stuff concerning TO's, AFI's, publications, and basic aircrew fundamentals like anti terrorism, hijacking etc. You will go to the altitude chamber at Randolph in block 2. My BFE course was 9 blocks; from 1 May to 11 June and just get ready for a lot of math; learning to fill out fuel logs, flight plans, weight and balance forms as well as learning basic navigation; how to read instrument approaches, maps..as well as weather and all that good stuff, as well as the dreaded TOLD of block 5. (takeoff and landing data) All you need for that is attention to detail...it really wasn't that bad. The instructors are great and are very helpful, I would recommend driving there if you can because the classes are on Medina Annex, just of Lackland...and the base is so huge and spread out as well. Good luck to you..

ArcticChilla
06-17-2008, 08:13 PM
You basically start on a Friday by showing up at the 344th auditorium in blues where they give you a briefing and you get split up into classes for EAUC. You will be in class with other enlisted aviator hopefuls like crypto linguists, loadmasters, flight attendants etc (yes, flight attendants:)) My EAUC was from 11 April to 30 April..and involves 3 blocks, mainly a lot of stuff concerning TO's, AFI's, publications, and basic aircrew fundamentals like anti terrorism, hijacking etc. You will go to the altitude chamber at Randolph in block 2. My BFE course was 9 blocks; from 1 May to 11 June and just get ready for a lot of math; learning to fill out fuel logs, flight plans, weight and balance forms as well as learning basic navigation; how to read instrument approaches, maps..as well as weather and all that good stuff, as well as the dreaded TOLD of block 5. (takeoff and landing data) All you need for that is attention to detail...it really wasn't that bad. The instructors are great and are very helpful, I would recommend driving there if you can because the classes are on Medina Annex, just of Lackland...and the base is so huge and spread out as well. Good luck to you..

Excellent!

Just got 2 of my class dates and was told by my formal training section they are both in Lackland.

7 Nov 08 - 28 Nov 08 Aircrew Fundamentals-Flight Engineer
01 Dec 08 - 26 Jan 09 Flight Engineer Apprentice

If anyone else is heading down there during that time hit me up!

My training section told me that all the training wil be back to back to back. So no breaks in between to head back to my home base. Works out good that way though. Brining the fiance along too for a fun ride and a good study partner. Any other good info is always a plus! Thanks again and look forward to those that I meet in the future!

BigBaze
06-17-2008, 09:08 PM
I see you are at Malmstrom...there is a good chance you will be going back there on UH-1 Hueys..because if they don't have to PCS you they usually won't...we had a guy from Robins and he is going right back there on E8's..even though he put them last on his list...but anything is possible..just giving you a heads up..don't know if you like it up there or not..

Jetmac
06-17-2008, 10:54 PM
I am thinking about doing this too

ArcticChilla
06-18-2008, 02:20 PM
I see you are at Malmstrom...there is a good chance you will be going back there on UH-1 Hueys..because if they don't have to PCS you they usually won't...we had a guy from Robins and he is going right back there on E8's..even though he put them last on his list...but anything is possible..just giving you a heads up..don't know if you like it up there or not..


lol I kind of have been figuring on coming back here. Hate my current job not neccesarrily the area. Not a huge fan, BUT being a FE will be better than what I am doing now. I want rotorcraft in a bad way anyways....so I guess that's a better weight in my ballcourt right....lol. Thanks again!

BigBaze
06-18-2008, 02:51 PM
lol I kind of have been figuring on coming back here. Hate my current job not neccesarrily the area. Not a huge fan, BUT being a FE will be better than what I am doing now. I want rotorcraft in a bad way anyways....so I guess that's a better weight in my ballcourt right....lol. Thanks again!

You bet...there is a guy from my squadron here who just left for UH1 school at Kirtland and has been assigned to Malmstrom...that's a good thing you wanted helos I am sure you will get them too....I wanted a fixed wing because that is what I work on...so it worked out well for me

ArcticChilla
06-18-2008, 07:07 PM
You bet...there is a guy from my squadron here who just left for UH1 school at Kirtland and has been assigned to Malmstrom...that's a good thing you wanted helos I am sure you will get them too....I wanted a fixed wing because that is what I work on...so it worked out well for me


If that's what it takes to get Helo I guess that's what it takes. This base is deffinitely in a world of it's own and hopefully I'll get to go somewhere new and fresh. Goin on 5yrs here so fresh would be nice.

BigBaze
06-18-2008, 09:30 PM
If that's what it takes to get Helo I guess that's what it takes. This base is deffinitely in a world of it's own and hopefully I'll get to go somewhere new and fresh. Goin on 5yrs here so fresh would be nice.


Well the good news is you can move on to another airframe after I think 4 years...they have HH60's all over the place (Hurlburt, Moody, Kirtland, Davis- Monthan, Kadena, Mildenhall..etc) so you could make that transition..or if you are feeling especially bold there is the CV-22 which carries 2 engineers.

BigBaze
06-18-2008, 10:33 PM
Off to SERE tomorrow....see y'all in a couple weeks

Proud Mom
06-18-2008, 10:45 PM
Off to SERE tomorrow....see y'all in a couple weeks

Don't forget the evasion part so you don't have to practice the escape part....have fun!!!

BigBaze
06-19-2008, 03:08 AM
Don't forget the evasion part so you don't have to practice the escape part....have fun!!!


LOL I hear noone really evades those guys....and being 6'5 I make quite a target but I'll give it a shot:>

Proud Mom
06-19-2008, 03:11 AM
LOL I hear noone really evades those guys....and being 6'5 I make quite a target but I'll give it a shot:>


Well practice saying Im BigBaze and you cannot make me talk then LOL

Dang your tall. 2 of my brats are a mere 6'4"...at 5'5" I have to crane my neck to fuss at em LOL

Enjoy, be safe and then come back here and tell us all about it!!

dub13
06-19-2008, 03:39 AM
Hey Dub..wondered when you were going to resurface...I just got back from BFE and I go to SERE this Thursday...can't wait for the fun to start:)

Yea, have two more days of here till i graduate.. All i can say is im really glad to all this about over! Best thing for this course is a positive attitude. when you are here you will see what i am talking about

BigBaze
06-19-2008, 04:15 AM
Yea, have two more days of here till i graduate.. All i can say is im really glad to all this about over! Best thing for this course is a positive attitude. when you are here you will see what i am talking about


well I will be up there tomorrow...got parachute training on Friday...

ramprat
06-19-2008, 04:26 AM
the af is in a react mode with needs and assignments for the last 20 yrs according to
articles in af times ( but the af dont know that they dont know)
long range planning is next tuesday.
im long retired and af always had some problems in this area.
in my case yrs ago i went to jet aircraft school with a secondary mos as jet eng mech.
( in those days you usally had a primary and secondary mos in aircraft field)
worked on f80s on okinawa 48-49 and came back to states and assigned to kb29s
and later i asked the maint officer why my name was not on the promotion list,his
reply was"youre not working in your mos".29s had recip engines.

AfricanSnowOwl
06-19-2008, 12:45 PM
I finally got my orders to leave. They don't include SERE or parachute training, but hopefully that can be fixed when I get to Lackland. I start the 18th of July.

Misat
06-19-2008, 04:23 PM
Artichilla I have the same class days as you. I am stationed here at Lackland so you there is anything you might need to know about the base I can probably help.

icetrey
06-20-2008, 02:25 AM
Must say...getting really jealous. I was denied (hopefully temporarily) retraining due to all FY09 quotas filled. Reading everyone's stories is like pouring salt in my eyes:) Congrats to the recent graduates and best of luck to the "soon to bees".

I spoke with an aircrew assignments guy and he said new quotas should be released next month (he also added the unofficial numbers - looks good), and thankfully all I have to do is just re-submit my already prepared application (medical still good). BigBaze - let me know when you find out you're headed up this way...however I'm hoping I won't be here due to tech school:)

BigBaze
06-21-2008, 12:50 AM
Must say...getting really jealous. I was denied (hopefully temporarily) retraining due to all FY09 quotas filled. Reading everyone's stories is like pouring salt in my eyes:) Congrats to the recent graduates and best of luck to the "soon to bees".

I spoke with an aircrew assignments guy and he said new quotas should be released next month (he also added the unofficial numbers - looks good), and thankfully all I have to do is just re-submit my already prepared application (medical still good). BigBaze - let me know when you find out you're headed up this way...however I'm hoping I won't be here due to tech school:)


Hang in there Trey I am sure you will get picked up once the new quotas drop...! I am waiting on the flying school slots to open right now....I just finished parachute training up here at Fairchild today..we didn't do any actual parachuting..just learning how to land...but the instructors did a jump from a UH1 Huey and then demonstrated a rescue with 2 Hueys....really cool..and then we got to ride the hoist up into the helo which was awesome..start that SERE on Monday!!

rendiculous
06-22-2008, 08:19 PM
HEY! I am brand new to this thread and just looking for some info and maybe some emotional support...LOL. I just received my rip friday and I am so freakin excited. I put in my package last September. I have two dates:

EAUC 7 November
Flight Engineer Helper 28 November

Is anyone else going to be down there at this time? Also, Is the 6 week course BFE? Is it at Medina or Little Rock? I'm receiving conflicting information. Oh yeah, and am I pretty much going to be the only female in this career field or what?

BigBaze
06-22-2008, 08:57 PM
HEY! I am brand new to this thread and just looking for some info and maybe some emotional support...LOL. I just received my rip friday and I am so freakin excited. I put in my package last September. I have two dates:

EAUC 7 November
Flight Engineer Helper 28 November

Is anyone else going to be down there at this time? Also, Is the 6 week course BFE? Is it at Medina or Little Rock? I'm receiving conflicting information. Oh yeah, and am I pretty much going to be the only female in this career field or what?


Hey good luck with your training and congrats on being selected. During my time down at Lackland I saw only one female FE..but she graduated and actually is up here at SERE with me. EAUC and BFE are both on Medina in the same building. We had one Guard guy in our class going to C130's and his BFE was at Little Rock...so you might want to confirm...I don't know if you are Guard or not! The BFE is the 6 week course btw. Once again ,good luck ..get ready to study when you get down there...!

rendiculous
06-23-2008, 12:16 AM
[QUOTE=BigBaze;109866]Hey good luck with your training and congrats on being selected. During my time down at Lackland I saw only one female FE..but she graduated and actually is up here at SERE with me. EAUC and BFE are both on Medina in the same building. We had one Guard guy in our class going to C130's and his BFE was at Little Rock...so you might want to confirm...I don't know if you are Guard or not! The BFE is the 6 week course btw. Once again ,good luck ..get ready to study when you get down there...![/QUOTE

Thanks BigBaze.....it's nice to have someone to get info from other than the AFPC people. They're not a lot of help. So, after you're finished with BFE, SERE, and the parachuting course you go to a school for your specific aircraft right? Is the location of that course dependent upon the aircraft that you get?

TheMrs
06-23-2008, 03:57 AM
HEY! I am brand new to this thread and just looking for some info and maybe some emotional support...LOL. I just received my rip friday and I am so freakin excited. I put in my package last September. I have two dates:

EAUC 7 November
Flight Engineer Helper 28 November

Is anyone else going to be down there at this time? Also, Is the 6 week course BFE? Is it at Medina or Little Rock? I'm receiving conflicting information. Oh yeah, and am I pretty much going to be the only female in this career field or what?

My husbands BFE was at Little Rock for BFE but he said that after his class they were supposed to send everyone to Medina. He had a UH-1N class with a female FE. Good luck on everything!!!

ChaplainC
06-23-2008, 04:59 AM
Good luck Ren, I am sure you will do just great. Buckle down, and you will make it.

BigBaze, do they have MTLs through any of the training?

What do you think of SERE? I almost got to do SERE at USAFA, but they dropped it that year and then made it super easy the next year because people complained too much. Got into the papers.

ArcticChilla
06-23-2008, 12:08 PM
Artichilla I have the same class days as you. I am stationed here at Lackland so you there is anything you might need to know about the base I can probably help.

Nah not really bro, but much appreciated. I'm bringing my fiance with me down there so we can chill and she can help me study. Hoping to have a little bit of fun while we're down there. Deffinitely want to hit up Six flags and schlitterbaun (or however it's spelled).

For anyone else during the first two courses what is there to expect for any additional TDY's? I'm pretty sure you go to Randolph for the rapid depressurization test. Is there any others?

Good Luck in SERE BigBaze! I'm looking forward to doing that in the middle of winter! At least growing up in Michigan for 18 years will help for something!

Rendiculous - I have those dates, FE Helper starts on 1 DEC tho. So at least we get a couple down days between. Sounds like a Six flags weekend!

ArcticChilla
06-23-2008, 12:15 PM
Thanks BigBaze.....it's nice to have someone to get info from other than the AFPC people. They're not a lot of help. So, after you're finished with BFE, SERE, and the parachuting course you go to a school for your specific aircraft right? Is the location of that course dependent upon the aircraft that you get?

The bases from what formal training has told me so far is: Lackland (ACF, FE Helper), Fairchild (SERE), Pensecola (Parachute (fixed wing)/Water Survival (rotorcraft)), Fairchild (no idea...lol).

I have 2 of my 5 class dates so far. Still waiting on my other 3. Supposidely I should be getting them before I leave.

AfricanSnowOwl
06-23-2008, 12:31 PM
I only have 2 of the classes listed as well, but I got an email the other day saying they assign SERE and the others after a few blocks of ACF.

BigBaze
06-23-2008, 07:12 PM
Thanks BigBaze.....it's nice to have someone to get info from other than the AFPC people. They're not a lot of help. So, after you're finished with BFE, SERE, and the parachuting course you go to a school for your specific aircraft right? Is the location of that course dependent upon the aircraft that you get?[/quote]


Yes, just be ready to wait a few months for a flying slot...that's just the nature of the beast though. KC10 is at either Travis or McGuire, C130 is at Little Rock, UH1/HH60 I think is at Kirtland, E8 at Robins, E3 at Tinker, C5 is at Kelly....I do not have an official assignment for my flying school yet, I just have the slot..so I am probably looking at December time frame for KC10 flight school..stay tuned!

BigBaze
06-23-2008, 07:14 PM
Good luck Ren, I am sure you will do just great. Buckle down, and you will make it.

BigBaze, do they have MTLs through any of the training?

What do you think of SERE? I almost got to do SERE at USAFA, but they dropped it that year and then made it super easy the next year because people complained too much. Got into the papers.


They have MTL's at the school house for the kids coming straight from basic...but for retrainees we pretty much are under the supervision of the class leader (highest ranking NCO) so as long as you act like a professional, the instructors are awesome...I just started SERE today..so I will let you know how it goes...I just know we did a ton of Powerpoint today!!!

rendiculous
06-24-2008, 02:51 PM
My husbands BFE was at Little Rock for BFE but he said that after his class they were supposed to send everyone to Medina. He had a UH-1N class with a female FE. Good luck on everything!!!

Thanks for the info! Im trying to reel some of this in because there is a lot of conflicting information out there. It seems that this is the most reliable source out there for new FE's. It's awesome that you're so supportive of your husband through all of this. I'm sure you are well aware of how much he is going to be gone once he finishes up with all these courses.

rendiculous
06-24-2008, 02:54 PM
ArcticChilla - so you're gonna be going through this mess with me? Good stuff....and I'm all about some Six Flags

rendiculous
06-24-2008, 02:57 PM
Nah not really bro, but much appreciated. I'm bringing my fiance with me down there so we can chill and she can help me study. Hoping to have a little bit of fun while we're down there. Deffinitely want to hit up Six flags and schlitterbaun (or however it's spelled).

For anyone else during the first two courses what is there to expect for any additional TDY's? I'm pretty sure you go to Randolph for the rapid depressurization test. Is there any others?

Good Luck in SERE BigBaze! I'm looking forward to doing that in the middle of winter! At least growing up in Michigan for 18 years will help for something!

Rendiculous - I have those dates, FE Helper starts on 1 DEC tho. So at least we get a couple down days between. Sounds like a Six flags weekend!


Thanks BigBaze.....it's nice to have someone to get info from other than the AFPC people. They're not a lot of help. So, after you're finished with BFE, SERE, and the parachuting course you go to a school for your specific aircraft right? Is the location of that course dependent upon the aircraft that you get?


Yes, just be ready to wait a few months for a flying slot...that's just the nature of the beast though. KC10 is at either Travis or McGuire, C130 is at Little Rock, UH1/HH60 I think is at Kirtland, E8 at Robins, E3 at Tinker, C5 is at Kelly....I do not have an official assignment for my flying school yet, I just have the slot..so I am probably looking at December time frame for KC10 flight school..stay tuned![/QUOTE]

Thanks for info Big Baze....that is a hell of a lot more than I've been getting from anywhere else.

BigBaze
06-25-2008, 04:21 AM
Thanks for info Big Baze....that is a hell of a lot more than I've been getting from anywhere else.[/quote]


No problem...I think we all know how info from AFPC works...The schoolhouse instructors are really helpful in getting you info as you go along...all you need to worry about right now is showing up on time to the first class with all your flight physical in order...I am doing well up here at SERE, we go into the mountains on Sunday and I am going to eat a bunny. All of you will do fine, you all went through the BS it took to apply and get your flight phys etc, so you wouldn't be at school if ya didn't want to be! Just study..better yet...group study..and all is well...if any of you are country like me...Cowboy's Dancehall is the place to be:> Oh yeah..they do have movie theaters that serve beer too...

ArcticChilla
06-25-2008, 12:48 PM
No problem...I think we all know how info from AFPC works...The schoolhouse instructors are really helpful in getting you info as you go along...all you need to worry about right now is showing up on time to the first class with all your flight physical in order...I am doing well up here at SERE, we go into the mountains on Sunday and I am going to eat a bunny. All of you will do fine, you all went through the BS it took to apply and get your flight phys etc, so you wouldn't be at school if ya didn't want to be! Just study..better yet...group study..and all is well...if any of you are country like me...Cowboy's Dancehall is the place to be:> Oh yeah..they do have movie theaters that serve beer too...

How long are you at Fairchild for? You're only a few hours from me right now. Weather should be pretty decent...probably pretty hot over there though. Hope all is well though!

Rendiculous - Yeah looks like it will be a good fight though! I'm stoked to get out of here ASAP! We'll save those stories for a night at the bar though!

BigBaze
06-25-2008, 07:33 PM
How long are you at Fairchild for? You're only a few hours from me right now. Weather should be pretty decent...probably pretty hot over there though. Hope all is well though!

Rendiculous - Yeah looks like it will be a good fight though! I'm stoked to get out of here ASAP! We'll save those stories for a night at the bar though!


I am here until Jul 11...we just started this week and go into the mountains on Sunday...my entire FE class showed up here and we are all going through together so that makes it awesome..and yes..the weather is beautiful up here!

ArcticChilla
06-25-2008, 08:26 PM
I am here until Jul 11...we just started this week and go into the mountains on Sunday...my entire FE class showed up here and we are all going through together so that makes it awesome..and yes..the weather is beautiful up here!

Good to hear!

It's hot as hell over here in Montana right now. Remember don't eat the bright colored bugs!

rendiculous
06-27-2008, 12:33 PM
I am here until Jul 11...we just started this week and go into the mountains on Sunday...my entire FE class showed up here and we are all going through together so that makes it awesome..and yes..the weather is beautiful up here!

Good luck with SERE Big Baze! I heard the POW part is pretty rough....be sure to give us some insight on that craziness. It's lookin like I'm probably gonna be there around the February timeframe. That's gonna suck. Atleast it's nice weather for ya right now.....I'll trade!

AfricanSnowOwl
06-27-2008, 12:56 PM
Probably a dumb question, but I'm assuming it would be a good idea to bring a crappy set of bdu's for SERE?

RandomD
06-27-2008, 05:42 PM
Probably a dumb question, but I'm assuming it would be a good idea to bring a crappy set of bdu's for SERE?

You should be getting issued a couple flight suits. I'd take one of those. A guy I know just went through it and said the Flight Suit made it more comfortable. That's what I'm takin.

TheMrs
06-27-2008, 06:54 PM
Thanks for the info! Im trying to reel some of this in because there is a lot of conflicting information out there. It seems that this is the most reliable source out there for new FE's. It's awesome that you're so supportive of your husband through all of this. I'm sure you are well aware of how much he is going to be gone once he finishes up with all these courses.


We are going to Minot and from what I hear....they aren't gone much up there but I'm always expeting the unexpected being a daughter of a marine and now a wife of an airman.

This is a nice board and has given me some insight on what the husband was going through. He is now finishing up his UH-1N specific at Kirtland so he's almost done. I wish my schooling was that short for my career! I still have 2 more years to go...

Are a lot of you married??

BigBaze
06-28-2008, 06:00 AM
You should be getting issued a couple flight suits. I'd take one of those. A guy I know just went through it and said the Flight Suit made it more comfortable. That's what I'm takin.


Do not waste your flight suits! Go with the BDU's..you will be getting dirty..especially if you go through the SV80B parachute training first...and the SV80A SERE you will be doing a lot of low crawling...a bunch of people with flight suits here are already breaking out the BDU's:>

Smeghead
06-28-2008, 06:24 AM
We are going to Minot and from what I hear....they aren't gone much up there but I'm always expeting the unexpected being a daughter of a marine and now a wife of an airman.

This is a nice board and has given me some insight on what the husband was going through. He is now finishing up his UH-1N specific at Kirtland so he's almost done. I wish my schooling was that short for my career! I still have 2 more years to go...

Are a lot of you married??

A good friend was a Huey FE there. They're not gone much, you're right on that. Occasional deployments do come up in that wing, even though they're considered deployed in garrison when they're out in the fields. Didn't see any of the 54th Helo guys go though. You'll like Minot if you have kids, they have very good schools.

BigBaze
06-28-2008, 10:49 PM
I am off to the mountains for SERE from Monday til Friday...hope all goes well for all of you waiting on class dates or still applying!...

rendiculous
06-30-2008, 12:11 PM
We are going to Minot and from what I hear....they aren't gone much up there but I'm always expeting the unexpected being a daughter of a marine and now a wife of an airman.

This is a nice board and has given me some insight on what the husband was going through. He is now finishing up his UH-1N specific at Kirtland so he's almost done. I wish my schooling was that short for my career! I still have 2 more years to go...

Are a lot of you married??

I'm interested in flying on a helo but I was told that females aren't permitted to be FE's on them. Didn't you mention before that your husband went through a course with a female who was going to be a UH-1N FE?

AfricanSnowOwl
06-30-2008, 03:17 PM
I work with a female that was originaly an FE on HH-60's, I think she failed out of something at the very end of the school though and ended up in comm.

drblue917
06-30-2008, 07:01 PM
I work with a female that was originaly an FE on HH-60's, I think she failed out of something at the very end of the school though and ended up in comm.

my cross training just got appoved and i have a class date in october. i was just wondering is the trainig really that difficult? i cant see the military washing you out unless you are basically worthless.

AfricanSnowOwl
06-30-2008, 07:28 PM
my cross training just got appoved and i have a class date in october. i was just wondering is the trainig really that difficult? i cant see the military washing you out unless you are basically worthless.


She is pretty much worthless so it wasn't a suprise to me. I just know I'm going to study my ass off and be sure to do good during this school. There is no way I'm going to go back to my original job.

icetrey
06-30-2008, 07:30 PM
drblue917,

Although others here can tell you more first-hand what to expect better than I, I feel compelled to add my two cents. "i cant see the military washing you out unless you are basically worthless" makes me feel you may have the wrong attitude going into this. You're training to be the functional expert of an Aircraft. You should expect to devote long hours studying out of class to know your systems and procedures well, not to keep from getting washed out, other people's lives are going to rely on you and I'm sure the AF is going to ensure olny well-above-worthless people make it to flying schools . If you read through the pages of this thread you can see it's a high wash-out rate school...either for academics or other reasons. I'm sure some of those folks, their classmates, or instructors would not consider them "worthless".

I appologize if I'm sounding a bit grouchy, but I'm waiting for the release of FY09 quotas inorder to re-submit my application. I'm not applying because its just a cool job, but what I want to do with my career, both AF and after. I'm hoping your thread above is mis-leading to me, and you've investigated the career and your goals before applying.

drblue917
06-30-2008, 08:39 PM
well i have deff done some research before considering this career and i am aware that it will take some studying on my own time. i have read through this entire thread and i was just trying to clarify some stuff. i appreciate the quick response and insight.

TheMrs
07-01-2008, 04:19 AM
I'm interested in flying on a helo but I was told that females aren't permitted to be FE's on them. Didn't you mention before that your husband went through a course with a female who was going to be a UH-1N FE?

Yes, my husband was just TDY with a female x-training to be a FE on a UH-1N. Why wouldn't a female be allowed to be a FE on a helo I don't see any reason but I'm not in the AF so I wouldn't know..I've heard that about PJs and combat control though.

ArcticChilla
07-01-2008, 02:07 PM
...There is no way I'm going to go back to my original job.

A-Freakin-Men brotha...I told my leadership I want a picture of everyone here and this place so every morning I wake up and know what I have to go back to if I wash out....That's more motivation then I'll ever need.

dub13
07-02-2008, 02:48 AM
A-Freakin-Men brotha...I told my leadership I want a picture of everyone here and this place so every morning I wake up and know what I have to go back to if I wash out....That's more motivation then I'll ever need.

That's what I said every day while I was out there and I made it through. There was no way I was going to go back to my old maintenance job. Just gotta have the motivation to study and keep your head in the game and it will all work out. Also, I just got back to my old MX shop yesterday to inprocess from the crosstrain TDY and I am so glad I will be leaving here in less than a month!! I would've washed out I would've been so pissed at myself.

BigBaze
07-04-2008, 04:41 AM
I'm interested in flying on a helo but I was told that females aren't permitted to be FE's on them. Didn't you mention before that your husband went through a course with a female who was going to be a UH-1N FE?


Hmmm I don't know about that one...I am sure they would work with you if you really wanted that slot...I don't see why they wouldn't let a female be an eng on a UH1. On the topic of washing out...they will send you home if you fail 2 tests...! (that is anything below an 85%) we lost one guy from our class, he failed his second test and he was on a plane home that night. Don't worry..believe me when I say this : if you devote your time to studying a lot..you will be fine!!! The FE career field is all about studying, memorizing and being tested, so the school's theory is if you can't test well, you won't be successful if you become an FE because they are constantly being tested. If I can make it..you all can:) I just came back from a week in the mountains from SERE...got a lot of time with Hueys, we got to practice vectoring one in for rescue during the day and night...and then they stalked us while we were trying to evade...:> Rendiculous I am sure if you mention to the instructors at the aircrew school that you want helos I am sure they will work with you on getting a slot on helos if you go about it the right way and ask. Good luck to you..you are in for quite a ride whatever you get:>

BigBaze
07-04-2008, 04:44 AM
Yes, my husband was just TDY with a female x-training to be a FE on a UH-1N. Why wouldn't a female be allowed to be a FE on a helo I don't see any reason but I'm not in the AF so I wouldn't know..I've heard that about PJs and combat control though.


As far as I know the only career where women are not allowed to apply so to speak are special forces like CCT, PJ etc..

BigBaze
07-05-2008, 02:52 AM
Update to that....I talked to a couple of my friends who are Huey engineers, and went through BFE with me...and they said there is no such rule stating that females cannot be Huey FE's..in fact we know a female who is an HH60 eng. Ya know you can't spell female without FE?:> The one wanting to go to Hueys, you aren't coming from overseas are you?

Fenix1442
07-05-2008, 05:37 AM
I wanted to thank everyone providing great info on FE. Pretty much hit the books from the start and do no let your guard down with the material. How is TOLD taught? Just the basics or do the instructors take time if you are miss understanding them?

If I just put down HH-60 bases will my chances increase to get them? I'm class 5 now waiting for 6. I originally wanted to be on CV-22 but can't. Thanks for the help.

TheMrs
07-05-2008, 05:17 PM
You will learn c-130 TOLD in BFE then when you get to MIQ you'll learn your airframe specific. In BFE the instructors will work with you and make sure you learn the stuff. If you get helo the TOLD is way different so you'll learn it when you get there.

As for getting on 60s you just have to get lucky or know the assigments guy. Putting the bases on there will increase your chances on getting 60s but as of right now the classes are full though the end of the fiscal year. Good luck

Fenix1442
07-05-2008, 07:57 PM
So a class in Nov or Dec this year is possible since the fiscal year ends in Oct? Thanks

BigBaze
07-06-2008, 05:35 AM
I wanted to thank everyone providing great info on FE. Pretty much hit the books from the start and do no let your guard down with the material. How is TOLD taught? Just the basics or do the instructors take time if you are miss understanding them?

If I just put down HH-60 bases will my chances increase to get them? I'm class 5 now waiting for 6. I originally wanted to be on CV-22 but can't. Thanks for the help.

You could not be more right....hit the books!! That is all there is to it. Blocks 5-7 are fixed wing(C130), rotary wing and CV-22 TOLD...so get ready to study your ass off....if you put down HH60 you have a better chance because a lot of people put down fixed wing first....but don't quote me on that,,,it really depends on slots available....I am kinda jealous of the HH60 engineers because they get to fire the guns too...any way you look at it...and no matter what airframe you get..you'll be flying so that always is great..

Fenix1442
07-06-2008, 05:54 AM
Blaze, if you don't mind can you send me some practice TOLD problems. If this is going to be against the rules like testable material or test compromise then don't. I don't want to get into trouble or you either.

Some people are giving me the impression that TOLD and other math data is like Trig. Others I have heard it's only long division but need to remember where to put the decimal points. Any help would be appreciated, you can PM if you want and I will give you my mil e-mail if you want a more secure way of communication.

I'm a 2W1 or weapons troop so I know the gun system very well. That is why I want to be on HH-60's so much.

BigBaze
07-06-2008, 06:52 PM
Blaze, if you don't mind can you send me some practice TOLD problems. If this is going to be against the rules like testable material or test compromise then don't. I don't want to get into trouble or you either.

Some people are giving me the impression that TOLD and other math data is like Trig. Others I have heard it's only long division but need to remember where to put the decimal points. Any help would be appreciated, you can PM if you want and I will give you my mil e-mail if you want a more secure way of communication.

I'm a 2W1 or weapons troop so I know the gun system very well. That is why I want to be on HH-60's so much.


Yeah man I definitely can't do that..you'll be fine they will give you tons of practice when you get there! I wouldn't say it is like trig, just making sure you input the right numbers and follow the right lines on the chart...I am not very good at math and did fine.

dub13
07-07-2008, 08:13 PM
Some people are giving me the impression that TOLD and other math data is like Trig. Others I have heard it's only long division but need to remember where to put the decimal points. Any help would be appreciated, you can PM if you want and I will give you my mil e-mail if you want a more secure way of communication.

.

TOLD isnt anything like trig. All it is is running charts, going from one chart to another on some and then inputting it. The math stuff is all in Block 3 which is pretty tricky at times, and then a little in Block 9.

Also besides being test compromise for BigBaze giving you help on TOLD stuff but you cant really practice on it until you are actually there in the classroom with the books that the instructors give you. Good luck

rendiculous
07-07-2008, 11:09 PM
no Big Baze, I'm not returning from overseas. I'm at Scott AFB in Illinois.

Fenix1442
07-08-2008, 01:26 AM
That's cool, thanks for all the info in clearing things ups. I hate hearing things through the grape vine.

BigBaze
07-08-2008, 04:52 AM
no Big Baze, I'm not returning from overseas. I'm at Scott AFB in Illinois.


Cool...you should be fine getting Hueys...I don't think most people put them at the top of their dream sheet...you'll see a bunch of Huey's up here at SERE...in my last week here

ArcticChilla
07-08-2008, 07:15 PM
Cool...you should be fine getting Hueys...I don't think most people put them at the top of their dream sheet...you'll see a bunch of Huey's up here at SERE...in my last week here

Do you know what purpose the Hueys serve at Fairchild? I want to gun for Huey's but I want out of Montana! I know if I put it down they'll drop me right back here...(my luck). Wouldn't be bad with a different job just looking to get out a do a bit more. Just wondering what mission they serve over there. Thanks!

TheMrs
07-09-2008, 02:16 AM
Do you know what purpose the Hueys serve at Fairchild? I want to gun for Huey's but I want out of Montana! I know if I put it down they'll drop me right back here...(my luck). Wouldn't be bad with a different job just looking to get out a do a bit more. Just wondering what mission they serve over there. Thanks!

They support the survival school.

Fenix1442
07-09-2008, 09:49 PM
I just got my class dates. Whoo hoo!

What kind of facilities do they have for retrainees to live at? Also do they have internet access so I can stay in touch with my family besides calling them? Any and all info would be apprciated, you can PM for my mil e-mail if you don't want to give this information out in public for Opsec reasons.

Thanks once again for the info.

BigBaze
07-10-2008, 02:26 AM
I just got my class dates. Whoo hoo!

What kind of facilities do they have for retrainees to live at? Also do they have internet access so I can stay in touch with my family besides calling them? Any and all info would be apprciated, you can PM for my mil e-mail if you don't want to give this information out in public for Opsec reasons.

Thanks once again for the info.


You'll probably be at the Gateway Inn on base...and you should have your own room with a connecting bathroom with the other room..my room had internet you just needed your own internet cable. You should go ahead and reserve one way ahead of time. They are really nice...if you are driving I would recommend bring your own comforter etc. Congrats on getting class dates...I am almost done with SERE up here...

Fenix1442
07-10-2008, 05:25 AM
If at the Gateway Inn, will I have to pay out of pocket or will it be covered by the gov? I might have to get a GTC huh?

Also, do you get family separation pay during all classes that you are away if married?

I'm going to buy another car so I can have on while at EAUC.

drblue917
07-10-2008, 05:44 PM
i dont personally know if you will get sep pay but i dont see why you wouldnt. i have also read wheresomeone took there wife with them.

i have a couple questions of my own. who will issue the required equipment for SERE i looked at the list and i dont have all that stuff. also i have gotten a couple retraining rips and they have a return no later then date. the last one i was given i have to get signed and rerouted in 2 days im not sure i will have it back in time. will they cancel my class/training?

Fenix1442
07-10-2008, 07:01 PM
My wife and son are going to be staying back at another base while I train, would be cool to have them with me but wouldn't be fair for them or me. Hard to concentrate on school and tests in a small room with a 2 year old wanting to play all the time,LOL.

How much is the Gateway Inn per day? Maybe I can get a slum of a room and bank on the per diem? Also, doesn't my orders tell me where I am on/off base anyways when they are cut? I doubt they will let me pick since the AF needs to save money.

Seems that my home station has a few FE's in retraining with like 8 that I know of personally. If you have your two basic classes done to get your 3 level you should get your gear when you go back to your base and then out to SERE.

A few guys had to go back to our base and wait a bit. They went over to the Ops side and got their suits, gear, and other neat toys. Of course everyone is different since you can go straight to SERE after graduating the two basic courses.

I only have the class dates for the two basic courses. No SERE, water survival, or any other thing yet but that can change before, during, or after my two basic classes.

Any routing paper I would have done myself personally. That is how I got my ETP and AQE rips done. I doubt they would cancel your training since you are qualified to attend the class plus you are taking a training slot up too. They might bump you back to a later class date at the worst. This is all speculation on my side since I don't know or pretend to know the inner working of retraining and FE.

Oh yea, grats on getting your 3 level and good luck on finishing your SERE BigBaze.

dub13
07-10-2008, 07:48 PM
If at the Gateway Inn, will I have to pay out of pocket or will it be covered by the gov? I might have to get a GTC huh?

Also, do you get family separation pay during all classes that you are away if married?

I'm going to buy another car so I can have on while at EAUC.


You should get a GTC!! You don't want to pay for that out of pocket especially with a wife and kid around. Then once you are done, you are going to need to get a plane ticket up to Fairchild and then down to Pensacola. I got my plane tickets for that while I was at Lackland and I used my GTC all the way. That's what it's there for.

Also yes you will get family separation when you get back. Once you go into Finance grab one of the forms from them and fill it out and it will go up with your final voucher.

Also try and stay over at Kelly Inn off of Lackland. It's across the flightline. I got to stay over there because I lucked out and the Gateway Inn had no more openings. I got $54 a day times however many training days we have there. I got my voucher payed off today and the perdiem I made was reeeaallly NICE!!!

But most importantly get a GTC!! You'll be glad you did unless you have thousands of dollars you can spare till you get back.

BigBaze
07-11-2008, 12:40 PM
i dont personally know if you will get sep pay but i dont see why you wouldnt. i have also read wheresomeone took there wife with them.

i have a couple questions of my own. who will issue the required equipment for SERE i looked at the list and i dont have all that stuff. also i have gotten a couple retraining rips and they have a return no later then date. the last one i was given i have to get signed and rerouted in 2 days im not sure i will have it back in time. will they cancel my class/training?

Your unit should provide the equipment for SERE..but the school provides all the stuff you need for the field like backpack, sleeping bag etc...the main thing I brought was plenty of socks and leather gloves..they have a good military clothing store up here if you need anything extra

BigBaze
07-11-2008, 12:43 PM
My wife and son are going to be staying back at another base while I train, would be cool to have them with me but wouldn't be fair for them or me. Hard to concentrate on school and tests in a small room with a 2 year old wanting to play all the time,LOL.

How much is the Gateway Inn per day? Maybe I can get a slum of a room and bank on the per diem? Also, doesn't my orders tell me where I am on/off base anyways when they are cut? I doubt they will let me pick since the AF needs to save money.

Seems that my home station has a few FE's in retraining with like 8 that I know of personally. If you have your two basic classes done to get your 3 level you should get your gear when you go back to your base and then out to SERE.

A few guys had to go back to our base and wait a bit. They went over to the Ops side and got their suits, gear, and other neat toys. Of course everyone is different since you can go straight to SERE after graduating the two basic courses.

I only have the class dates for the two basic courses. No SERE, water survival, or any other thing yet but that can change before, during, or after my two basic classes.

Any routing paper I would have done myself personally. That is how I got my ETP and AQE rips done. I doubt they would cancel your training since you are qualified to attend the class plus you are taking a training slot up too. They might bump you back to a later class date at the worst. This is all speculation on my side since I don't know or pretend to know the inner working of retraining and FE.

Oh yea, grats on getting your 3 level and good luck on finishing your SERE BigBaze.


Thanks...I have the last day of SERE today and water survival at Pensacola next week...the cost of the Gateway Inn is like $25 a day and if they don't have room there they will put you at Kelly like Dub said....and only if those are full then they will let you stay off base...but make sure to get a non availability letter from the Inn otherwise you would not get reimbursed for the off base hotel!!

BigBaze
07-15-2008, 11:04 PM
Just seeing how you guys are doing in your training..I finished SERE and I am at Pensacola for water survival training...not bad at all...!

Orrion76
07-16-2008, 12:56 AM
In BLK I of BFE right now to blk test tomorrow. YAY oh so much fun any retraining peps from ACFT MX are going to be bored in EAUC and this blk.

AfricanSnowOwl
07-16-2008, 01:57 AM
I'm headed to Lackland tomorrow, and start class on Friday.

BigBaze
07-17-2008, 07:46 PM
I'm headed to Lackland tomorrow, and start class on Friday.


Nice, good luck! I just finished water parachuting at Pensacola today which is FUN!..so no more TDY for me until the flying school and I don't have a date for that yet...about 3 months of TDY finally done....

Orrion76
07-19-2008, 01:24 AM
YaY block III started. Cruching numbers and more numbers.......

BigBaze
07-20-2008, 03:33 PM
YaY block III started. Cruching numbers and more numbers.......

don't get number overload:>

rendiculous
07-22-2008, 01:05 PM
So, since I'm coming from a non-maintenance, non-aircraft oriented career field, I'm assuming that I'm going to be a bit behind the learning curve. Are there any materials that I can get my hands on here before I go down to Lackland that will help me with the school? I'm not worried about passing, I'm hard headed enough that I know I will be fine, but I would like to be a little more than fine.

Orrion76
07-24-2008, 01:48 AM
Rend, not much you can do to prepair for the class stuff. They will tell you when you get there that your class is your crew, that is more than true and use them. The biggest part of what you will be learning new is the acft systems that most ACFT MX peps know a little bit more about. Good luck.

AfricanSnowOwl
07-24-2008, 03:01 AM
Theres 2 people in my class including me, that are not from a maintenance background, and we're doing fine. All you have to do is pay attention, ask questions, and take good notes.

BigBaze
07-24-2008, 10:39 AM
Theres 2 people in my class including me, that are not from a maintenance background, and we're doing fine. All you have to do is pay attention, ask questions, and take good notes.


we had a guy who was a CBRNE guy and not the brightest light in the room and did ok, only had one test failure. Like some of you are finding out, you keep studying and work together and it will go well. The instructors are not going to let you test if they feel you are not ready or not comprehending the subjects. I should find out next month when my flying school is

rendiculous
07-24-2008, 06:05 PM
so while you're waiting for your flight school you have to go back to your old shop? That's what I've heard and it seems very counterproductive. I make prosthetic teeth for a living right now. I cannot imagine going to school and survival training and then coming back here and doing my old job again. Can somebody clear me up on this?

Kegler
07-25-2008, 12:20 AM
so while you're waiting for your flight school you have to go back to your old shop? That's what I've heard and it seems very counterproductive. I make prosthetic teeth for a living right now. I cannot imagine going to school and survival training and then coming back here and doing my old job again. Can somebody clear me up on this?

All Aircrew assignments are based on training availablity PFT (Programmed flight Training) These quotas are constrained by the capability of numbers of aircraft, instructors etc. Look at all the classes ahead of you from Lackland. If the next training quota for the specific aircraft you are being assigned to is a few months out...what do I do with you. Let you sit in my training squadron taking up space or utilize you in something you already know. Usually it is not an extremely long time between them but we have many training units for many weapons systems. All of our class dates cannot and do not match up with every graduate from the entry schools. While it might not make sense to you now....it will. Aircrew assignments are driven by training availability for the weapon systems. Alos, the FY09 PFT seats are just now starting to drop and put into the system....orders will start flowing for those waiting. Hope this helps

BigBaze
07-25-2008, 12:57 AM
so while you're waiting for your flight school you have to go back to your old shop? That's what I've heard and it seems very counterproductive. I make prosthetic teeth for a living right now. I cannot imagine going to school and survival training and then coming back here and doing my old job again. Can somebody clear me up on this?


I am back at my old shop working the flightline, and I got my KC10 flight school date today! I have to PCS to McGuire by Aug 31 so I can't wait. I graduated BFE on June 10 so it was just a couple months later.

AfricanSnowOwl
07-25-2008, 01:14 AM
I am back at my old shop working the flightline, and I got my KC10 flight school date today! I have to PCS to McGuire by Aug 31 so I can't wait. I graduated BFE on June 10 so it was just a couple months later.


Wow, that wasn't that long of a wait. KC-10 is the airframe I'm hoping for. Does it list the weapons school date on vMPF?, or did you get orders already?

BigBaze
07-25-2008, 01:52 AM
Wow, that wasn't that long of a wait. KC-10 is the airframe I'm hoping for. Does it list the weapons school date on vMPF?, or did you get orders already?


Well I got an email at work saying I got an assignment and I just have to take care of the things listed on vMPF and then the orders are created. The actual assignment with the school date came on my work email.

dub13
07-25-2008, 05:49 AM
Wow, that wasn't that long of a wait. KC-10 is the airframe I'm hoping for. Does it list the weapons school date on vMPF?, or did you get orders already?

IT might be on there somewhere but I first saw mine on: AMS->Personal Informations->Academic Info->and hit GO. If the class is loaded it will be at the bottom of the page under Projected Training with a start date and an end date

BigBaze
07-25-2008, 08:11 PM
IT might be on there somewhere but I first saw mine on: AMS->Personal Informations->Academic Info->and hit GO. If the class is loaded it will be at the bottom of the page under Projected Training with a start date and an end date

Mine popped up on vMPF, go to the right of the screen and click on "Initial Assignment Briefing"

dub13
07-26-2008, 07:51 AM
I am back at my old shop working the flightline, and I got my KC10 flight school date today! I have to PCS to McGuire by Aug 31 so I can't wait. .


How much of a wait do you have for your class date to start? I PCS to my gaining base on the 29th, only a few days away and have a class start date of 29 SEpt. So a two month wait over there. Ready to get the ball rolling again.. getting anxious

BigBaze
07-26-2008, 12:15 PM
How much of a wait do you have for your class date to start? I PCS to my gaining base on the 29th, only a few days away and have a class start date of 29 SEpt. So a two month wait over there. Ready to get the ball rolling again.. getting anxious


I think the class starts on Sept 12th..and I can't wait!

wingman0330
07-28-2008, 11:10 AM
I just recently got approved for retraining into FE and am leaving for tech school in nov. I have a couple of questions for you guys. When will I find out what airframe I will be on? What do I need to take with me to the schools in Texas? Any info will help nobody at my current base can answer any questions I have thanks

BigBaze
07-28-2008, 12:34 PM
I just recently got approved for retraining into FE and am leaving for tech school in nov. I have a couple of questions for you guys. When will I find out what airframe I will be on? What do I need to take with me to the schools in Texas? Any info will help nobody at my current base can answer any questions I have thanks


You will fill out your dream sheet during the Enlisted Aircrew Undergraduate Course, and you will find out your assignment during Block 3 or 4 of BFE. As far as what you need to bring to Lackland, make sure you bring a copy of your form 1042 (flight physical)! You will not be able to go through the altitude chamber without it. They say bring medical records but we didn't need them. if you have any questions I would call the school and ask as well. Just show up ready to learn and study, because as the guys who have gone through already and those who are there now can attest, the learning is fast and furious. You will wear blues on Fridays and service dress for graduation, so make sure they are in order, they will do an inspection when you get there:> Good luck, and congrats on being accepted!

rendiculous
07-28-2008, 12:35 PM
Is your class date 7 Nov.? That's when I'm going down there too. We will find out which airframe we will be on and at what base around block 3 of the BFE course so I'm thinkin mid - late december time frame.

wingman0330
07-28-2008, 05:48 PM
Is your class date 7 Nov.? That's when I'm going down there too. We will find out which airframe we will be on and at what base around block 3 of the BFE course so I'm thinkin mid - late december time frame.

My first class date is Nov 28th so we should still be down there about the same time just not in the same class.

AfricanSnowOwl
07-28-2008, 08:46 PM
Also make sure you have a GTC before you come out here. Theres a very good chance you'll end up downtown in a fancy hotel where everything can be very expensive.

dub13
07-29-2008, 04:22 AM
I just recently got approved for retraining into FE and am leaving for tech school in nov. I have a couple of questions for you guys. When will I find out what airframe I will be on? What do I need to take with me to the schools in Texas? Any info will help nobody at my current base can answer any questions I have thanks

Pretty much once you get your training rip and get your class course number you can go to the ETCA website and it will list everything you need for every course you attend while TDY. From AFC to BFE, and SERE to Water Survival. I printed each course I was attending and looked through it. That will answer all your questions right there. Also with the SERE stuff you can go to your resource advisor and get some stuff for it. Like boots, knife, gloves, or cold weather gear for field training if it's cold while you go through. It's all on there It will probably take you a few minutes to go through it all but it is a good start

BigBaze
07-29-2008, 07:23 AM
Pretty much once you get your training rip and get your class course number you can go to the ETCA website and it will list everything you need for every course you attend while TDY. From AFC to BFE, and SERE to Water Survival. I printed each course I was attending and looked through it. That will answer all your questions right there. Also with the SERE stuff you can go to your resource advisor and get some stuff for it. Like boots, knife, gloves, or cold weather gear for field training if it's cold while you go through. It's all on there It will probably take you a few minutes to go through it all but it is a good start


When you type the survival school code (SV80A , SV80B, SV86A etc) into the ETCA website, make sure you type it in as S-V80-A or S-V80-B or it will not show up, there are a lot of things you need to bring to SERE as far as medical documents etc

BigBaze
08-02-2008, 08:34 AM
I am interested to see how you guys and gals in EAUC and BFE are doing? Hit me up..

AfricanSnowOwl
08-02-2008, 06:02 PM
Bout to graduate block III ACF on wednesday.

BigBaze
08-04-2008, 10:41 PM
Bout to graduate block III ACF on wednesday.


Nice. TMO is packing my stuff next week and when my flight suits come in I should be heading up to McGuire for my KC10 flight school which starts Sept 12

wingman0330
08-05-2008, 12:03 AM
you will like KC-10's. My boss was a flying crew cheif on them for 15 years and he loved it. Good luck

drblue917
08-08-2008, 06:15 AM
Well I just got the rest of my class loaded the other day for water survival, SERE and parachute training. Now I just need to decide how to travel. I’m definitely going to be flying to the water training but for the SERE I’m thinking about driving since I’m somewhat in the neighborhood. I was wondering from those of you that have already made the journey what your experiences were like getting from the airport to the base. Also when planning airline ticket would it be best to report on the day the ETCA information says NLT or maybe a day or two early? I’m just curious so I can make the best decision.

BigBaze
08-08-2008, 09:47 AM
Well I just got the rest of my class loaded the other day for water survival, SERE and parachute training. Now I just need to decide how to travel. I’m definitely going to be flying to the water training but for the SERE I’m thinking about driving since I’m somewhat in the neighborhood. I was wondering from those of you that have already made the journey what your experiences were like getting from the airport to the base. Also when planning airline ticket would it be best to report on the day the ETCA information says NLT or maybe a day or two early? I’m just curious so I can make the best decision.

Getting from the Spokane airport to Fairchild is a breeze, go down to baggage claim and there are shuttles already waiting for you, I would take Stars and Stripes shuttles, they are the best deal. The cost to the base is $30, but if you go ahead and pay him $80 ($60 of that for the trip there and back) it works out the best. The extra $20 is for unlimited use of the shuttle during your time there. You get a card and just show it to the driver whenever you want to go downtown etc, and your ride is free. If you do not get that deal it costs you about $10 if you want to go somewhere. The survival school is about 5 miles from the main base, and 20-30 minutes from downtown. If you drive there though that is your best bet! I drove to Pensacola because I live right next to it, but the airport is like 10-15 minutes from the base. You only need to report to the schools the day prior to class start. The ETCA should give you class start dates for both of those classes, so just show up the day before. I would check with whoever cuts your orders though because class dates can change. Best of luck to you..

KuJoe
08-08-2008, 12:27 PM
Wow. I was happy to apply for FE I was told it is awesome. But after hearing some stuff here in the forums I'm having second thoughts. Maybe this whole FE thing isn't such a great Idea. Maybe staying Fuel cell is a better idea???? Anyway I'm freaked out now ladies and gents! What do you do if you get approved and no longer wish to partake in said AFSC (should it come down to me not wanting to FE anymore)

Your advice is greatly appreciated!!

Gunner7
08-08-2008, 01:18 PM
If you are having second thoughts try to figure out if it is because of a fact or what you perceive to be a fact. While the course is not "easy" the reason you were approved to retrain is your moral, mental, and physical qualifications indicate you will succeed in the program. If it is a concern about the unknown and what the job entails pick up the phone a call a flying squadron and speak with an FE who is of a similar rank. Ask questions and find out for sure if you want to continue. Most of the FE's I chat with are very happy to have made the switch.

BigBaze
08-08-2008, 10:39 PM
If you are having second thoughts try to figure out if it is because of a fact or what you perceive to be a fact. While the course is not "easy" the reason you were approved to retrain is your moral, mental, and physical qualifications indicate you will succeed in the program. If it is a concern about the unknown and what the job entails pick up the phone a call a flying squadron and speak with an FE who is of a similar rank. Ask questions and find out for sure if you want to continue. Most of the FE's I chat with are very happy to have made the switch.

As I am finding out , if you ask any FE they are more then happy to talk about experiences and what the job entails. Don't let the "fear of the unknown"keep you from going after the job. It is tough training but the rewards are awesome. It is a good idea to get an idea of what an FE's job entails before you apply, but what I can tell you is the training I got at Lackland was awesome, and even I got through it:>

Lab tech
08-09-2008, 08:02 PM
I'm in the same process of applying for CAREERS retraining into Flight Engineer. I'm at the point now where all I have to do is hit "submit". I've got my Class III done, ETP endorsed, and everything else uploaded into my retraining package.

I'm really looking forward to a very unique job experience and hoping to finding it very rewarding. Currently I'm a 4T051 Medical Lab tech and to me this job seems too civilian. Maybe I'm just young and dumb but i want to get out and see the world for a few years, if not more. That being said, I've gathered from all the posts that the Flight Engineer job is very demanding and I'm worrying if I'll be in the same "go out and explore mindset" 4 years from now.

My concern is this, If i do go into Flight Engineer, what are the chances of maybe retraining into another AFSC, if after 4 years I decide it's not for me? I know retraining is based "Needs of the AF", but on the other hand the Flight Engineer position has been slowing going away. I've checked the CCS list, and Flight engineer isn't even on it as opposed to previous years. Does anyone know of someone that's successfully retrained out of FE? I'd really hate the feeling of having to leave the AF if I decide me and FE have to split ways.

AfricanSnowOwl
08-09-2008, 08:16 PM
You rarely ever see someone cross-train out of an aircrew AFSC. Everyone ends up loving their job too much.

dub13
08-10-2008, 02:49 PM
Usually the only guys I saw retrain out of aircrew jobs where some of the instructors in BFE that retrained into Flight Engineer. There was also a guy in my class that was a 1A4 before retraining. I've never heard of one of those guys knowing someone who got out of the 1A1 field.