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imported_ANALYST
12-03-2009, 05:54 PM
Odd...but oh well at least we are not waiting on the edge of our sets now. :)

Yes very odd, there is another guy who was approved on the 5th of Nov and has the same dates as you. Yeah, I am happy non the less. It seems like the people who have been waiting the longest have later dates.

Either ALS or a Waiver, they are always backed up here.

Golther
12-03-2009, 06:27 PM
Yes very odd, there is another guy who was approved on the 5th of Nov and has the same dates as you. Yeah, I am happy non the less. It seems like the people who have been waiting the longest have later dates.

Either ALS or a Waiver, they are always backed up here.

Our dates cross at least. Ill be in the last half of BFE when your class starts.

Damastas
12-04-2009, 12:05 AM
I just finished with my entire TDY and stayed at Kelly Inn for the trip. After going to file my voucher, finance is telling me that I am not authorized the full per diem rate, even though Kelly didn't have a chow hall. My orders say gov't meals are available and directed, so they will only give me the $14 rate. I showed them http://www.defensetravel.dod.mil/perdiem/afman34-255-c.pdf that said that Kelly's chow hall was closed, but they didn't care. Is there anything else in writing that says this, or that I can do, or am I really not entitled to the full per diem cost?

alcorh
12-04-2009, 12:09 AM
I just finished with my entire TDY and stayed at Kelly Inn for the trip. After going to file my voucher, finance is telling me that I am not authorized the full per diem rate, even though Kelly didn't have a chow hall. My orders say gov't meals are available and directed, so they will only give me the $14 rate. I showed them http://www.defensetravel.dod.mil/perdiem/afman34-255-c.pdf that said that Kelly's chow hall was closed, but they didn't care. Is there anything else in writing that says this, or that I can do, or am I really not entitled to the full per diem cost?

Did you get the letter from the Kelly front dest stating that there isnt any chow halls and you are entiltled for full per-diem?

Damastas
12-04-2009, 12:15 AM
Did you get the letter from the Kelly front dest stating that there isnt any chow halls and you are entiltled for full per-diem?

The only "letter" I got from Kelly was this one, and they said it wasn't good enough: http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/4760/kellyq.jpg

Was there an MFR type one with an AF letterhead and everything on it?

Spunjah413
12-04-2009, 09:53 AM
Im not sure what to say. If they are not hearing it then you will just need to speak to someone higher, and start riding up the chain. In the actual orders it doesn't specifically say where you have to stay. I would just bring up the point that you were talking to other Engineer students and they said to book at Kelly Inn right off the get go, especially since there is no real guidance on the TDY and Cross Training in general (Which is why this thread is obviously here). You just need to stand your ground and fight for it, don't just be a bitch and suck it up. Alot of us have gotten full per-diem when staying at Kelly, and you should too.

jdogg2
12-04-2009, 08:07 PM
Yeah, I got my dates too and they are later than yours. Aircrew Fundies 02 Apr and BFE 22 Apr. Man I will sew on Staff while I am at BFE. Good luck to everyone.

Im glad you finally got your dates.. Good luck

imported_ANALYST
12-04-2009, 10:25 PM
Im glad you finally got your dates.. Good luck

Yeah man, I am glad I got them too. Be sure to pass some advice to those that have not gone through.

For all others that have been approved. Once you reach the 6 week point, start checking on your package. There are avenues out there beyond AFPC. You just have to search them out or ask for help.

qhroper
12-05-2009, 08:09 PM
So you are telling me that if I get assigned to HH-60 as a FE that I am not deployable until I get an "instructor" upgrade? How long does that take and why do you need it? That sucks I have to wait longer until I deploy. Don't get me wrong I love my wife and son like no tommorrow but I want to do my part and have a better job satisfaction from helping people directly than indirectly. Loading bombs and watching bad guys blow up on CCTV from intel breifs get old after a while.

HH-60 is going to be my first choice with C-130 gunships as my second pick.

I would like to know as much as possible about HH-60 and C-130 FE's duties and such from those who have worked on those airframes.

I recently retrained into HH-60 FE. You are deployable as soon as you finish your MQT at your new base. which can be accomplished in as little as 2 flights. I deployed appx. 6 months after graduating from kirtland, (due to scheduling). You don't have to be an instructor to deploy.

Jot
12-06-2009, 04:22 AM
You still go to Little Rock for sims and academics. You'll do FMQ academics and sims and the FIQ flying portion in the sims (its called RFIQ for reduced flying initial qual). Then you either go to the 62nd at Little Rock for flying training or if your unit requested it to Nashville.

I'm at the 105 FTU right now. My main instructor spent ten years at Dobbins as an instructor and he moved to Nashville. I don't think he would have left his expensive house, that he can't sell, if Dobbins was still the FTU. Then again stranger things have happened, but I'll ask him tomorrow. I can tell you that no one has gone to FTU at Dobbins in a year and that Nashville has had five students out of the last for classes from Little Rock. There is a guard guy with me right now.

Major Gaulin, the student squadron commander at Little Rock, was the guy who told me that there are two course codes now and that he can no longer send students to Nashville because their units have to request it.

You might end up at Dobbins, but it wasn't even an option for me and my unit definitely would have rather sent me there instead of dealing with E model stuff.

Got my dates. Fundies starts Jan 22. Got Dobbins, too.

imported_ANALYST
12-06-2009, 11:31 PM
Got my dates. Fundies starts Jan 22. Got Dobbins, too.

Good stuff man, study hard and dont play too hard on your free time. Atlanta is just a little bit away.

c5engineer
12-07-2009, 12:27 AM
Got my dates. Fundies starts Jan 22. Got Dobbins, too.

That's awesome. You won't have to put up with learning any E model stuff. It wasn't bad at all, but now you won't have differences and you can get your head wrapped around one set of numbers and equipment. I'm glad I never flew the E and then transitioned to the H2. We had an engineer go to Dobbins and she loved it. Good luck.

CBRrider
12-07-2009, 02:46 AM
I Also Finally Got My Dates. I Start Feb 26, My 1sgt Called Afpc And They Told Him It Was Taking A Long Time Because They Were Rewriting The Classes.

xboomer
12-07-2009, 12:35 PM
I s anyone going to C-5 FIQ after BFE? If so what are you being told for the wait between classes?

CB Rider, is the Feb 26 start date for fundies or BFE? I have been given a Feb 26th start date for BFE. However I have been given dates back in July, October and November so really do not believe anything anymore.

imported_ANALYST
12-07-2009, 01:10 PM
I Also Finally Got My Dates. I Start Feb 26, My 1sgt Called Afpc And They Told Him It Was Taking A Long Time Because They Were Rewriting The Classes.

Wow, I still cant figure out why I am the only one with Apr dates. There are a few screw ups that have taken place with this process.

Good luck and I am glad the wait is over.

Golther
12-07-2009, 01:39 PM
Wow, I still cant figure out why I am the only one with Apr dates. There are a few screw ups that have taken place with this process.

Good luck and I am glad the wait is over.

I think it's me an CBRider that have fundies on the 26th and you may be in the class just prior to us xboomer.

StevenW135
12-07-2009, 03:55 PM
No dates still. But I called and I was told I had dates they just were not posted yet. Well see.

JENNYTHING
12-07-2009, 07:23 PM
I s anyone going to C-5 FIQ after BFE? If so what are you being told for the wait between classes?

CB Rider, is the Feb 26 start date for fundies or BFE? I have been given a Feb 26th start date for BFE. However I have been given dates back in July, October and November so really do not believe anything anymore.


Graduated BFE 25 Nov and start C-5 IQT on 1 April... Can't wait!

xboomer
12-07-2009, 08:55 PM
I think it's me an CBRider that have fundies on the 26th and you may be in the class just prior to us xboomer.

Thanks, Hope to see you around the flying Sq.

xboomer
12-07-2009, 09:03 PM
Graduated BFE 25 Nov and start C-5 IQT on 1 April... Can't wait!

I have been told that it could be up to a 6 month wait from the end of BFE and the beginning of IQT so I guess they were right. Just curious if you are Reserves or Active duty ? If you are Reserves how are they handling the break in between classes?

Thanks

xCHICOx
12-07-2009, 09:53 PM
Graduated BFE 25 Nov and start C-5 IQT on 1 April... Can't wait!

That's a heck of a wait... I start fundies 30 Jul. C-5 or CV-22 are topping my choices so far but I will be more than happy whatever I get.

xboomer
12-07-2009, 10:02 PM
That's a heck of a wait... I start fundies 30 Jul. C-5 or CV-22 are topping my choices so far but I will be more than happy whatever I get.

Fundies are being scheduled all the way out to July 2010 !!!! ?????????????

akruse
12-07-2009, 10:17 PM
Fundies are being scheduled all the way out to July 2010 !!!! ?????????????

I had a June 2010 fundies date back in august.

xboomer
12-07-2009, 10:28 PM
I had a June 2010 fundies date back in august.

You must have great patience

JENNYTHING
12-07-2009, 10:38 PM
I have been told that it could be up to a 6 month wait from the end of BFE and the beginning of IQT so I guess they were right. Just curious if you are Reserves or Active duty ? If you are Reserves how are they handling the break in between classes?

Thanks

I'm active so I cant help you with a response to how things are done on the Reserves side of the house. For now I'm just sitting around doing bs work at my old squadron :(

xboomer
12-08-2009, 12:40 AM
I have a question for Reserve Flight Engineers: If you had a break in between BFE and IQT what did your unit do? Did they keep you on orders or did you have to return to your civilian employer (if you were employed) ?

c5engineer
12-08-2009, 04:55 AM
I have a question for Reserve Flight Engineers: If you had a break in between BFE and IQT what did your unit do? Did they keep you on orders or did you have to return to your civilian employer (if you were employed) ?

They are not going to keep you on orders unless the dates are close. I went to the chamber in October and as soon as I got home I got a call from the sqdn asking if I could go to BFE ASAP. I went on orders for a year and a half and they told me they'd recut them if IQT was to far out. I ended up finishing BFE in December just before Christmas and had a IQT date of 11 January. Back then most of us in the reserves were getting classes within a month of each other.

After I became an instructor I had several students who got absolutely screwed by AD because they had to go to "fundies" and BFE and they weren't going back to back. Then IQT was taking over six months. We had a guy wait for a year before he got a date. No physical, no special circumstances other than it just happened to be a screwed up time.

Money in the reserves is tight. The school tour isn't their money so they aren't going to put you on and let you sit around because they have to justify it. In the 5 world you take a year and a half to upgrade. In the 130 world you get six months so the orders are a little easier.

Where are you going to be a 5 engineer?

Golther
12-08-2009, 05:02 AM
I was curious on how skill levels are awarded for FE. Do you get your 3 level when you finish BFE and 5 after you IQT? I'm from maintenance so to me when you get your 7 level you get your X's. Is there any special "power" other than your star on your badge for FE's or any other career field for that matter?

fallenight
12-08-2009, 11:36 AM
well my commander sign off my package and its went to AFPC they said i was good except i didnt need the ETP i submited anymore but i did need one for getting out of a balanced career feild. So got that signed and now it is at the Functional mangers i guess here hopin it dose not take forever.

Gunner7
12-08-2009, 01:34 PM
Thanks for the response.

This is getting to be totally ridiculous. How is someone suppose to take care of their family with this type of BS going on. I have been working on this process for over 6 months and I am ready to pull the D ring. After being out of the service for 9 years I can see the Air Force has gone to crap. The only possible good thing that may come of this is a waiver to do IQ at home station. And I will believe that when I see it since everything has been a lie so far.

What is going on with your application? Is there a single point of failure or multiple?

xboomer
12-08-2009, 01:51 PM
What is going on with your application? Is there a single point of failure or multiple?

To start it was 13 weeks to get my flight physical approved because it sat on someones desk, now it has been over 10 weeks for my security clearance and nothing yet. When I interviewed for the position I was told that I would be placed on Active Duty for two years to do my training. Now I am being told by the unit training NCO that I will go to BFE, after BFE was complete I would then come off of orders until I go to IQT, which could be as long as 6 months or more. Not to sound like a whinny *icth but when I first approached the unit about this back in March I was told that there was a school date open for me in July. It's December and still I sit here, unemployed being told to stay patient.

Gunner7
12-08-2009, 02:32 PM
To start it was 13 weeks to get my flight physical approved because it sat on someones desk, now it has been over 10 weeks for my security clearance and nothing yet. When I interviewed for the position I was told that I would be placed on Active Duty for two years to do my training. Now I am being told by the unit training NCO that I will go to BFE, after BFE was complete I would then come off of orders until I go to IQT, which could be as long as 6 months or more. Not to sound like a whinny *icth but when I first approached the unit about this back in March I was told that there was a school date open for me in July. It's December and still I sit here, unemployed being told to stay patient.

I am not too familiar with the Guard/Reserve retraining process but what security clearance do you need? The FE position is secret not TS.

xboomer
12-08-2009, 02:46 PM
A security clearance is only good for two years if it is inactive. I was out longer than two years.

xCHICOx
12-08-2009, 03:01 PM
Fundies are being scheduled all the way out to July 2010 !!!! ?????????????

Yea, I have to satisfy my time on station requirements first. The way I see, well worth the wait.

imported_TJC78
12-08-2009, 03:25 PM
I was curious on how skill levels are awarded for FE. Do you get your 3 level when you finish BFE and 5 after you IQT? I'm from maintenance so to me when you get your 7 level you get your X's. Is there any special "power" other than your star on your badge for FE's or any other career field for that matter?

Google search FTW.

http://www.af.mil/shared/media/epubs/CFETP1A1X1.pdf

EKss
12-08-2009, 04:22 PM
Hello All
I have been following this thread for some time now and finally joined up.
I to also got my class dates and they are the same as analyst, I cant wait to get out sheet metal and I am hoping to get on the CV-22 o HH-60.

EK

imported_ANALYST
12-08-2009, 05:56 PM
Hello All
I have been following this thread for some time now and finally joined up.
I to also got my class dates and they are the same as analyst, I cant wait to get out sheet metal and I am hoping to get on the CV-22 o HH-60.

EK

Sheet Metal huh, well good thing you are getting away from it or you would probably be going to the wonderful world of LO. What base are you from? When did you get approved?

c5engineer
12-08-2009, 06:13 PM
I was curious on how skill levels are awarded for FE. Do you get your 3 level when you finish BFE and 5 after you IQT? I'm from maintenance so to me when you get your 7 level you get your X's. Is there any special "power" other than your star on your badge for FE's or any other career field for that matter?

skill level means nothing in the FE world other than for promotion to NCO initially. I don't even know how long it takes to go from 3-5 and 5-7 anymore. I got my checkride and went out on my own doing my job as a 3 level. No one looking over my shoulder or checking my work. I did the CDC's and got a 5 level and then one day I was a seven level based on time. Unlike other enlisted fields the aircrew "badge" is not tied to a skill level. You receive your star at seven years and your wreath at 15. My wreath says something that a maintenance badge star/wreath doesn't say. I have a certain number of months of actual flying in addition to being in 15 years and I have a substantial amount of hours. Of course I've seen lots of toilet bowled (wreathed) FE's who couldn't find their way out of a restroom so I always wonder if someone is looking at my wings thinking the same thought. You live and die by your form 8, 1042 and 702. Those pay you and let you keep flying so you can rest easy about skill levels. The only level you want out of your checkride is Q1 and you want to stay that way if you can.

c5engineer
12-08-2009, 06:28 PM
Thanks for the response.

This is getting to be totally ridiculous. How is someone suppose to take care of their family with this type of BS going on. I have been working on this process for over 6 months and I am ready to pull the D ring. After being out of the service for 9 years I can see the Air Force has gone to crap. The only possible good thing that may come of this is a waiver to do IQ at home station. And I will believe that when I see it since everything has been a lie so far.

Sorry that your having a rough time xboomer, but it's not the reserves or the AF's fault. I've been there and I've seen others get it worse than you. There is a guy in my unit who sat around for a year while they fought a waiver battle and it turned out he didn't need one after all. That's why this forum is great. When I was going through Al Gore was still "inventing" the internet and all we had was going to MPF and asking to see the reg and then begging for phone numbers. Now if you sift through this forum it's a virtual reg itself!

I knew when I did my physical that I'd have to just piss off everyone and make phone calls and email to keep it on track and they still $#%^&* it up! It will always be that way. I'm on my seasoning tour right now and I thought I'd still be getting paid 15 and 30th, but they haven't gotten my new orders yet and the pay cycle closed so now that's going to get dicked up!

BUT, it is all worth it in the end. I went around the world twice in FRED, I've seen over a 100 countries and participated in every contingency starting with Desert Storm. I've seen so many kick ass things and there is still more to see. I got out for two years (my clearance was still active) and as a flyer that is death. I had to fight to get my aeronautical order recut, but the first flight in a 130 and it was all worth it. I've lost per diem because of stupid finance haters, I've battled maintenance, had stagnant promotion since I got in the career field, but after being out two years and watching the news and seeing my buddies doing tsunami relief and getting targeted in the desert I missed the action and watching from outside the fence sucks!!!

Remember that there are eight AD and reserve squadrons fighting for slots and that BFE and fundies is not mated to individual frames so it jacks up the flow. I promise you if you love responsibility and being in the middle of the action you will not be disappointed even though they jack you around. Westover is a good unit and they fly a lot of great stuff.

I cannot stress enough to those of you just starting your career that this is like when you were a baby. Are you still traumatized by memories when you where six months old (if you were there is another forum for that I'm sure)? You won't remember this five years from now when your pinning a seventh oak leaf cluster on that air medal and laughing about some story involving an irish pub, a blow up sheep and a really drunk 130 crew!!!

EKss
12-08-2009, 06:40 PM
Sheet Metal huh, well good thing you are getting away from it or you would probably be going to the wonderful world of LO. What base are you from? When did you get approved?

I just pcs'd to dyess in june and no thanks on LO.
I had the same time line as you, got status 5 on oct 5th and just got my assignment rip on friday and look forward to meeting you in school

imported_ANALYST
12-08-2009, 06:46 PM
I just pcs'd to dyess in june and no thanks on LO.
I had the same time line as you, got status 5 on oct 5th and just got my assignment rip on friday and look forward to meeting you in school

The world of LO is great.....behind a desk of course. I am a LO Analyst. I went from resetting passwords and providing the Mx world with award and EPR stats to analyzing paint(well that is what I will refer too it as). Well, you are lucky when it comes to driving to school. It will be a long journey for me, but I drove from here to Sheppard for school. Whats a couple more hours. Sure thing man, let us(the forum) know if you need anything.

xboomer
12-08-2009, 07:07 PM
Sorry that your having a rough time xboomer, but it's not the reserves or the AF's fault. I've been there and I've seen others get it worse than you. There is a guy in my unit who sat around for a year while they fought a waiver battle and it turned out he didn't need one after all. That's why this forum is great. When I was going through Al Gore was still "inventing" the internet and all we had was going to MPF and asking to see the reg and then begging for phone numbers. Now if you sift through this forum it's a virtual reg itself!

I knew when I did my physical that I'd have to just piss off everyone and make phone calls and email to keep it on track and they still $#%^&* it up! It will always be that way. I'm on my seasoning tour right now and I thought I'd still be getting paid 15 and 30th, but they haven't gotten my new orders yet and the pay cycle closed so now that's going to get dicked up!

BUT, it is all worth it in the end. I went around the world twice in FRED, I've seen over a 100 countries and participated in every contingency starting with Desert Storm. I've seen so many kick ass things and there is still more to see. I got out for two years (my clearance was still active) and as a flyer that is death. I had to fight to get my aeronautical order recut, but the first flight in a 130 and it was all worth it. I've lost per diem because of stupid finance haters, I've battled maintenance, had stagnant promotion since I got in the career field, but after being out two years and watching the news and seeing my buddies doing tsunami relief and getting targeted in the desert I missed the action and watching from outside the fence sucks!!!

Remember that there are eight AD and reserve squadrons fighting for slots and that BFE and fundies is not mated to individual frames so it jacks up the flow. I promise you if you love responsibility and being in the middle of the action you will not be disappointed even though they jack you around. Westover is a good unit and they fly a lot of great stuff.

I cannot stress enough to those of you just starting your career that this is like when you were a baby. Are you still traumatized by memories when you where six months old (if you were there is another forum for that I'm sure)? You won't remember this five years from now when your pinning a seventh oak leaf cluster on that air medal and laughing about some story involving an irish pub, a blow up sheep and a really drunk 130 crew!!!

I appreciate the words and the encouragement, I really do. However when the AF or the Reserves say nothing is wrong with the way things are going, or they feel it is not their fault then nothing gets fixed or improves. In business it's called continuous improvement and if you don't do it then prepare to lock the doors.

And yes, the stories about being with a great crew and the things that occurred is exactly why I have stuck it out so far. Being in the middle of everything and playing a big role in current world events makes the job even better. On several occasions I have had ABC/NBC world news, Air Force Times and the local news stations on board during Air Refueling missions.

I am just extremely frustrated with what was said at the beginning, and what they are telling me now.

PS; It must have been a long lonely TDY in Ireland. But as they say, what goes TDY stays TDY.

imported_TJC78
12-08-2009, 07:34 PM
You won't remember this five years from now when your pinning a seventh oak leaf cluster on that air medal

I have a feeling I won't be getting many of those as a UH-1N FE in a DV transport unit. :(

imported_ANALYST
12-08-2009, 08:03 PM
I have a feeling I won't be getting many of those as a UH-1N FE in a DV transport unit. :(

Did you have Helos as your first choice?

Jot
12-08-2009, 10:40 PM
I have a question for Reserve Flight Engineers: If you had a break in between BFE and IQT what did your unit do? Did they keep you on orders or did you have to return to your civilian employer (if you were employed) ?

Luckily, my dates lined up real well. My unit is going to put me on one order, from Fundies though SERE.

BFE starts next day after Fundies, after BFE I have a two week break before going to Dobbins, then a week and a half break before going to SERE. Then Prog Tour starts about a week after SERE is done.

However, they did tell me that I lucked up with the absolute best case scenario, so your mileage may vary...

jdogg2
12-08-2009, 11:16 PM
i know ive read it in the past but does anyone know the perdiem rates at Lackland?

I looked it up and its seems kinda high, $183 but maybe im looking at it wrong...

xboomer
12-08-2009, 11:45 PM
i know ive read it in the past but does anyone know the perdiem rates at Lackland?

I looked it up and its seems kinda high, $183 but maybe im looking at it wrong...

From what I have read and what I know is you do NOT want to stay at Lackland you want the per diem rate at Kelly which is higher around $68 a day. I may be off by a few bucks.

imported_ANALYST
12-08-2009, 11:47 PM
I think that is the lodging rate. The last time I looked it up, it was 63 bucks.

JENNYTHING
12-09-2009, 01:38 AM
I think that is the lodging rate. The last time I looked it up, it was 63 bucks.

It's $66 if you stay on Kelly, due to the fact there is no chow hall. It is only $12 a day for Lackland. Also bonus points for Kelly is on the weekend your away from all the BMT graduation madness!!! :cool:

imported_tmckinley
12-09-2009, 02:07 AM
Congrats to everyone who has gotten class dates for Fundies and BFE!!!
For those still in the process dont get discouraged, the process takes time. I know it sucks waiting but it will be worth it.
Advice for everyone that is going to fundies and BFE: STUDY! STUDY! STUDY! You will learn alot in the class. Get together with each other and form a study group, it works. And if you think you study alot in BFE just wait I graduated BFE in July and now I am waiting for IQT, I start in Feburary. I am already in the books learning systems and everything else I can. But it is worth it. Good luck to everyone and if you have any questions ask there are a lot of people on this forum that can answer your questions or point you in the right way.

daftcon
12-09-2009, 02:49 AM
i'm reading about everyone putting down cv-22's for their first picks. anyone who's recently graduated bfe, are they even offering that as an option. i graduated in january of this year and it wasn't even offered. just curious if that has since changed.

fallenight
12-09-2009, 11:40 AM
well i hit Status 3 yesterday so here we go come on status 5.

imported_TJC78
12-09-2009, 11:58 AM
Did you have Helos as your first choice?

Nope, I was hoping for KC-10s or C-5s, but I'm cool with UH-1s. It was pretty low on my list but after giving it a lot of thought, I'm not disappointed or anything.


i'm reading about everyone putting down cv-22's for their first picks. anyone who's recently graduated bfe, are they even offering that as an option. i graduated in january of this year and it wasn't even offered. just curious if that has since changed.

They recently changed it. I graduated from BFE back in August and they weren't offering CV-22s yet, but a guy in my shop started BFE in October and he was able to get it as his first pick.

imported_ANALYST
12-09-2009, 01:26 PM
I have a feeling I won't be getting many of those as a UH-1N FE in a DV transport unit. :(

Hey man, dont sell your self short. DV's love giving out things to people who help them. The Chief of Staff gave out coins for performing a fod check on his vehicle. They might not be medals but, it is still a source of encouragement. Imagine the important people you will transport and have their lives and well being in your hands. Just my two cents.

imported_ANALYST
12-09-2009, 01:28 PM
[QUOTE=TJC78;310549]Nope, I was hoping for KC-10s or C-5s, but I'm cool with UH-1s. It was pretty low on my list but after giving it a lot of thought, I'm not disappointed or anything.

I am shooting for C-130s, KC-10's or C-5's, but I will accept what ever I get. Im sure there will be time to go to another A/C as time goes on.

imported_ANALYST
12-09-2009, 01:33 PM
Congrats to everyone who has gotten class dates for Fundies and BFE!!!
For those still in the process dont get discouraged, the process takes time. I know it sucks waiting but it will be worth it.
Advice for everyone that is going to fundies and BFE: STUDY! STUDY! STUDY! You will learn alot in the class. Get together with each other and form a study group, it works. And if you think you study alot in BFE just wait I graduated BFE in July and now I am waiting for IQT, I start in Feburary. I am already in the books learning systems and everything else I can. But it is worth it. Good luck to everyone and if you have any questions ask there are a lot of people on this forum that can answer your questions or point you in the right way.

I feel slow at this time, I just realized I could have answered all these post in one reply. I have a question, if you are having trouble with any of the BFE stuff. Is it easy enough to explain to someone or does it require a more hands on approach. In english, can it be explained through a PM to someone?

StevenW135
12-09-2009, 02:32 PM
Still no class dates....

imported_ANALYST
12-09-2009, 02:37 PM
Still no class dates....

If they say you have dates, see if they can call down to retraining and get them to produce.

alcorh
12-09-2009, 02:44 PM
Anyone who graduated from TX already have any problems with not getting the full perdiem from the Kelly side? I head down there first week in Jan and want to make sure i do everything i can to make sure i can cash in on the cash lol. Already have a room reserved for the 3 months on Kelly. Any info would be greatly apprieciated.

imported_TJC78
12-09-2009, 03:13 PM
Hey man, dont sell your self short. DV's love giving out things to people who help them. The Chief of Staff gave out coins for performing a fod check on his vehicle. They might not be medals but, it is still a source of encouragement. Imagine the important people you will transport and have their lives and well being in your hands. Just my two cents.

I'm not complaining. I think it's going to be an awesome experience, I'm just not going to be collecting any air medals since I won't be deploying anywhere.


I feel slow at this time, I just realized I could have answered all these post in one reply. I have a question, if you are having trouble with any of the BFE stuff. Is it easy enough to explain to someone or does it require a more hands on approach. In english, can it be explained through a PM to someone?

Some of the stuff in BFE is easy to learn, especially if you're coming from a maintenance background. It really depends on what you're having problems with whether it would be easy to explain in a PM. The thing that gets most people is attention to detail, as has been said many times in here. You really have to pay attention to your block values and make sure you're on the right charts. It might take some time, but the more you do it, the better you get at it. Just keep at it and you should be fine.


Anyone who graduated from TX already have any problems with not getting the full perdiem from the Kelly side? I head down there first week in Jan and want to make sure i do everything i can to make sure i can cash in on the cash lol. Already have a room reserved for the 3 months on Kelly. Any info would be greatly apprieciated.

Apparently some people are having problems with this. The only problem I had was that my orders originally had me at Lackland, even though I made reservations at Kelly. Formal Training told me they couldn't amend my orders until I got back. Finance tried to give me a little crap at first, but it got worked out. All you need is the paper they give you at Kelly saying there is no dining facility, if your finance tries to give you shit, I would take it to your Shirt and/or CC.

TheDude
12-10-2009, 09:54 PM
Your orders are gonna say that your at Lackland and that government meals are provided--- Kelly obviously has a higher per diem rate ($54) opposed to Lackland's per diem ($13)- but I will tell you this... the receipt you get from Kelly says plain as day "Kelly Inn- Lackland AFB"... so take it for what it's worth

CV22FE
12-12-2009, 12:01 AM
New guy here. I am in AGE right now

imported_ANALYST
12-12-2009, 02:49 AM
New guy here. I am in AGE right now in Guam but recently got my crosstraining approved and if you couldn't tell by my username I will be assigned to the Osprey. I am excited and can't wait to get started in June. Hopefully I can help others out as I have been a lurker on here for a while now.

Welcome to the thread, I was also a 'lurker' at one point and decided to join to get specific information. Have you been on the CEA COP? they have a slide show on the CV-22 Flight Engineer.

CV22FE
12-12-2009, 01:50 PM
yea its pretty awesome. I look at it like once a week haha

imported_ANALYST
12-12-2009, 02:39 PM
yea its pretty awesome. I look at it like once a week haha

Hey, if you search out some key words in the COP. You can find a lot of good stuff. There is a lot of information on just about every A/C.

alcorh
12-13-2009, 05:22 PM
Does anyone know if there are still FE positions in Alaska?

imported_ANALYST
12-13-2009, 06:32 PM
Does anyone know if there are still FE positions in Alaska?

Yes, there are E-3's at Elmo.

Max Power
12-13-2009, 07:09 PM
Yes, there are E-3's at Elmo.

Not for noob FE's.

alcorh
12-13-2009, 09:36 PM
Not for noob FE's.

how many hours do you need to get on E-3s?

Max Power
12-13-2009, 09:45 PM
how many hours do you need to get on E-3s?

On E-3 you can go to Tinker for your first assignment. After you've done your time there you may have the chance to go to another E-3 assignment.

imported_ANALYST
12-13-2009, 11:00 PM
Not for noob FE's.

Oh, okay. Thanks for setting things straight. I looked up the af.mil and saw Elmo had E-3's.

alcorh
12-14-2009, 04:08 AM
can someone confirm blues.. is it only on monday or mondays and fridays? heard both

Max Power
12-14-2009, 04:17 AM
can someone confirm blues.. is it only on monday or mondays and fridays? heard both

Whatever it says on the ETCA website is what you'll wear.

BigBaze
12-14-2009, 04:52 AM
can someone confirm blues.. is it only on monday or mondays and fridays? heard both


remember you are going to be on Lackland, in AETC with all these trainees and tech school kids running around..:) you are most likely going to be wearing blues both those days

FrkyMnky1487
12-14-2009, 05:07 AM
Well it seems the more information I find out the more questions I end up having.

Just found on on Fri that I will be going back to the sand trap in July. I am in the process of getting my class 3 done so it will be, most liikely Feb before my package even gets put in. I am wondering, if everything goes smoothly on my end and I get everything submitted on time, what are my chances of getting a FY10 class date? I actually want to go on this trip as I can use the extra money and I know the FY11 dates drop late spring, so if I wait until the new list comes out can I ask to get a class date after I get back or will I just have to take what I get, all assuming that I make it that far.

Gunner7
12-14-2009, 01:10 PM
Well it seems the more information I find out the more questions I end up having.

Just found on on Fri that I will be going back to the sand trap in July. I am in the process of getting my class 3 done so it will be, most liikely Feb before my package even gets put in. I am wondering, if everything goes smoothly on my end and I get everything submitted on time, what are my chances of getting a FY10 class date? I actually want to go on this trip as I can use the extra money and I know the FY11 dates drop late spring, so if I wait until the new list comes out can I ask to get a class date after I get back or will I just have to take what I get, all assuming that I make it that far.

You are actually applying for a FY 10 class seat that can start between 1 Oct 2009 and Sep 2010. If you get to see the Doc before the deployment you can finish the process from the deployed location.

nman8119
12-15-2009, 12:18 PM
can someone confirm blues.. is it only on monday or mondays and fridays? heard both

You wear blues on Monday's only now!! I'm down here and you were on Mondays!!! also you have to have ribbons and badges on your blues...

xboomer
12-17-2009, 01:04 AM
Anyone start BFE on February 26th?

onyx
12-17-2009, 01:57 AM
So I was trying to get my medical records from central records at the clinic and they said they couldnt give them to me because it wasnt on my orders and I needed to get them amended so I could get them... but they gave me a copy of my 1042. Do i need my medical records?

fallenight
12-17-2009, 02:40 AM
So I was trying to get my medical records from central records at the clinic and they said they couldnt give them to me because it wasnt on my orders and I needed to get them amended so I could get them... but they gave me a copy of my 1042. Do i need my medical records?

you should just need your TDY records your 1042 and your 422 from the way I understand it.

Golther
12-17-2009, 02:53 AM
Anyone start BFE on February 26th?

I start fundies on the 26th of feb.

BigBaze
12-17-2009, 04:39 AM
So I was trying to get my medical records from central records at the clinic and they said they couldnt give them to me because it wasnt on my orders and I needed to get them amended so I could get them... but they gave me a copy of my 1042. Do i need my medical records?


I brought them when I came and they said they didn't need them, all they cared about was the 1042, both to start the course and to go through the altitude chamber at Randolph in Block 2 of EAUC

EKss
12-17-2009, 10:10 AM
How far in advance should I make reservations for Kelly Inn

Golther
12-17-2009, 02:23 PM
I already made mine and I don't start till Feb 26th.

YaKkO
12-17-2009, 03:23 PM
I already made mine and I don't start till Feb 26th.

Hey I start Fundies on the 26th also man. You in the other forums too?

Golther
12-17-2009, 03:24 PM
Hey I start Fundies on the 26th also man. You in the other forums too?

Nope just this one.

YaKkO
12-17-2009, 03:27 PM
Nope just this one.

What you do over at Luke?

YaKkO
12-17-2009, 03:41 PM
also did you et reservations at Lackland or kelley? I did lackland cause I just dunno if I wanna deal with the fucks at finance?

Golther
12-17-2009, 03:49 PM
also did you et reservations at Lackland or kelley? I did lackland cause I just dunno if I wanna deal with the fucks at finance?

I made mine at Kelly. I have already been fighting with my whole squadron on every thing about me leaving. I can deal with finance.

YaKkO
12-17-2009, 04:02 PM
I made mine at Kelly. I have already been fighting with my whole squadron on every thing about me leaving. I can deal with finance.

yeah I had too also. But me being FTA they had to let me go. :D

Golther
12-17-2009, 04:04 PM
yeah I had too also. But me being FTA they had to let me go. :D

I'm a FTA but I did an exception to policy for retraining early. My flight chief all they way up to my commander told me no and I should wait another 2 years when I was in my window, but AFPC said yes!

YaKkO
12-17-2009, 04:17 PM
I'm a FTA but I did an exception to policy for retraining early. My flight chief all they way up to my commander told me no and I should wait another 2 years when I was in my window, but AFPC said yes!

yeah thats cause you didnt need an exception to policy. You can "Officially" x-train to a undermanned career field and at the time 1A1X1 was one of em at half your enlistment.

I didnt do one.

Also It sounds like youve been in as long as me. When did you grad tech school?

imported_ANALYST
12-17-2009, 04:19 PM
YaKko, I see you found the forum. This one provides you answers really quick without all the extra involved.
Welcome.

Golther
12-17-2009, 04:22 PM
yeah thats cause you didnt need an exception to policy. You can "Officially" x-train to a undermanned career field and at the time 1A1X1 was one of em at half your enlistment.

I didnt do one.

Also It sounds like youve been in as long as me. When did you grad tech school?

Well it still was a ETP just for the fact that I wasn't in my window. I finished tech school April of '07.

imported_ANALYST
12-17-2009, 04:24 PM
How far in advance should I make reservations for Kelly Inn

I made my reservations for Kelly. I know I am early, but it is good to get it out the way. Let me know if you need any information.

YaKkO
12-17-2009, 08:50 PM
Well it still was a ETP just for the fact that I wasn't in my window. I finished tech school April of '07.

That's what I thought. I graded in April also lol

JENNYTHING
12-17-2009, 10:31 PM
I brought them when I came and they said they didn't need them, all they cared about was the 1042, both to start the course and to go through the altitude chamber at Randolph in Block 2 of EAUC


They do the altitude chamber in block 3 now of Fundamentals. I was in the last class that did it in block 2. It has to do witht the sensor operators going through fundies, and not needing to complete the chamber.

alcorh
12-17-2009, 11:58 PM
how many blocks are in fundies and BFE?

alcorh
12-17-2009, 11:59 PM
who is all headin to fundies on Jan 8 and BFE on Jan 29?

BHibbert80
12-18-2009, 04:23 AM
Hey there....brand new to the forums. Been following thread a bit since I started looking into retraining. Been a crew chief for 7 yrs now. Just got an FE job on 130s with the Guard... First class date is 29May. Which is a loooooong way away it seems

onyx
12-18-2009, 04:27 AM
who is all headin to fundies on Jan 8 and BFE on Jan 29?

MEEEEEeeeee!!!!!

Spunjah413
12-18-2009, 04:38 AM
Hey there....brand new to the forums. Been following thread a bit since I started looking into retraining. Been a crew chief for 7 yrs now. Just got an FE job on 130s with the Guard... First class date is 29May. Which is a loooooong way away it seems

It'll be here befor you know it. Goodluck!

imported_ANALYST
12-18-2009, 11:54 AM
Hey there....brand new to the forums. Been following thread a bit since I started looking into retraining. Been a crew chief for 7 yrs now. Just got an FE job on 130s with the Guard... First class date is 29May. Which is a loooooong way away it seems

Yeah, my fundies start in Apr. The time will really pass.

imported_TJC78
12-18-2009, 02:30 PM
how many blocks are in fundies and BFE?

3 for Fundies, 9 for BFE.

xCHICOx
12-18-2009, 05:33 PM
Hey there....brand new to the forums. Been following thread a bit since I started looking into retraining. Been a crew chief for 7 yrs now. Just got an FE job on 130s with the Guard... First class date is 29May. Which is a loooooong way away it seems

At least its not 30 July like mine :D Your date will be here before you know it!

BHibbert80
12-18-2009, 06:25 PM
anybody in the guard that has school dates coming up soon?

xboomer
12-19-2009, 12:12 AM
anybody in the guard that has school dates coming up soon?

I am in the Reserves and have a BFE date of Feb 26th.

BHibbert80
12-19-2009, 01:32 AM
right on...just curious on the differences and delays with guard/reserve vs. active duty on school dates and such. people were talking about info on school dates in vMPF....my unit told me guard guys won't see any info in vMPF

StevenW135
12-19-2009, 10:51 PM
Well finally got my class dates..I go to Fundamentals 26 FEB, BFE 18 MAR. See some of you guys there.

xboomer
12-20-2009, 12:20 AM
right on...just curious on the differences and delays with guard/reserve vs. active duty on school dates and such. people were talking about info on school dates in vMPF....my unit told me guard guys won't see any info in vMPF

I guess it all depends on the individual and the circumstances that they fall under. I started the process back in April of last year and just received my school date for February 26th. However, when I interviewed for the position two other individuals from the Wing also interviewed and they are already well on their way thru BFE. My flight physical was lost for 13 weeks and my security clearance documents also got screwed up for over 13 weeks. So in all 26+ weeks were wasted before they could even request school dates.

Good luck and stay on top of what is going on. You will probably be told its coming and to be patient, but you will know when something is not right. The only way I got things resolved was with my Section Chief.

BHibbert80
12-20-2009, 08:38 PM
good deal....thanks for the heads up. I'm stoked about going to a section of only 13 FE's at this guard base. Coming from a section of about 80 crew chiefs. It seems like they take care of their own at this new base i'm at and people are on the phone and what not trying to get things done. good luck everybody!

YaKkO
12-21-2009, 05:22 PM
Okay guys with start dates of 26 Feb (I'm one of em). Correct me if I worng but are both you guys already stationed at a base with tankers? I'm just going on a hunch lol?

YaKkO
12-21-2009, 05:23 PM
Also when can expect SERE dates to drop.

imported_TJC78
12-21-2009, 06:47 PM
Also when can expect SERE dates to drop.

I wouldn't be too concerned about getting SERE dates right now. Depending on what airframe you get assigned to, they may or may not change in BFE.

alcorh
12-21-2009, 06:54 PM
I wouldn't be too concerned about getting SERE dates right now. Depending on what airframe you get assigned to, they may or may not change in BFE.

What week do you find out what airframe your goin to in BFE?

JENNYTHING
12-21-2009, 07:32 PM
What week do you find out what airframe your goin to in BFE?

It was block 5 for me, also found out my SERE dates at the same time. :cool:

xboomer
12-21-2009, 07:44 PM
Okay guys with start dates of 26 Feb (I'm one of em). Correct me if I worng but are both you guys already stationed at a base with tankers? I'm just going on a hunch lol?

Good hunch, I was until I went civilian for a few years. You start fundies Feb 26th if I am not mistaken, I am starting BFE on the 26th. I get to pass fundies since I already have a 1AXXX on my rip sheet. I am sure we will run into each other in the halls. See you there.

YaKkO
12-22-2009, 11:57 AM
Good hunch, I was until I went civilian for a few years. You start fundies Feb 26th if I am not mistaken, I am starting BFE on the 26th. I get to pass fundies since I already have a 1AXXX on my rip sheet. I am sure we will run into each other in the halls. See you there.

ohh okay I thought you started Fundies on the 26th. Gotcha. But yeah man see ya round.

imported_TJC78
12-22-2009, 03:00 PM
What week do you find out what airframe your goin to in BFE?

I believe it was the beginning of Block 4 for us. Apparently it varies somewhere between Block 3 and 5.

alcorh
12-22-2009, 04:51 PM
[QUOTE=TJC78;315322]I believe it was the beginning of Block 4 for us. Apparently it varies somewhere between Block 3 and 5.[/QUOTE


Are the blocks a set time for each or do they vary in lenth? Trying to find out when during BFE blocks 3-5 are.

Spunjah413
12-22-2009, 05:58 PM
They are schedule for a set time, but really it all depends on who your instructor is and how well your class does as a whole. If they all get it, probably alot shorter day than if they didn't.

imported_TJC78
12-22-2009, 07:11 PM
Are the blocks a set time for each or do they vary in lenth? Trying to find out when during BFE blocks 3-5 are.

There isn't a set number of days for each block. I can't remember all of them, but you can have one block that takes 1 day, and another, like Block 5, that takes 6 days. Like Spunjah said, it really depends on the instructor and if everything is "clicking" with everyone. Don't get caught up worrying about how long each block takes to try and figure out when you'll get your assignment. As you can tell, it's not the same for every class. Just take it one day at a time...trust me, you don't want to count your chickens before they hatch in this school.

StevenW135
12-22-2009, 08:17 PM
Okay guys with start dates of 26 Feb (I'm one of em). Correct me if I worng but are both you guys already stationed at a base with tankers? I'm just going on a hunch lol?

Yes I'm a FCC on the 135.

JENNYTHING
12-23-2009, 01:03 AM
There isn't a set number of days for each block. I can't remember all of them, but you can have one block that takes 1 day, and another, like Block 5, that takes 6 days. Like Spunjah said, it really depends on the instructor and if everything is "clicking" with everyone. Don't get caught up worrying about how long each block takes to try and figure out when you'll get your assignment. As you can tell, it's not the same for every class. Just take it one day at a time...trust me, you don't want to count your chickens before they hatch in this school.


Agreed. They where dead set on getting my class to graduate before Thanksgiving, so every block for our class was faster than normal. The longest we spent on any block was 4 days and that was block 5.

Spunjah413
12-23-2009, 02:46 AM
Yeah we had a rare class (0 test fails and 0 wash backs), and I want to say we got 1 Day off and we would have graduated a day early if one my classmates family hadn't bought a ticket to attend the graduation the day after.

alcorh
12-23-2009, 05:38 AM
how many people are in each class?

YaKkO
12-23-2009, 01:24 PM
Yeah we had a rare class (0 test fails and 0 wash backs), and I want to say we got 1 Day off and we would have graduated a day early if one my classmates family hadn't bought a ticket to attend the graduation the day after.

I'm sorry but I dont understand how a class full of prior service individuals that dont have a fail is rare. When you choose to cross-train I dont undertstand how you wouldnt spend everywaking moment studying or getting help on info you dont understand. I dont wanna jinx myself but when Ive been waiting the past 3 years for this job you can bet your ass I wont go down easy lol.

What I just wanna know is these ppl that fail out. Is it a case of laziness? Motivation? Retardation?!?

Skunk Face
12-23-2009, 03:02 PM
While BFE isn't hard... it isn't for everyone. In my class we had a Tech. who just couldn't do the math fast enough.... he could do it but just not in the time allotted. Also for some folks TOLD can be a bitch.

imported_TJC78
12-23-2009, 03:09 PM
how many people are in each class?

Again, it varies. My class was fairly large according to the instructors. If I remember correctly, we started with 10, lost 1 and gained 2 in Block 3, then lost 2 in Block 5 (or something like that).


I'm sorry but I dont understand how a class full of prior service individuals that dont have a fail is rare. When you choose to cross-train I dont undertstand how you wouldnt spend everywaking moment studying or getting help on info you dont understand. I dont wanna jinx myself but when Ive been waiting the past 3 years for this job you can bet your ass I wont go down easy lol.

What I just wanna know is these ppl that fail out. Is it a case of laziness? Motivation? Retardation?!?

Your guess is as good as mine. My motivation was there was no way in hell I was going back to maintenance. Some people apparently would rather drink every night, or they just don't have the attention to detail required. The material itself isn't that hard to comprehend, but poor attention to detail will kick you in the nuts when computing TOLD data. If you've even just skimmed through this thread at all, I'm sure you've seen this is the main cause of failures.

alcorh
12-23-2009, 04:57 PM
Thanks for all the info. I have read this entire thread in the last few months. When i think of a question and I know the answer is already posted in here, but for some reason i cant find the page that its on 238 pages with 10ish replies on each page. there is alot of good info here. Only reason i was askin so much cause i got a week and a half left before i make my way down to TX and i didnt want to get down there and forget something. To make sure i got everything i need, Ill be bringing my 1042, 422, PT gear, blues, and ABUs. Already made rez at Kelly inn hoping to get the full perdiem for the 66 days there. If i am missing something can someone enlighten me.

Again thanks for all the good info on this thread..

imported_CV22chief
12-23-2009, 05:18 PM
I'm sorry but I dont understand how a class full of prior service individuals that dont have a fail is rare. When you choose to cross-train I dont undertstand how you wouldnt spend everywaking moment studying or getting help on info you dont understand. I dont wanna jinx myself but when Ive been waiting the past 3 years for this job you can bet your ass I wont go down easy lol.

What I just wanna know is these ppl that fail out. Is it a case of laziness? Motivation? Retardation?!?

Our class only had one test fail and no wash backs, the guy knew what he was doing, just attention to detail got him. I think most people fail due to the TOLD data in block 5. Its alot of info and if you dont understand the interpulation concept or fail to pay attention to detail, you will probably fail. The math in block three might confuse you at first but for me once we were studying for the test, it all just came together. I think the people who fail out are either partying too much, not paying attention or studying, or just can't get the concepts they are teaching. In my opinion, most failures come from people just not getting it or just not quick enough. Study hard and practice, practice, practice!! oh yeah and don't forget to to study with your class mates!...thats what kept me motivated

StevenW135
12-23-2009, 09:19 PM
The pass score is 80% isn't? Also what kind of math should I brush up on before I go. We compute weight and balance in my current job all the time just wondering if there is anything differnt for TOLD.

imported_TJC78
12-23-2009, 09:37 PM
The pass score is 80% isn't? Also what kind of math should I brush up on before I go. We compute weight and balance in my current job all the time just wondering if there is anything differnt for TOLD.

The minimum passing score for all aircrew career fields is 85%. Score between 80-85, they let you retest the next day. Score below 80, you get washed back. If you're used to doing W&B in your current job, you should be good. You'll learn all the formulas for everything, the main thing is making sure you make the right conversions (such as statute miles to nautical miles, gallons to pounds, etc.

Skunk Face
12-23-2009, 09:38 PM
The only thing you might want to brush up on is long division.... but there isn't really anything tricky.

StevenW135
12-23-2009, 10:06 PM
The minimum passing score for all aircrew career fields is 85%. Score between 80-85, they let you retest the next day. Score below 80, you get washed back. If you're used to doing W&B in your current job, you should be good. You'll learn all the formulas for everything, the main thing is making sure you make the right conversions (such as statute miles to nautical miles, gallons to pounds, etc.

Sweet. So it's almost the same as what I do everyday. I'm a flying cc on the 135. Do alot of converting. Thanks man.

xboomer
12-23-2009, 10:20 PM
The minimum passing score for all aircrew career fields is 85%. Score between 80-85, they let you retest the next day. Score below 80, you get washed back. If you're used to doing W&B in your current job, you should be good. You'll learn all the formulas for everything, the main thing is making sure you make the right conversions (such as statute miles to nautical miles, gallons to pounds, etc.

Some where in this thread there is a link to AFM 51-9 which I believe is what they previously used in BFE. I had asked if someone could find out from an instructor if it is still relevant but I did not get a response back. If any one can check that would be great, but anyways it has great information about the math that is used by flight engineers and many other things such as weight and balance, aerodynamics, aircraft performance and so on. If you can not find it let me know and I will try and get it to you.

Sorry copied the wrong quote. This is for Stevenw135. I guess this is what they mean by paying attention to the details.

StevenW135
12-23-2009, 10:37 PM
Some where in this thread there is a link to AFM 51-9 which I believe is what they previously used in BFE. I had asked if someone could find out from an instructor if it is still relevant but I did not get a response back. If any one can check that would be great, but anyways it has great information about the math that is used by flight engineers and many other things such as weight and balance, aerodynamics, aircraft performance and so on. If you can not find it let me know and I will try and get it to you.

Sorry copied the wrong quote. This is for Stevenw135. I guess this is what they mean by paying attention to the details.

Yeah I got the 51-9 and now I got a few example TOLD cards. I thought I was going to Phease the other day but we flew to Bangor instead. It sucked cold!!!! But the Salty Dog always has great beer! Was gonna send you msg if I did.

xboomer
12-23-2009, 10:43 PM
How are the potato queens holding out during the cold weather up in Bangor?

alcorh
12-24-2009, 12:38 AM
So is the 51-9 still something to read before headin down there or is it out of date?

xboomer
12-24-2009, 01:18 AM
So is the 51-9 still something to read before headin down there or is it out of date?

From what I have been told is that it is NOT what they are using but is relevant to the course. But I could be dead wrong also. Although, I have found it to be interesting reading and I would say it can't hurt.

YaKkO
12-24-2009, 03:16 AM
Our class only had one test fail and no wash backs, the guy knew what he was doing, just attention to detail got him. I think most people fail due to the TOLD data in block 5. Its alot of info and if you dont understand the interpulation concept or fail to pay attention to detail, you will probably fail. The math in block three might confuse you at first but for me once we were studying for the test, it all just came together. I think the people who fail out are either partying too much, not paying attention or studying, or just can't get the concepts they are teaching. In my opinion, most failures come from people just not getting it or just not quick enough. Study hard and practice, practice, practice!! oh yeah and don't forget to to study with your class mates!...thats what kept me motivated

Pretty much exactly what I figured lol. Hopefully with the mindset that Im going in there with it wont be a prob for me cause I'll be damned if I ever lay a finger on a MQ-1 again lol.

Btw when he said brush up on long division do you mean paper and pen long division lol?? Cause If thats the case I really do need to brush up. Its been a good 5 years since Ive had to do that. Stupid Calculators :rolleyes:

dub13
12-24-2009, 05:12 AM
Btw when he said brush up on long division do you mean paper and pen long division lol?? Cause If thats the case I really do need to brush up. Its been a good 5 years since Ive had to do that. Stupid Calculators :rolleyes:



Yea it's long division with no calculator. But that is only during Aircrew Fundamentals. It's in block 2 or 3. I forgot, it's been a year and a half.

But during BFE you get to use your own calculator.

YaKkO
12-24-2009, 06:29 PM
Yea it's long division with no calculator. But that is only during Aircrew Fundamentals. It's in block 2 or 3. I forgot, it's been a year and a half.

But during BFE you get to use your own calculator.

looks like I need to brush up on basic math lmao. I feel like such a re-re haha

JENNYTHING
12-25-2009, 08:01 AM
Yea it's long division with no calculator. But that is only during Aircrew Fundamentals. It's in block 2 or 3. I forgot, it's been a year and a half.

But during BFE you get to use A calculator.

They will give you a calculator in the beginning of Block 3 and you hold on to, and use it until you graduate. It's the only one your allowed to use on the tests. Just wanted to throw this out there so that no one goes and buys a calculator for BFE...

Spunjah413
12-26-2009, 02:53 AM
I'm sorry but I dont understand how a class full of prior service individuals that dont have a fail is rare. When you choose to cross-train I dont undertstand how you wouldnt spend everywaking moment studying or getting help on info you dont understand. I dont wanna jinx myself but when Ive been waiting the past 3 years for this job you can bet your ass I wont go down easy lol.

What I just wanna know is these ppl that fail out. Is it a case of laziness? Motivation? Retardation?!?

Believe me, I'm with you there. I honestly do not know how people fail with the amount of pressure thats against you potentially having wasted your time and going back to whatever fail job you had to begin with. But hey, it apparently happens alot more than you think. Also you may think that all the studying in the world will help, but honestly some people are slower at comprehending some of the stuff taught...and come Block 5 you will realize that its not about memorizing terms like 80% of the coarse, but knowing how to run the charts which can be a a challenge no matter how much practice you do.

YaKkO
12-26-2009, 05:15 PM
Believe me, I'm with you there. I honestly do not know how people fail with the amount of pressure thats against you potentially having wasted your time and going back to whatever fail job you had to begin with. But hey, it apparently happens alot more than you think. Also you may think that all the studying in the world will help, but honestly some people are slower at comprehending some of the stuff taught...and come Block 5 you will realize that its not about memorizing terms like 80% of the coarse, but knowing how to run the charts which can be a a challenge no matter how much practice you do.

yeah that's with everything. there's always a learning curve. Thanks for the info guys.

StevenW135
12-27-2009, 07:18 PM
Jennything-are you a cc down at tinker? I have a few friends that were at Grandforks now there. I also was in Vegas when that one accident happened.

JENNYTHING
12-28-2009, 08:13 PM
Jennything-are you a cc down at tinker? I have a few friends that were at Grandforks now there. I also was in Vegas when that one accident happened.

I'm actually SF at Tinker right now... just riding out the rest of my time till I can get out of here and start C-5 FEIQ :cool:

YaKkO
12-28-2009, 08:31 PM
Is FEB yet?

xboomer
12-28-2009, 11:01 PM
I'm actually SF at Tinker right now... just riding out the rest of my time till I can get out of here and start C-5 FEIQ :cool:

Do you have a date for C5 FEIQ?

JENNYTHING
12-29-2009, 04:01 AM
Do you have a date for C5 FEIQ?

Date is April 1st... why does it still seem oh so far away??? I know in hindsight it's not that far off it just seems like it is.

YaKkO
12-29-2009, 04:05 AM
Date is April 1st... why does it still seem oh so far away??? I know in hindsight it's not that far off it just seems like it is.

I don't think I will ever no matter what the excuse is understand why the training pipeline is over a year from start to end. I have this feeling that if someone pulled there heads outta there asses it could be done much quicker. Cause I dunno bout all you but I don't like to have my life in limbo mode.

xboomer
12-29-2009, 01:46 PM
I don't think I will ever no matter what the excuse is understand why the training pipeline is over a year from start to end. I have this feeling that if someone pulled there heads outta there asses it could be done much quicker. Cause I dunno bout all you but I don't like to have my life in limbo mode.

I agree with everything you have to say!

imported_ANALYST
12-29-2009, 03:04 PM
Date is April 1st... why does it still seem oh so far away??? I know in hindsight it's not that far off it just seems like it is.

Yeah, my journey begins April 2nd and it too feels far off. Well at least you are already in the door. How is it hanging out at your old job while you wait?

c5engineer
12-29-2009, 05:47 PM
I don't think I will ever no matter what the excuse is understand why the training pipeline is over a year from start to end. I have this feeling that if someone pulled there heads outta there asses it could be done much quicker. Cause I dunno bout all you but I don't like to have my life in limbo mode.

That's because you think you are the only one attempting to cross train. It's not like crew chief or SF school where you can have a huge class. Plenty of weapons and spots on the firing range, or an aircraft that 20 people can crawl on. On the other hand, 130's had six people per class compared to two people for C-5's. Each class takes six months to finish and they are stacked about every 13 days because of simulator availability. There are only four sims and two CPT's available and there are also pilot classes as well as navigator classes that use the simulator differently and don't incorporate an engineer in at that point. So short of shitting out more simulators there is no way to cross train the numbers that are being accepted in a single year.

There are six squadrons alone at Little Rock. Then add in the other active duty units at Pope, Patrick, Hurlburt etc. then add the tens of squadrons in the guard and reserve. Also, the Coasties train with us and the Marines train their loadmasters with us. You should research the stats for Little Rock as far as number of students processed.

Then there are other airframes with smaller training units such as the KC-10. They don't have huge numbers of sims. Ask Baze how many were in his FTU. Therefore, lots of people sit at their units waiting on dates. I applied for dates in January of 09 and got a school date by late May. Someone else might put in after you and get a date tomorrow. It depends on how your training manager requests it and what goes on between now and then.

It's all automated now and it will still take a C-5 engineer over a year to get through everything. I don't know of any crew position where the individual comes in and immediately goes to school and is upgraded in six months.

I understand the frustration many of you feel and I'm not saying that the process doesn't have some serious issues, but as far as school dates go for FIQ/FMQ you can only shove one engineer at a time (two for 5's) in a simulator and since you don't have more than four for 130's and two for 5's and I'm assuming one or two for 10's your not going to have more than 140 people processed through 130 flt engineer training a year even though maybe 200 are approved for cross training. I know we're four engineers short in my squadron and I've seen others that are half manned. If we had a couple of retirements/seperations we wouldn't be fully manned for more than two years by way of school dates.

Good luck.

xboomer
12-29-2009, 06:13 PM
Westover has a flight sim, why not send people to their home unit to get IQ'ed? From what I have been told is that Kelly can not generate enough sorties (C5) due to poor maintenance, thats why classes are backed up for C5 IQ. Once again from what I am being told.

YaKkO
12-29-2009, 06:48 PM
Westover has a flight sim, why not send people to their home unit to get IQ'ed? From what I have been told is that Kelly can not generate enough sorties (C5) due to poor maintenance, thats why classes are backed up for C5 IQ. Once again from what I am being told.

If that was the reason them someone needs to light a fire under productions asses.

BigBaze
12-29-2009, 11:02 PM
That's because you think you are the only one attempting to cross train. It's not like crew chief or SF school where you can have a huge class. Plenty of weapons and spots on the firing range, or an aircraft that 20 people can crawl on. On the other hand, 130's had six people per class compared to two people for C-5's. Each class takes six months to finish and they are stacked about every 13 days because of simulator availability. There are only four sims and two CPT's available and there are also pilot classes as well as navigator classes that use the simulator differently and don't incorporate an engineer in at that point. So short of shitting out more simulators there is no way to cross train the numbers that are being accepted in a single year.

There are six squadrons alone at Little Rock. Then add in the other active duty units at Pope, Patrick, Hurlburt etc. then add the tens of squadrons in the guard and reserve. Also, the Coasties train with us and the Marines train their loadmasters with us. You should research the stats for Little Rock as far as number of students processed.

Then there are other airframes with smaller training units such as the KC-10. They don't have huge numbers of sims. Ask Baze how many were in his FTU. Therefore, lots of people sit at their units waiting on dates. I applied for dates in January of 09 and got a school date by late May. Someone else might put in after you and get a date tomorrow. It depends on how your training manager requests it and what goes on between now and then.

It's all automated now and it will still take a C-5 engineer over a year to get through everything. I don't know of any crew position where the individual comes in and immediately goes to school and is upgraded in six months.

I understand the frustration many of you feel and I'm not saying that the process doesn't have some serious issues, but as far as school dates go for FIQ/FMQ you can only shove one engineer at a time (two for 5's) in a simulator and since you don't have more than four for 130's and two for 5's and I'm assuming one or two for 10's your not going to have more than 140 people processed through 130 flt engineer training a year even though maybe 200 are approved for cross training. I know we're four engineers short in my squadron and I've seen others that are half manned. If we had a couple of retirements/seperations we wouldn't be fully manned for more than two years by way of school dates.

Good luck.


Sure I will fill in my 2 cents on the KC10. There are only 2 bases that have the -10, Travis and McGuire with 2 active and 2 reserve squadrons apiece. The sim course or Initial Qual is taught by FlightSafety contractors. You will have a 3 week Pre Course then roll right into Initial Qual. You will go through with a pilot and a copilot, with whom you will do all your sims with. They will break of with their IP for their classes and you will be one on one with your FE instructor. After 20 sims or so you will get a sim check, upon which you will roll over over to the Flying Training Unit or FTU, which is run by various Air Force instructors. When I went through FTU we had about 5 people going through, but it is getting more and more. Since all the training is at McGuire or Travis you will be PCSed there right after BFE/SERE etc, depending on which one you get assigned to. Since we do the training at home station it flows a lot faster then the C130 or C5 since we do not have the insane amount of students like the Herc or the MC rates like the C5.

imported_ANALYST
12-30-2009, 12:40 AM
Sure I will fill in my 2 cents on the KC10. There are only 2 bases that have the -10, Travis and McGuire with 2 active and 2 reserve squadrons apiece. The sim course or Initial Qual is taught by FlightSafety contractors. You will have a 3 week Pre Course then roll right into Initial Qual. You will go through with a pilot and a copilot, with whom you will do all your sims with. They will break of with their IP for their classes and you will be one on one with your FE instructor. After 20 sims or so you will get a sim check, upon which you will roll over over to the Flying Training Unit or FTU, which is run by various Air Force instructors. When I went through FTU we had about 5 people going through, but it is getting more and more. Since all the training is at McGuire or Travis you will be PCSed there right after BFE/SERE etc, depending on which one you get assigned to. Since we do the training at home station it flows a lot faster then the C130 or C5 since we do not have the insane amount of students like the Herc or the MC rates like the C5.

MC rates...I calculate all of those rates everyday. There is a guy that used to be stationed here that should be in KC-10 IQT right about now.

turbotyme7
12-30-2009, 02:17 AM
how's it goin, i'm not a total noob to this forum, i've been following for approx 2months now and decided to post. I just went status 3 last wed, and i have a few questions about the PCS'ing.

When do you actually report to your first base/assignment, with respect to the training process? I am aware that some people are going back to there last duty station waiting for FIQ, but is that the norm or are there people reporting to their base right after BFE/SERE? (besides KC-10 guys)

Also how often does is this career field PCS to another base/airframe. My current job doesn't PCS much but we do TDY alot.

Im a FTA if that helps any, looking for 130's, kc-10's or even better c-5's. also thanks for the 240+ pages they def. helped alot

Spunjah413
12-30-2009, 02:58 AM
how's it goin, i'm not a total noob to this forum, i've been following for approx 2months now and decided to post. I just went status 3 last wed, and i have a few questions about the PCS'ing.

When do you actually report to your first base/assignment, with respect to the training process? I am aware that some people are going back to there last duty station waiting for FIQ, but is that the norm or are there people reporting to their base right after BFE/SERE? (besides KC-10 guys)

Also how often does is this career field PCS to another base/airframe. My current job doesn't PCS much but we do TDY alot.

Im a FTA if that helps any, looking for 130's, kc-10's or even better c-5's. also thanks for the 240+ pages they def. helped alot

After all your training is done (BFE, SERE, Parachuting, etc) you will either head to your airframes training base, or PCS there depending on your circumstances (such as KC-10's stay at their base after their training, or such as myself where I am on 130's and stationed here in Little Rock, so I just stay here after school is done). If you are lucky FIQ should start soon after your BFE/SERE, but if you are unlucky like some C-5 guys and so on you will just head back to your home base and await your FIQ school start date. As for TDY/PCS its hard to say. It really depends on what airframe you get and where you are stationed. I would expect a good handful of TDY's and Deployments, but PCS's are always hard to predict.

fallenight
12-30-2009, 04:11 PM
hey i went status 5 awaiting class dates on the 18th when should i get my renlistment done after the class dates are loaded or can i do it now thank you for the help laterz.

c5engineer
12-30-2009, 04:50 PM
Westover has a flight sim, why not send people to their home unit to get IQ'ed? From what I have been told is that Kelly can not generate enough sorties (C5) due to poor maintenance, thats why classes are backed up for C5 IQ. Once again from what I am being told.

As a former engineer with the 68th AS at Kelly I can tell you that it's not the planes breaking all the time. There are two squadrons there. One is an active flying squadron and the other is the school house. They happen to share planes at the moment although the FTU has priority. When you do 47 gear cycles and 35 touch and go's every day the 5 isn't a happy plane. It doesn't have the gear that a 130 does. Again, sim availability is really what dictates class size and flow. They can stack you up out of academics and then it's the FTU's problem so they have no control over what's happening in the flying phase. Once I left academics all the instructors did was track my progress.

As for doing it at home, even Baze went through an FTU environment at home and then seasoned with his unit. The 5 initial qual is nothing. The meat of your training will be in FMQ which you accomplish with a line instructor. The nice thing is when you upgrade you'll know what the hell your doing versus what I just went through in 130's. I flew my first NVG triple airdrop tac line last night and with only 60 hours in the herk I never felt so behind an aircraft in my life. Normal tac stuff was always fine, but I'd never done a racetrack to a third drop. I upgraded with 30 hours in the 130 I upgraded with 293 in the 5.

In the herk world they just throw you to the wolves. Look what the inexperienced engineer did on the Balad crash. Listen to the tapes and if you know what your listening to he doesn't have a clue yet he went through lockheed's superb training at Little Rock.

5's have never been given any priority with maintenance. Also, when we switched from Kelly to Lackland AD f'd everything up. Our maintenance guys weren't even allowed to have light bulbs in bulk stored on the aircraft. I wish you luck and I"m not trying to be harsh, but there are a ton of factors that go into actual school house operation. IMO you AD guys going through portal and VMPF and dealing with pencil necks are getting hosed on several fronts.

I've gone through two school houses and what took the longest was getting there. After that it's all gravy as long as you work your ass off and want to be in the career field.

alcorh
01-01-2010, 05:40 PM
Quick question..
I was reading the print out from the ETCA website about fundies and its saying I need to bring my AF Form 1042 and a SF 88. I leave on Tuesday the 5th for fundies and does anyone know what that SF88 is?
As im sure everyone else is also but my unit is off till Monday so wanted to see if anyone know what that is or if it is really needed before then so i can get it first thing Monday if needed.

I have a current 1042 and 422 but not a sf 88

BHibbert80
01-01-2010, 07:19 PM
SF88 is your security clearance form I believe. Been 7 years since I filled one out, but I think that's it EDIT. // after further searching, I thinks its just a med eval sheet........Numerics on the sec. clearance paperwork are similar I think. sorry bout that, I tried.

alcorh
01-01-2010, 07:36 PM
SF88 is your security clearance form I believe. Been 7 years since I filled one out, but I think that's it EDIT. // after further searching, I thinks its just a med eval sheet........Numerics on the sec. clearance paperwork are similar I think. sorry bout that, I tried.

So do I need to get one? Or do I just need the 1042 and 422? If I do need one, where do ya get it? hospital or security manager?

bcoco14
01-01-2010, 07:47 PM
So do I need to get one? Or do I just need the 1042 and 422? If I do need one, where do ya get it? hospital or security manager?

The SF 88 is part of your medical clearance. I recieved one when I got the print out of my approved class 3 from public health.

alcorh
01-01-2010, 08:01 PM
The SF 88 is part of your medical clearance. I recieved one when I got the print out of my approved class 3 from public health.

ok thanks for the info. didnt recieve one so gonna check with public health on monday

Jot
01-01-2010, 11:20 PM
ok thanks for the info. didnt recieve one so gonna check with public health on monday

alcorh, some clinics use DD 2808 instead of the SF 88 (see link below). Either one is good, just make sure it's stamped "MEDICALLY QUALIFIED FOR FLYING DUTY, CLASS III".

http://www.dtic.mil/whs/directives/infomgt/forms/eforms/dd2808.pdf

Freelancer
01-02-2010, 03:23 PM
That SF88 is a general physical and mental clearance to go into SERE training. I wouldn't even worry about it before heading out to Fundies and BFE since it'll expire long before you even make it to SERE. It's a quick 15 minute QA session with the flight doc and can be done at Lackland right before you head out to Fairchild. You just need to remember that you are going to need the version from the SERE course's website and not the general form from E-PUBs.

TheDude
01-04-2010, 02:54 PM
That SF88 is a general physical and mental clearance to go into SERE training. I wouldn't even worry about it before heading out to Fundies and BFE since it'll expire long before you even make it to SERE. It's a quick 15 minute QA session with the flight doc and can be done at Lackland right before you head out to Fairchild. You just need to remember that you are going to need the version from the SERE course's website and not the general form from E-PUBs.

If push comes to shove, you can always swing by Flight Medicine at your base, and they can do it for you... that's if you get to go back to your base after you graduate BFE/go to Fairchild- that's what I had to do...

alcorh
01-04-2010, 03:44 PM
Ill catch up with all the people who start fundies on friday. Im heading to texas tomorrow morning. 1300 miles and counting..

kenton
01-04-2010, 04:40 PM
I'll see you down there as well. Thx for asking about the sf88, I forgot about that one. Lol

imported_ANALYST
01-04-2010, 08:44 PM
Ill catch up with all the people who start fundies on friday. Im heading to texas tomorrow morning. 1300 miles and counting..

Yeah, I have 1388 in April. Looking forward to it, drive safe man.

fallenight
01-04-2010, 11:33 PM
Well ill be going in April as well went status 6 over the break and have my rip now class date for fund is april 16 i have about 626 miles to get there got to get my car fixed up though lol.

onyx
01-05-2010, 02:31 AM
i leave Wednesday for the drive to Lackland. See you guys there. What are you guys wearing on friday? Blues or BDU's?

alcorh
01-05-2010, 02:40 AM
i leave Wednesday for the drive to Lackland. See you guys there. What are you guys wearing on friday? Blues or BDU's?

Ill see ya there, the ETCA website says its ABU/BDU tues-fri and Blues on Mondays only. So im wearing ABUs

Freelancer
01-05-2010, 04:08 AM
Reporting instructions that I last saw stated that your first day there at the auditorium will be in blues regardless. I don't know why or anything but I would call down to the school house if you have any questions about anything. I leave here the 21st of this month and can't wait. My unit has already issued me my -1 and I could freaking chock a C-5 fast taxing with this damn thing. Thought I pulled my shoulder while walking back from the squadron to billeting holding onto that damn thing! :D

alcorh
01-05-2010, 04:36 AM
Reporting instructions that I last saw stated that your first day there at the auditorium will be in blues regardless. I don't know why or anything but I would call down to the school house if you have any questions about anything. I leave here the 21st of this month and can't wait. My unit has already issued me my -1 and I could freaking chock a C-5 fast taxing with this damn thing. Thought I pulled my shoulder while walking back from the squadron to billeting holding onto that damn thing! :D

Ive read the entire printout for fundies and didnt see anything about first day in blues, but just to be sure ill call down there tomorrow to confirm. I dont want to be "that guy" who didnt get the memo lol

YaKkO
01-05-2010, 07:19 PM
Reporting instructions that I last saw stated that your first day there at the auditorium will be in blues regardless. I don't know why or anything but I would call down to the school house if you have any questions about anything. I leave here the 21st of this month and can't wait. My unit has already issued me my -1 and I could freaking chock a C-5 fast taxing with this damn thing. Thought I pulled my shoulder while walking back from the squadron to billeting holding onto that damn thing! :D

they gave you aircrew equipment before you go to fundies/BFE?

TheDude
01-05-2010, 10:44 PM
they gave you aircrew equipment before you go to fundies/BFE?

Don't worry... you don't anything except for yourself, your uniforms and your medical stuff.

Freelancer
01-06-2010, 12:49 AM
Don't worry too much about it. Since I was overseas, I have already PCSed to my gaining unit and know what airframe I'll be on. They are very interested in doing all they can to help you get graduated so they issued my -1(flight manual) so I can study it on the side prior to heading out to class and during what off time I have there.

Soon2beexloadtoad
01-06-2010, 04:44 AM
Ive read the entire printout for fundies and didnt see anything about first day in blues, but just to be sure ill call down there tomorrow to confirm. I dont want to be "that guy" who didnt get the memo lol

I was in the first class to not have to wear blues on the first day (Friday). They changed the ETCA website while I was driving down here to San Antonio. I was that guy! I showed up in blues. You can now show up in ABU/BDU on Friday.

Freelancer
01-06-2010, 02:28 PM
I was in the first class to not have to wear blues on the first day (Friday). They changed the ETCA website while I was driving down here to San Antonio. I was that guy! I showed up in blues. You can now show up in ABU/BDU on Friday.

Yay! :) That's better news to be sure. Seemed kinda retarded to go for the first day in blues on a Friday when it wasn't some hard requirement. Then again, a lot of the guys here thought it was weird that the first day is on a Friday. Guess they used to be start dates on Monday.

TheDude
01-06-2010, 05:18 PM
I was in the first class to not have to wear blues on the first day (Friday). They changed the ETCA website while I was driving down here to San Antonio. I was that guy! I showed up in blues. You can now show up in ABU/BDU on Friday.

Good to see they changed the ETCA down there... that's something we murdered on the survey we took after graduation-- people in our class had like 3 different reporting instructions, so naturally there was some confusion. Make sure you give the instructors down there some feedback on the stuff you liked and stuff that you feel could be improved- the instructors are pretty good about making changes so that things run smoother for the people that take the course after you.

YaKkO
01-06-2010, 06:02 PM
hey what the address for the ETCA website agian? Can't find it anywhere???

YaKkO
01-06-2010, 06:02 PM
nvm, im a re-re its on my RIP lol.

onyx
01-07-2010, 05:31 AM
So i'm here at Kelly. Got my room after 12 hours driving. getting ready for some sleep.

bcoco14
01-07-2010, 05:55 AM
Well I am ecstatic to say that after countless emails and phone calls and just being a good old pain in the neck I have finally gone status 6. I was originally denied yesterday but after a well placed e-mail 24 hrs later I got my class dates. I start fundies 2 April!

Just a tip for some that might read this IF your really want it don't take no for an answer there are people out there that will help you get where you want to be if your willing to do what you have to do to get there.

Now that I got that out of my system I know this school is no picnic and I am now only granted the opportunity to prove I have what it takes to be an FE. There's still a long road ahead but I am positive that in the end it will all be worth it.

turbotyme7
01-07-2010, 07:36 AM
hey what the address for the ETCA website agian? Can't find it anywhere???

https://etca.randolph.af.mil gotta be from a .gov computer

xCHICOx
01-07-2010, 02:06 PM
So i'm here at Kelly. Got my room after 12 hours driving. getting ready for some sleep.

Good luck.....keep us posted.

TheDude
01-07-2010, 05:28 PM
Well I am ecstatic to say that after countless emails and phone calls and just being a good old pain in the neck I have finally gone status 6. I was originally denied yesterday but after a well placed e-mail 24 hrs later I got my class dates. I start fundies 2 April!

Just a tip for some that might read this IF your really want it don't take no for an answer there are people out there that will help you get where you want to be if your willing to do what you have to do to get there.

Now that I got that out of my system I know this school is no picnic and I am now only granted the opportunity to prove I have what it takes to be an FE. There's still a long road ahead but I am positive that in the end it will all be worth it.

You're right, it is no picnic, but as long as you apply yourself, you will be fine! Good luck!

bcoco14
01-07-2010, 05:48 PM
You're right, it is no picnic, but as long as you apply yourself, you will be fine! Good luck!

Thanks I plan on staying in the books.

alcorh
01-07-2010, 11:15 PM
So i'm here at Kelly. Got my room after 12 hours driving. getting ready for some sleep.

I just arrived at Kelly inn as well. room sucks but could be worse i guess. Just got done exploring the base... damn this place is huge... Onyx what wing are you in at Kelly? Did you go find the school house yet? I did but I drove through Lackland and through Lackland training annex finally finding it off in some corner lol. Wonder if there is a shorter way.. I'm assuming you start fundies tomorrow morning (jan8). If so what time are you gonna leave Kelly. We gotta be there at 7am. let me know

imported_ANALYST
01-07-2010, 11:17 PM
Well I am ecstatic to say that after countless emails and phone calls and just being a good old pain in the neck I have finally gone status 6. I was originally denied yesterday but after a well placed e-mail 24 hrs later I got my class dates. I start fundies 2 April!

Just a tip for some that might read this IF your really want it don't take no for an answer there are people out there that will help you get where you want to be if your willing to do what you have to do to get there.

Now that I got that out of my system I know this school is no picnic and I am now only granted the opportunity to prove I have what it takes to be an FE. There's still a long road ahead but I am positive that in the end it will all be worth it.

Hey, guess I will be seeing you in April.

JENNYTHING
01-07-2010, 11:41 PM
I just arrived at Kelly inn as well. room sucks but could be worse i guess. Just got done exploring the base... damn this place is huge... Onyx what wing are you in at Kelly? Did you go find the school house yet? I did but I drove through Lackland and through Lackland training annex finally finding it off in some corner lol. Wonder if there is a shorter way.. I'm assuming you start fundies tomorrow morning (jan8). If so what time are you gonna leave Kelly. We gotta be there at 7am. let me know

Fastest way to get from the Kelly Inn to Forbes Hall is to take SW 36th ST to US-90 W. Take 90 until the Hunt LN/ Ray Ellison Dr exit. Take the Hunt LN exit toward Ray Ellison (First Right on the frontage road), turn right at Hunt Ln then its a right onto Ray Ellison Blvd . Ray Ellison will take you to the gate. I would recommend using the truck gate in the morning it's faster than using the main gate. It never took me longer than 15 min to get to class in the morning. And it's just as fast going home. :D

xboomer
01-08-2010, 12:11 AM
I just arrived at Kelly inn as well. room sucks but could be worse i guess. Just got done exploring the base... damn this place is huge... Onyx what wing are you in at Kelly? Did you go find the school house yet? I did but I drove through Lackland and through Lackland training annex finally finding it off in some corner lol. Wonder if there is a shorter way.. I'm assuming you start fundies tomorrow morning (jan8). If so what time are you gonna leave Kelly. We gotta be there at 7am. let me know

I have to make my reservations for Kelly in the next few days. I was told that there are differences in the quality of the rooms depending on what wing you stay in. Can someone give me an idea which one I should request? Anyone starting BFE Feb 26th?

Thanks

JENNYTHING
01-08-2010, 12:23 AM
I have to make my reservations for Kelly in the next few days. I was told that there are differences in the quality of the rooms depending on what wing you stay in. Can someone give me an idea which one I should request? Anyone starting BFE Feb 26th?

Thanks


D Wing is where its at!!! :cool: I'm just kidding, thats where I stayed at when I was down there. I didn't see too much of a difference in the rooms based on what wing you were in, some rooms are small others are huge! I had a middle sized one. I do think D wing was the most convenient as far as parking went though...

alcorh
01-08-2010, 12:41 AM
Fastest way to get from the Kelly Inn to Forbes Hall is to take SW 36th ST to US-90 W. Take 90 until the Hunt LN/ Ray Ellison Dr exit. Take the Hunt LN exit toward Ray Ellison (First Right on the frontage road), turn right at Hunt Ln then its a right onto Ray Ellison Blvd . Ray Ellison will take you to the gate. I would recommend using the truck gate in the morning it's faster than using the main gate. It never took me longer than 15 min to get to class in the morning. And it's just as fast going home. :D

Jenny thanks for the info. I just did a dry run at it and took like 20 minz off the trip rather than goin through the bases. Only thing is I didnt see a truck gate? I did see a gate before the main gate(what i believe is the main gate) on the right side of Ray Ellison, but it was closed and there wasnt any signs saying anything. Im guessing thats what your referring to as the Truck gate. Ill see if its open in the morning when i head that way.

alcorh
01-08-2010, 12:48 AM
D Wing is where its at!!! :cool: I'm just kidding, thats where I stayed at when I was down there. I didn't see too much of a difference in the rooms based on what wing you were in, some rooms are small others are huge! I had a middle sized one. I do think D wing was the most convenient as far as parking went though...

Thats funny, I just checked into the D wing. sucks tho cause im on the 3rd floor of 3 floors. I havent found the best place to park if you say its the best for parking. Im parking in front of the registration office and have to walk down a few halls. The lady told me that i could park in the back by ALS but said that i cant use that door back there during the week. Its for ALS students only she said.

Im in a decent size room but only thing that really sucks is that you have to share a bathroom with the room next door. I tried to get one where you get ur own bathroom but the lady at the desk said I dont have a high enough rank... said you have to be an E-7 or higher to get those unless the rest are of the rooms are full. Unfortunatly they have alot of open rooms right now which sucks but hey, who can complain about making $61 a day for 3 months.(hopefully). not this guy

JENNYTHING
01-08-2010, 12:54 AM
Jenny thanks for the info. I just did a dry run at it and took like 20 minz off the trip rather than goin through the bases. Only thing is I didnt see a truck gate? I did see a gate before the main gate(what i believe is the main gate) on the right side of Ray Ellison, but it was closed and there wasnt any signs saying anything. Im guessing thats what your referring to as the Truck gate. Ill see if its open in the morning when i head that way.

NP. Yes that was the truck gate I'm not sure of it's hours of operations, but I do know it was open long enough to go on and off of base that way for class and even lunch break.


Thats funny, I just checked into the D wing. sucks tho cause im on the 3rd floor of 3 floors. I havent found the best place to park if you say its the best for parking. Im parking in front of the registration office and have to walk down a few halls. The lady told me that i could park in the back by ALS but said that i cant use that door back there during the week. Its for ALS students only she said.

Im in a decent size room but only thing that really sucks is that you have to share a bathroom with the room next door. I tried to get one where you get ur own bathroom but the lady at the desk said I dont have a high enough rank... said you have to be an E-7 or higher to get those unless the rest are of the rooms are full. Unfortunatly they have alot of open rooms right now which sucks but hey, who can complain about making $61 a day for 3 months.(hopefully). not this guy

I parked in the ALS parking lot. They didn't get to class before I left in the morning, and were all out of class most days by the time I got back to the hotel. There is another door back there that you can go in and out of, I just used the ALS one though... I was never told otherwise... Plus it was never locked so it was more convenient ... But the other door is easy enough too.

xboomer
01-08-2010, 12:57 AM
Thats funny, I just checked into the D wing. sucks tho cause im on the 3rd floor of 3 floors. I havent found the best place to park if you say its the best for parking. Im parking in front of the registration office and have to walk down a few halls. The lady told me that i could park in the back by ALS but said that i cant use that door back there during the week. Its for ALS students only she said.

Im in a decent size room but only thing that really sucks is that you have to share a bathroom with the room next door. I tried to get one where you get ur own bathroom but the lady at the desk said I dont have a high enough rank... said you have to be an E-7 or higher to get those unless the rest are of the rooms are full. Unfortunatly they have alot of open rooms right now which sucks but hey, who can complain about making $61 a day for 3 months.(hopefully). not this guy

Sounds like heaven compared to where Flight Engineer Training used to be (Altus,Ok). Boom's and Flt Eng shared the same building and we had 1 community bath room for the entire floor. I had to go buy my own TV since the one in my room didn't work and they were not going to replace it. That place sucked and should have been condemned

alcorh
01-08-2010, 01:07 AM
Jenny, Ahh so we actually get a lunch? someone said the time was so short that you really coundnt go anywhere to grab some food. Is that accurate? when i drove by forbs hall i saw a chow hall right down the hill. Are TDY students athorized to eat there?

alcorh
01-08-2010, 01:09 AM
Sounds like heaven compared to where Flight Engineer Training used to be (Altus,Ok). Boom's and Flt Eng shared the same building and we had 1 community bath room for the entire floor. I had to go buy my own TV since the one in my room didn't work and they were not going to replace it. That place sucked and should have been condemned

eww that sucks. That reminds me of my first tech school tho at sheppard. we had 3 people to a room and a community comode down the hall that everyone had to share. life was misserable..

JENNYTHING
01-08-2010, 01:16 AM
Jenny, Ahh so we actually get a lunch? someone said the time was so short that you really coundnt go anywhere to grab some food. Is that accurate? when i drove by forbs hall i saw a chow hall right down the hill. Are TDY students athorized to eat there?

We had an hour or more each day for our lunch break (Fundies and BFE) That would be the Medina chow hall that you saw down there, and you are authorized to eat there. They have pretty decent food, but it seemed more expensive than the rest of the chow halls on Lackland. It may have just been my imagination but it always seemed like meals coasted me more there. We usually hit up one of the local restaurants (the Mexican place right outside the gate on Valley High was tasty IMO) or went back to our rooms for lunch.

onyx
01-08-2010, 01:24 AM
I just arrived at Kelly inn as well. room sucks but could be worse i guess. Just got done exploring the base... damn this place is huge... Onyx what wing are you in at Kelly? Did you go find the school house yet? I did but I drove through Lackland and through Lackland training annex finally finding it off in some corner lol. Wonder if there is a shorter way.. I'm assuming you start fundies tomorrow morning (jan8). If so what time are you gonna leave Kelly. We gotta be there at 7am. let me know

I think we are in the same hall. I'm in Delta wing. 3rd floor.

alcorh
01-08-2010, 01:27 AM
I think we are in the same hall. I'm in Delta wing. 3rd floor.

yeah same wing/floor. im chillin in D 366. guess Ill catch up with ya tomorrow. fyi names Cole

onyx
01-08-2010, 01:31 AM
D373 here ...

onyx
01-08-2010, 01:36 AM
kenton is here and we're watching the BCS champ game.

alcorh
01-08-2010, 01:37 AM
you two from the same base?

onyx
01-08-2010, 01:50 AM
kenton is from nellis. you two are from the same base. silly.

KC10
01-08-2010, 05:31 AM
Hey all;

this is my first post here; just registered after reading all 247 pages... Took me 3 days! Haha. Anyways, I'll try to keep this short since I'm posting from the flightline on my phone.

Currently a 6 status, start Aircrew Fundamentals on 16 April, and BFE right after that. My courselist does not have SERE/etc on it, but my training guy said it's normal and he'll "cut me a rip and orders when I survive Lackland.".
I've been working on this since July; you guys wouldn't believe how much crap my squadron (KC-10 mx ... As if my screename didn't make it obvious) gave me. But I finally have a class date so I am starting to see a light at the end of the tunnel.

My main question was this: I have had some sources say that I need 48 months of retainability, and some sources say that I only need 36. Which is true?
I signed up for 6, currently ~3.5 into it... DOS is 4 July 2012. I have been told that if I need 48 months of retainability, I would have to reenlist since I'm projected to graduate BFE 17 June, and can only extend 23 months. But, I am currently not in my reenlistment window... That I know of. Not sure what to do, and I only have 6 more days to "meet retainability requirements".
So this is kind of freaking me out; I'm having nightmares of showing up for class only to be sent back because of something stupid like that.

Anyone you guys would reccomend talking to? My supervision is giving me the cold shoulder so to speak, and MPF is filled with a bunch of kids who know nothing except "well, maybe try going online... Portal should have something about that...."

Thanks to BigBaze for starting the thread; I've learned a TON so far. Just hung up on how to work out this retainability stuff.

Hoping to get KC-10s. Already work on them, so shouldn't be too big of a stretch. Knock on wood.

If you guys need any more info, lemme know. Thanks a lot for all the answers thus far.

bcoco14
01-08-2010, 05:59 AM
Hey all;

this is my first post here; just registered after reading all 247 pages... Took me 3 days! Haha. Anyways, I'll try to keep this short since I'm posting from the flightline on my phone.

Currently a 6 status, start Aircrew Fundamentals on 16 April, and BFE right after that. My courselist does not have SERE/etc on it, but my training guy said it's normal and he'll "cut me a rip and orders when I survive Lackland.".
I've been working on this since July; you guys wouldn't believe how much crap my squadron (KC-10 mx ... As if my screename didn't make it obvious) gave me. But I finally have a class date so I am starting to see a light at the end of the tunnel.

My main question was this: I have had some sources say that I need 48 months of retainability, and some sources say that I only need 36. Which is true?
I signed up for 6, currently ~3.5 into it... DOS is 4 July 2012. I have been told that if I need 48 months of retainability, I would have to reenlist since I'm projected to graduate BFE 17 June, and can only extend 23 months. But, I am currently not in my reenlistment window... That I know of. Not sure what to do, and I only have 6 more days to "meet retainability requirements".
So this is kind of freaking me out; I'm having nightmares of showing up for class only to be sent back because of something stupid like that.

Anyone you guys would reccomend talking to? My supervision is giving me the cold shoulder so to speak, and MPF is filled with a bunch of kids who know nothing except "well, maybe try going online... Portal should have something about that...."

Thanks to BigBaze for starting the thread; I've learned a TON so far. Just hung up on how to work out this retainability stuff.

Hoping to get KC-10s. Already work on them, so shouldn't be too big of a stretch. Knock on wood.

If you guys need any more info, lemme know. Thanks a lot for all the answers thus far.

For retainablilty if you cannot extend to meet it you will have to reenlist it wont matter that your not in your window yet (not 100% on that but pretty sure). The best people to talk to would be reenlistments/extentions in the base MPF.

bcoco14
01-08-2010, 06:02 AM
Hey, guess I will be seeing you in April.

Sure will I think I saw somewhere we have the same class dates.

imported_ANALYST
01-08-2010, 12:23 PM
Sure will I think I saw somewhere we have the same class dates.

Yes sir, sure do. I guess since we raised enough hell, they put us in the April class. Well, I will be driving down. If anyone else is going to be in the April class, you can get a ride. This waiting game is even longer now, I thought I would pass the time in ALS or maybe get to go to 7-Level school. They shot me down on both of those.

TheDude
01-08-2010, 02:20 PM
Hey all;

this is my first post here; just registered after reading all 247 pages... Took me 3 days! Haha. Anyways, I'll try to keep this short since I'm posting from the flightline on my phone.

Currently a 6 status, start Aircrew Fundamentals on 16 April, and BFE right after that. My courselist does not have SERE/etc on it, but my training guy said it's normal and he'll "cut me a rip and orders when I survive Lackland.".
I've been working on this since July; you guys wouldn't believe how much crap my squadron (KC-10 mx ... As if my screename didn't make it obvious) gave me. But I finally have a class date so I am starting to see a light at the end of the tunnel.

My main question was this: I have had some sources say that I need 48 months of retainability, and some sources say that I only need 36. Which is true?
I signed up for 6, currently ~3.5 into it... DOS is 4 July 2012. I have been told that if I need 48 months of retainability, I would have to reenlist since I'm projected to graduate BFE 17 June, and can only extend 23 months. But, I am currently not in my reenlistment window... That I know of. Not sure what to do, and I only have 6 more days to "meet retainability requirements".
So this is kind of freaking me out; I'm having nightmares of showing up for class only to be sent back because of something stupid like that.

Anyone you guys would reccomend talking to? My supervision is giving me the cold shoulder so to speak, and MPF is filled with a bunch of kids who know nothing except "well, maybe try going online... Portal should have something about that...."

Thanks to BigBaze for starting the thread; I've learned a TON so far. Just hung up on how to work out this retainability stuff.

Hoping to get KC-10s. Already work on them, so shouldn't be too big of a stretch. Knock on wood.

If you guys need any more info, lemme know. Thanks a lot for all the answers thus far.

i had to go to MPF to find out what was up with retainability... they should have the reg there that tells you exactly what you have to do- if they don't, just look for the reg on e-pubs--- educate yourself, so you know what's going on and then go to MPF and make those mofos do their damn job--- don't let them claim ignorance and get off the hook easy! If they don't cough up any info for you, have them go get their supervisor and have them get you an answer--- sorry for the rant, but the majority of people at MPF piss me off, because theyre so damn lazy. As for SERE dates, you should get those dates sometime in Block 4-6, sometime in there- they'll let you know.

Gunner7
01-08-2010, 04:00 PM
Hey all;

this is my first post here; just registered after reading all 247 pages... Took me 3 days! Haha. Anyways, I'll try to keep this short since I'm posting from the flightline on my phone.

Currently a 6 status, start Aircrew Fundamentals on 16 April, and BFE right after that. My courselist does not have SERE/etc on it, but my training guy said it's normal and he'll "cut me a rip and orders when I survive Lackland.".
I've been working on this since July; you guys wouldn't believe how much crap my squadron (KC-10 mx ... As if my screename didn't make it obvious) gave me. But I finally have a class date so I am starting to see a light at the end of the tunnel.

My main question was this: I have had some sources say that I need 48 months of retainability, and some sources say that I only need 36. Which is true?
I signed up for 6, currently ~3.5 into it... DOS is 4 July 2012. I have been told that if I need 48 months of retainability, I would have to reenlist since I'm projected to graduate BFE 17 June, and can only extend 23 months. But, I am currently not in my reenlistment window... That I know of. Not sure what to do, and I only have 6 more days to "meet retainability requirements".
So this is kind of freaking me out; I'm having nightmares of showing up for class only to be sent back because of something stupid like that.

Anyone you guys would reccomend talking to? My supervision is giving me the cold shoulder so to speak, and MPF is filled with a bunch of kids who know nothing except "well, maybe try going online... Portal should have something about that...."

Thanks to BigBaze for starting the thread; I've learned a TON so far. Just hung up on how to work out this retainability stuff.

Hoping to get KC-10s. Already work on them, so shouldn't be too big of a stretch. Knock on wood.

If you guys need any more info, lemme know. Thanks a lot for all the answers thus far.


Welcome to the forum! BigBaze is a legend for starting this thing. A few references are applicable when you talk about retainability. You have the ETCA https://etca.randolph.af.mil/ which calls for 48 months of retainability, and 36-2107 which states you need 36 months for receiving advanced flight training. The ETCA seems to be out of sync with the AFI so 36 months is the right answer. You can extend for 23 months to cover the retainability needed to process for your school. As soon as you pop out of BFE with a three level, request cancelation of the extension for immediate reenlistment into your new AFS. This plan normally goes tango-uniform if you actually enter the extension which make it impossible to cancel it.

bcoco14
01-08-2010, 04:14 PM
Yes sir, sure do. I guess since we raised enough hell, they put us in the April class. Well, I will be driving down. If anyone else is going to be in the April class, you can get a ride. This waiting game is even longer now, I thought I would pass the time in ALS or maybe get to go to 7-Level school. They shot me down on both of those.

Well I tink I'll you up on the rides I'll be flying down. Unless I can gat my RA to give me a rental.

imported_ANALYST
01-08-2010, 05:15 PM
Well I tink I'll you up on the rides I'll be flying down. Unless I can gat my RA to give me a rental.

Not, a problem man. You are staying at Kelly right?

KC10
01-08-2010, 06:15 PM
Welcome to the forum! BigBaze is a legend for starting this thing. A few references are applicable when you talk about retainability. You have the ETCA https://etca.randolph.af.mil/ which calls for 48 months of retainability, and 36-2107 which states you need 36 months for receiving advanced flight training. The ETCA seems to be out of sync with the AFI so 36 months is the right answer. You can extend for 23 months to cover the retainability needed to process for your school. As soon as you pop out of BFE with a three level, request cancelation of the extension for immediate reenlistment into your new AFS. This plan normally goes tango-uniform if you actually enter the extension which make it impossible to cancel it.
Thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you.

Did I mention thank you?

The ETCA thing confused me as well. I'll be sure to let the other two guys in my squadron who are retraining to FE (one is a 6 like me, the other is 5... still waiting for dates) know this info.

Now, to figure out HOW to extend... this should be a fun day at MPF. Currently working swings on 12s (3pm-3am), so I guess I'll head in now.

//happy air power

Freelancer
01-09-2010, 02:41 AM
I ran into that very little conundrum as well. Then after talking with AFPC and looking through the reg, it says that the regs are the final word on retention. The person at the time also helping me said that if they give you any issues with it at all at the school house, to talk with MPF or AFPC immediately to clear it up. Supposedly AFPC has already sent the school house a memorandum about this.

bcoco14
01-09-2010, 06:11 AM
Not, a problem man. You are staying at Kelly right?

Well I made my reservations today and unfortunately Kelly is all booked up for most of the time we are going to be there. So they made my reservation for Gateway Inn they said its on the training side of base so maybe it will be within walking distance of the school house. I was hoping for the good per diem but oh well the important thing is I have my dates and who knows maybe between now and then Kelly will open up.

JENNYTHING
01-09-2010, 03:52 PM
Well I made my reservations today and unfortunately Kelly is all booked up for most of the time we are going to be there. So they made my reservation for Gateway Inn they said its on the training side of base so maybe it will be within walking distance of the school house. I was hoping for the good per diem but oh well the important thing is I have my dates and who knows maybe between now and then Kelly will open up.

Not withing walking distance, the school house is on the Medina Annex, but there is a shuttle that runs from Lackland to Medina. Everyone in my class would give rides to the ones that didn't have transportation. I'll be seeing you guys down there in April if your staying at Kelly, I'll be there for C-5 FEIQ.

alcorh
01-09-2010, 04:05 PM
Not withing walking distance, the school house is on the Medina Annex, but there is a shuttle that runs from Lackland to Medina. Everyone in my class would give rides to the ones that didn't have transportation. I'll be seeing you guys down there in April if your staying at Kelly, I'll be there for C-5 FEIQ.

Are they making you PCS to tx for c5 feiq? I heard a rumor if the TDY is longer than 120 days then you have to pcs instead of goin tdy. Is that accurate?

JENNYTHING
01-09-2010, 04:19 PM
Are they making you PCS to tx for c5 feiq? I heard a rumor if the TDY is longer than 120 days then you have to pcs instead of goin tdy. Is that accurate?

Not PCSing, I'm going to be TDY to Kelly for 4.5 months making that $66 a day per diem. Can't wait to get that check! The only FE school that you PCS just for training is CV-22's because they spend a year or more in school, and then you PCS to your operational squadron after words. They will also PCS you for KC-10's, E-3's and C-130's if your getting stationed at Little Rock, because they all have training squadrons at their respective bases.

p.s. I sent you an e-mail, just curious who you wound up with for you fundies instructor....

Gunner7
01-09-2010, 11:32 PM
Thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you.

Did I mention thank you?

The ETCA thing confused me as well. I'll be sure to let the other two guys in my squadron who are retraining to FE (one is a 6 like me, the other is 5... still waiting for dates) know this info.

Now, to figure out HOW to extend... this should be a fun day at MPF. Currently working swings on 12s (3pm-3am), so I guess I'll head in now.

//happy air power

You are very welcome. If I was very energetic I would find the reference in the ETCA site that stated the AFI has precedence on matters like retainability.

CV22FE
01-11-2010, 09:45 PM
The only FE school that you PCS just for training is CV-22's because they spend a year or more in school, and then you PCS to your operational squadron after words. ....

I don't even know where I am going. CV-22? what is that?

imported_SUPERSTAR
01-11-2010, 10:12 PM
True. I am PCSing to Kirtland in June. I don't even know where I am going after that.

Either Cannon or Hurlburt...I got lucky!

CV22FE
01-11-2010, 10:29 PM
Either Cannon or Hurlburt...I got lucky!

So you are going to Hurlburt?

imported_SUPERSTAR
01-11-2010, 10:54 PM
So you are going to Hurlburt?

Yeah! Good luck to you!

CV22FE
01-11-2010, 11:18 PM
Yeah! Good luck to you!

Sweet! are you at Kirland now?

imported_SUPERSTAR
01-11-2010, 11:48 PM
Sweet! are you at Kirland now?

I will be there in a couple weeks!

jav_909
01-12-2010, 03:38 AM
Hello,
just got a quick question, for those at lackland, how far would you say the walk to class, from kelly inn would be. The reason i ask, i start fundies 19Feb, and tried to make reservations at kelly inn, and the lady said the annex side far from kelly inn, she ended up booking me at the gateway inn. I am flying in from luke, i wont have much transportation, would I be better off staying at the gateway inn, or is kelly inn a reasonable walk. Thanks

onyx
01-12-2010, 04:09 AM
Hello,
just got a quick question, for those at lackland, how far would you say the walk to class, from kelly inn would be. The reason i ask, i start fundies 19Feb, and tried to make reservations at kelly inn, and the lady said the annex side far from kelly inn, she ended up booking me at the gateway inn. I am flying in from luke, i wont have much transportation, would I be better off staying at the gateway inn, or is kelly inn a reasonable walk. Thanks

Kelly is about 3 to 4 miles from the annex. Absolutely not a good walking distance. gateway Inn would be much better, or you can ride the bus.

jav_909
01-12-2010, 05:14 AM
Kelly is about 3 to 4 miles from the annex. Absolutely not a good walking distance. gateway Inn would be much better, or you can ride the bus.

Cool. Thanks alot man.

fallenight
01-12-2010, 04:46 PM
hello all school day for fundies is on the 16 apr and i got at kelly ill have wheels so should not be to bad hope to see you all there.:)

YaKkO
01-12-2010, 10:27 PM
hello all school day for fundies is on the 16 apr and i got at kelly ill have wheels so should not be to bad hope to see you all there.:)

holy cell phone post lol.

imported_CV22chief
01-12-2010, 10:37 PM
Hello,
just got a quick question, for those at lackland, how far would you say the walk to class, from kelly inn would be. The reason i ask, i start fundies 19Feb, and tried to make reservations at kelly inn, and the lady said the annex side far from kelly inn, she ended up booking me at the gateway inn. I am flying in from luke, i wont have much transportation, would I be better off staying at the gateway inn, or is kelly inn a reasonable walk. Thanks


Yeah man, thats a long walk...you dont want to do that, i would take the bus or CANCEL YOUR PLANE TICKETS AND DRIVE THERE.....three months with out a car there would definitely SUCK!!

turbotyme7
01-13-2010, 12:11 AM
Are the rooms at Kelly inn single or double. I'm aware that certain grade/ranks can get you a single in the rest of the AF, but how goes it at Kelly and the other place?


Sorry for asking this again, it was pretty difficult to find in all these pages

turbotyme7
01-13-2010, 01:27 AM
found my answer, nevermind.


Anybody else starting fundies 16 April?

imported_SUPERSTAR
01-13-2010, 02:12 AM
Are the rooms at Kelly inn single or double. I'm aware that certain grade/ranks can get you a single in the rest of the AF, but how goes it at Kelly and the other place?


Sorry for asking this again, it was pretty difficult to find in all these pages

You get your own room!

KC10
01-13-2010, 04:01 PM
found my answer, nevermind.


Anybody else starting fundies 16 April?
Me.

Also driving down (hopefully) so I'll be able to give anyone who needs it a ride to class, etc.

Only things I have to do now are:

- Figure out how to extend (my MPF is useless it seems)
- Call Kellys and make reservations for a room
- "Refresh" my 1042 - apparently they are only good for a year I heard? My 1A flight physical was good for several but I'll do it just to be safe... hopefully the Medical guys here are better than MPF.
- Make sure my GTC is active
- Prolly 12 other things I haven't thought of
- Lay low in my squadron so they don't hate me too much

TheDude
01-13-2010, 04:21 PM
Me.

Also driving down (hopefully) so I'll be able to give anyone who needs it a ride to class, etc.

Only things I have to do now are:

- Figure out how to extend (my MPF is useless it seems)
- Call Kellys and make reservations for a room
- "Refresh" my 1042 - apparently they are only good for a year I heard? My 1A flight physical was good for several but I'll do it just to be safe... hopefully the Medical guys here are better than MPF.
- Make sure my GTC is active
- Prolly 12 other things I haven't thought of
- Lay low in my squadron so they don't hate me too much

Yeah, definately make sure you lay low... I've been back at my base from SERE since November ( I don't PCS til Feb)--- I'm working in mobility til I leave... you will have people hatin' on you!

BigBaze
01-13-2010, 08:39 PM
Hey all;

this is my first post here; just registered after reading all 247 pages... Took me 3 days! Haha. Anyways, I'll try to keep this short since I'm posting from the flightline on my phone.

Currently a 6 status, start Aircrew Fundamentals on 16 April, and BFE right after that. My courselist does not have SERE/etc on it, but my training guy said it's normal and he'll "cut me a rip and orders when I survive Lackland.".
I've been working on this since July; you guys wouldn't believe how much crap my squadron (KC-10 mx ... As if my screename didn't make it obvious) gave me. But I finally have a class date so I am starting to see a light at the end of the tunnel.

My main question was this: I have had some sources say that I need 48 months of retainability, and some sources say that I only need 36. Which is true?
I signed up for 6, currently ~3.5 into it... DOS is 4 July 2012. I have been told that if I need 48 months of retainability, I would have to reenlist since I'm projected to graduate BFE 17 June, and can only extend 23 months. But, I am currently not in my reenlistment window... That I know of. Not sure what to do, and I only have 6 more days to "meet retainability requirements".
So this is kind of freaking me out; I'm having nightmares of showing up for class only to be sent back because of something stupid like that.

Anyone you guys would reccomend talking to? My supervision is giving me the cold shoulder so to speak, and MPF is filled with a bunch of kids who know nothing except "well, maybe try going online... Portal should have something about that...."

Thanks to BigBaze for starting the thread; I've learned a TON so far. Just hung up on how to work out this retainability stuff.

Hoping to get KC-10s. Already work on them, so shouldn't be too big of a stretch. Knock on wood.

If you guys need any more info, lemme know. Thanks a lot for all the answers thus far.


Welcome to the thread! If you get KC10's at McGuire, hit me up I'll give you ll the info you'll need. I am hitting about 800 hours on her since becoming mission qual last July.

turbotyme7
01-14-2010, 12:38 AM
Me.

Also driving down (hopefully) so I'll be able to give anyone who needs it a ride to class, etc.

Only things I have to do now are:

- Figure out how to extend (my MPF is useless it seems)
- Call Kellys and make reservations for a room
- "Refresh" my 1042 - apparently they are only good for a year I heard? My 1A flight physical was good for several but I'll do it just to be safe... hopefully the Medical guys here are better than MPF.
- Make sure my GTC is active
- Prolly 12 other things I haven't thought of
- Lay low in my squadron so they don't hate me too much


Yea I gotta call Kelly-Inn and get that sqaured away. Fortunately I have ALOT of tdy experience as well as my MPF, so if you have any questions let me know.

Last time I read the 48-123 it said that 1042 are only valid for a year, then must be redone on the member's birth month. It should not be a long process to like the Initial to get it redone, probably something similar to a PHA with a flight doc. I'd wait and see what big baze would have to say about that

Freelancer
01-14-2010, 02:21 AM
As stated before, when in the process of retraining, your initial flight physical is good for 2 years. They realize that you will not be doing any actual flying or boarding any aircraft anyways. It's only for the chamber. So long as your 1042 is within 2 years limit throughout your training period at Lackland, you'll be fine. When you get to your IQT course, you'll be put through another flight physical anyways. As well as when you get to your initial duty base. Each base likes to do it's own flight physical even if you had just done one at another base prior to a PCS.

bcoco14
01-14-2010, 05:32 AM
As stated before, when in the process of retraining, your initial flight physical is good for 2 years. They realize that you will not be doing any actual flying or boarding any aircraft anyways. It's only for the chamber. So long as your 1042 is within 2 years limit throughout your training period at Lackland, you'll be fine. When you get to your IQT course, you'll be put through another flight physical anyways. As well as when you get to your initial duty base. Each base likes to do it's own flight physical even if you had just done one at another base prior to a PCS.

That is correct. However there was a recent change to the AFI around Sept-Oct time frame where they are able to extend your physical out for another 12 months. My 2 yr is actually up in Feb of this year, when I went in to set up for a new one they schedualed me for a visit with the flight doc and extended me out to get me through school. So my 1042 is good untill Feb of 2011.

KC10
01-14-2010, 06:59 AM
Welcome to the thread! If you get KC10's at McGuire, hit me up I'll give you ll the info you'll need. I am hitting about 800 hours on her since becoming mission qual last July.Haha; what's funny is that I prolly know you. I've been working 10's at McGuire for a few years now. :D
McGuire is at the top of my dreamsheet; the only other base I want is Travis.


As stated before, when in the process of retraining, your initial flight physical is good for 2 years. They realize that you will not be doing any actual flying or boarding any aircraft anyways. It's only for the chamber. So long as your 1042 is within 2 years limit throughout your training period at Lackland, you'll be fine. When you get to your IQT course, you'll be put through another flight physical anyways. As well as when you get to your initial duty base. Each base likes to do it's own flight physical even if you had just done one at another base prior to a PCS.
Did not know that; thanks for letting me know (or maybe re-telling it; I did read the whole thread but after several hours on the second day of reading all the posts just kinda blurred together)




Today: Just filled out the contract generation worksheet for my extension. Showed MPF the AFI that says I need 36 months ( AFI36-2107 , Table 1.1 Block 16 for those who are curious) and gave them a copy of my RIP for proof of my retraining and they were happy with that.
I am extending for just enough so that I have 36 months after my projected graduation date from BFE; this is the right point for retainability to start, correct? The AFI was a bit confusing on WHEN it should begin.

Reason I ask is because I haven't signed the extension contract yet, and can get it changed.

bcoco14
01-14-2010, 08:05 AM
I am extending for just enough so that I have 36 months after my projected graduation date from BFE; this is the right point for retainability to start, correct? The AFI was a bit confusing on WHEN it should begin.

Reason I ask is because I haven't signed the extension contract yet, and can get it changed.

I have extended twice in my time in and your extension will begin when your current enlistment expires. So say if your enlistment ends in June, you sign your extension tomorrow and you extend 36 months, it will begin in June. Additionally you can cancel an extension before you enter it but once you enter it you are obligated to serve that time regardless of the reason for the extension.

So given the example if you start BFE in May and were to fail out in May you can cancel your extension and get out, if you start BFE in May and your extension began June 1 and fail out June 2nd then you are still obligated to complete the next 36 months in your current job.

xCHICOx
01-14-2010, 07:09 PM
Today: Just filled out the contract generation worksheet for my extension. Showed MPF the AFI that says I need 36 months ( AFI36-2107 , Table 1.1 Block 16 for those who are curious) and gave them a copy of my RIP for proof of my retraining and they were happy with that.
I am extending for just enough so that I have 36 months after my projected graduation date from BFE; this is the right point for retainability to start, correct? The AFI was a bit confusing on WHEN it should begin.
Reason I ask is because I haven't signed the extension contract yet, and can get it changed.

Just a heads up, I had to extend for 36 months as well. After that was all done I get a e-mail from a guy at HQ AETC saying that the we actually need 48 months as stated in the BFE course reporting instructions. Not saying if you do or don't but just be on the look out for that. He said individuals would not be able to proceed to IQT unless they had the 48 month retainability. Can somebody currently/recently in the pipeline verify this?